Is seminary important?

[changed_like_saul]

If God wants an educated preacher, God will call one.

Go back to my last post and click on the link about the Black Rock Address. Read it all, particularly the section on seminaries. I agree with it 100%.

I have never heard of a single seminary that really teaches Salvation by Grace. Oh yea, they may call it Salvation by Grace but, generally they include that man has to do something. i.e., accept Christ for eternal salvation. My KJV teaches Christ's finished the work God sent Him to do!!

I know most will not agree with me on this and that is okay. May Gos Bless each of you.

Changed like Saul,

Elder Chris Folsom
www.pbsermons.org

[ February 18, 2002: Message edited by: changed_like_saul ]

 

[Aaron]

Psalms 119:99 I have more understanding than all my teachers: for thy testimonies are my meditation.

 

[Mark Twain]

The Black Rock Address is very interesting and contains some surprises. One is the stand against "Protracted Meetings" which I understand must have been the same thing as camp meetings. Here is a quote from the link that will be given below it.

.."but to the principles and plans of protracted meetings, distinguishingly so called, we do decidedly object. The principle of these meetings we cannot fellowship. Regeneration, we believe, is
exclusively the work of the Holy Ghost, performed by his divine power, at his own sovereign pleasure, according to
the provisions of the everlasting covenant; but these meetings are got up either for the purpose of inducing the Holy Spirit to regenerate multitudes who would otherwise not be converted, or to convert them themselves by the machinery of these meetings, or rather to bring them into their churches by means of exciting their animal feelings, without any regard to their being born again. Whichever of these may be considered the true ground upon which
these meetings are founded, we are at a loss to know how any person who has known what it is to be born again can countenance them."

The above is from the link previously given and giving it again it is:
www.pb.org/pbdocs/blakrock.html

 

[Mark Twain]

Saul, how many Primitive Baptists are there in the world? Just curious. It seems a remarkably unusual flavor of religion, almost like the Amish.

 

[swaimj]

I think the book of Acts certainly has a pattern which would encourage higher levels of education for pastors. The original apostles of Jesus were Jewish and, at least in the book of Acts, saw their ministries confined for the most part to the Jewish world. The leaders in Gentile evangelism were men of broader education such as Paul and Apollos. From a practical standpoint, the latter two were more familiar with Gentile culture and were used by God to take the leading role in Gentile evangelism. Paul certainly showed a familiarity with pagan gentile philosophers in his sermon on Mars Hill and some who heard him there became believers. While it is true that not many wise or wealthy in worldly terms are called, some who are wise and wealthy in worldly terms are called and if they set themselves apart unto God, they are of great practical use to God in the work of evangelism and discipleship.

 

[tyndale1946]

I can't speak for Saul but I am also a Primitive Baptist and have been in the church 33 years. Primitive Baptist are the smallest group of American Baptist that I know of. What our collective number is... I can't say as I have no statistics... Brother Glen

 

[Speedpass]

About 10 years ago one of the guys who led me to the Lord was starting a pastorate in Wimberley, TX, and when I asked him if he was going to finish his MDIV since he had taken some extension courses in San Antonio, he told me "seminary is for the birds". As a footnote, he earned a master's in counselling from the same school we met at, and his church has grown significantly.

 

[changed_like_saul]

True, Primitive Baptist are few in number compared to others. that doesn't matter. what matters is God being given all the praise, glory and honor through our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

up until around 1800, baptist in this country believed the same thing. i mean the exact same thing. that is "Salvation by Grace". sometime called TULIP. man, like the Pharasees of old, began to add to the scriptures. this will always take away from glorifying God. throught out scriptures, we see where ever man added to the law, it glorified man and not God. this is the cause of the baptist split around 1830.

we see this man glorification more and more. man thinks we have to help God save people. scripture does not say that. scripture teaches in Matt 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins. no indication Christ needed my help. it's only about Jesus Christ fulfilling the will of God.

whenever we add to scripture we ALWAYS take away from God and lift up man. preachers no longer emphasize the depravity of man. most folks think there is some good in man.....and that is false. that shows people do not understand depravity. there is no good in man without God. Isaiah 64:6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. it is righteousness of Christ that God sees in the child of God. for if God looks at man without Christ, the only thing God will see is our sin!!!

seminaries teach how to save people. Christ saved His people and that is that!!!

Changed like Saul,

Elder Chris Folsom
www.pbsermons.org

[ February 20, 2002: Message edited by: changed_like_saul ]

 

[Pastor Larry]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by changed_like_saul:
seminaries teach how to save people. Christ saved His people and that is that!!!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Seminaries teach languages, systematic theology, exegesis, homiletics, and church history for the most part. I was never taught to save anybody. I was routinely reminded that God alone saves. I was also reminded of the responsibility of teachers to properly exegete the word of God.

Your caricature of seminary is most unfortunate. I do not doubt that some seminaries are as you say. However, that does not delegitimize seminaries that are doing what they are supposed to do.

 

[Circuitrider]

Seminaries are just schools!! If you take a stand against seminary training, then you have to take a stand against any schooling for bible or ministry. While I know two gifted evangelists who were self-taught students (Paul Levin, Keith Ward), they are the exeception among most Baptists(except for you Primitive men).

I value my seminary education as a specialty training in theology, biblical languages, church and Baptist history and the disciplines of homeletics, etc. I would not want to pastor the churches I have without the training of a good seminary. Does that mean that there are not some bad schools out there ....you bet. However, that does not negate the value of a good seminary education.

Sounds like some of you men are just jealous because you did not go to a good school

"And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh." Amen!!

 

[changed_like_saul]

Listen, i know i will not be able to persuade anyone about seminaries. And that's okay.

i can say this, though, seminaries are never mentioned in scriptures as a part of the new testament church. also, i believe, if a man is called of God to preach the word, God will supply him with all he needs. a King James 1611 Bible (for the english speaking), prayer and guidance by the Spirit. these are not by the seminaries, they are of God!!

Changed like Saul,

Elder Chris Folsom
www.pbsermons.org

 

[TomVols]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> i can say this, though, seminaries are never mentioned in scriptures as a part of the new testament church. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>True. But neither are church buildings, air conditioning, Sunday Schools, etc. And besides, this doesn't make them ANTI-Scriptural just because they are not found in the Scriptures.


<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> also, i believe, if a man is called of God to preach the word, God will supply him with all he needs. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Sure. But he has to use what God has given him. He has to know how to get into the Word, etc. Seminaries help teach this. You start out assuming that seminaries are not of God. You can't just assume that no more than one can assume that just because one doesn't go to a seminary one is automatically of God or not of God.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Think this thread has served its usefulness. Unless some have more to say.

I will close it at midnight Sunday night, to give anyone a last chance. As with all "closed" threads, you are welcome to pick a part of it and start a new topic.

 

[csmith]

Attending a seminary is in no way necessary to success in the ministry. The debative issue is: what is success in the ministry? Many feel that to be a successful pastor you must go to seminary. That is anti-Bible. Success is clearly set on the grounds of being spirit-filled and doctinally pure. Everything else falls in line from there. The NT apostles didn't attend seminary. The Ana-Baptists weren't the most educated on the mountainside. However, these groups lit the world on fire with the gospel because the power is in the preaching. I don't see the world on fire right now and we are educated beyond degree (no pun intended). I have a master of divinity myself, but I have enough sense to know that a local pastor can train a young man better than a seminary. No, he may not have as "broad" of an education, but it will more than likely be closer to the heart and more functional.