is The Christian under still the OT sabbath day?

[The Biblicist]

GAL.4 [8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?[10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS.[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

As the context shows, the Galatians were being led back under the OLD Covenant or Mosaic legislations. Verse 10 refers specifically to Levitus 23-25 and the feasts of Israel.

The OLD Covenant Sabbath and its Sabbatical Feasts have been abolished by the cross (Col. 2:16) and Galatians 4:10 simply reinforces that truth.

 

[The Biblicist]

A. Fact #1 - The fourth commandment IS the sabbath law. There are no other commandments in scripture to draw the Sabbath law from.

B. Fact #2 - God applies the Sabbath law to other periods of time other than the seventh day in the month but to the first day, tenth day, 50th day as well as other periods of time such as a seventh "month" and seventh "year" and 50th "year."

C. Conclusion: The interpretation of the fourth commandment cannot be restricted to the seventh day "of the week" as God's own application of the Sabbath law EXCEEDS that restrictive interpretation. To demand that restrictive of interpretation is to condemn God's own application of the same law that EXCEEDS any specific day "of the week."

The Truth is that the Sabbath law can be inclusive of the seventh day of the week but not restricted to the seventh day of the week without doing violence to the Biblical application of that law to other time periods.

You are following rabbit trails while missing the very point you asked about. Deal with the above post and point out where any weaknes exists in the above line of logic.

 

[Chowmah]

As the context shows, the Galatians were being led back under the OLD Covenant or Mosaic legislations. Verse 10 refers specifically to Levitus 23-25 and the feasts of Israel.

The OLD Covenant Sabbath and its Sabbatical Feasts have been abolished by the cross (Col. 2:16) and Galatians 4:10 simply reinforces that truth.

Nope.

GAL.4 [8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?[10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS.[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Galatians 4 says nothing about sabbaths or feast days. Its speaking of those who observe times.

DEUT.18 [9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

The same thing goes on to this very day. Its speaking of the occult. Those who observe certain days by use of horoscopes?

2 CHR.33 [3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD.[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards. Its speaking of the occult. Not following sabbath days.

LEV.19 [26] Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, NOR OBSERVE TIMES.[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a whore; lest the land fall to whoredom, and the land become full of wickedness.[30] YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

I guess this scripture says it all. You shall not observe times BUT you will keep my sabbaths.

 

[billwald]

The Sabbath is the only "commandment" that is not re-imposed in the NT.

 

[The Biblicist]

Nope.

GAL.4 [8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?[10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS.[11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

Galatians 4 says nothing about sabbaths or feast days. Its speaking of those who observe times.

DEUT.18 [9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

The same thing goes on to this very day. Its speaking of the occult. Those who observe certain days by use of horoscopes?

2 CHR.33 [3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD.[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards. Its speaking of the occult. Not following sabbath days.

LEV.19 [26] Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, NOR OBSERVE TIMES.[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a whore; lest the land fall to whoredom, and the land become full of wickedness.[30] YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

I guess this scripture says it all. You shall not observe times BUT you will keep my sabbaths.

Look at the immediate context! Paul is writing this book in response to those who want to bring believers back under the law of Moses. He is not writing to prevent them from being sucked into paganism as you attempt to interpret Galatians 4.

Colossians 2:14-16 make this clear and does use the plural "sabbaths" which Galatians 4 refers to in Leviticus 23-24 which consisted of days, months, years within the sabbatical Old Covenant System.

 

[The Biblicist]

The Sabbath is the only "commandment" that is not re-imposed in the NT.

Have you ever read Mark 2:26-27 and Hebrews 4:2-11?

 

[Chowmah]

The Sabbath is the only "commandment" that is not re-imposed in the NT.

Sure it is

HEBREWS 4 [10] For HE THAT IS ENTERED INTO HIS REST, he also hath ceased from his own works, AS GOD DID FROM HIS. [11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Well...Ya see what it says. Now lets see how God rested from His work

HEBREWS 4 [4] For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works

Yup. God rested the 7th day. Pretty simple

 

[Chowmah]

Look at the immediate context! Paul is writing this book in response to those who want to bring believers back under the law of Moses.

If what you say was true

ACTS 17 [2] AND PAUL, AS HIS MANNER WAS, went in unto them, and three SABBATH DAYS reasoned with them out of the scriptures,[3] Opening and alleging, that Christ must needs have suffered, and risen again from the dead; and that this Jesus, whom I preach unto you, is Christ.

Why was Paul keeping the sabbath? AS HIS MANNER WAS

 

[Chowmah]

You are following rabbit trails while missing the very point you asked about.

I find what you say as rather ironical. Its you who follow trails which lead to egg laying bunnies as the women weep for Tammuz

 

[Chowmah]

Look at the immediate context! Paul is writing this book in response to those who want to bring believers back under the law of Moses. He is not writing to prevent them from being sucked into paganism as you attempt to interpret Galatians 4.

Not under the 10 commandments. The book of Galatians is all about the law of circumscion. The book of Galatians is a book containing 6 very short chapters. In these 6 chapters circumcision is mentioned 16 times. The commandments are not mentioned at all. Not once. Yet, those people that wish to do away with GODS commandments use scriptures from Galatians to try and do so. The law of circumcism is one of the carnal ordinances of the law that were nailed to the cross. Those that wish to do away with Gods 10 commandments will also try and tell you that the ordinances and the ten commandments are simply parts of the law and are not separate from one another. In saying that they will point to a scripture thats speaking of circumcision and then apply that scripture to Gods 10 commandments. This is done to extreme in the book of Galatians. The scripture below separates the law, the commandments and the ordinances

2 KINGS 17 [36] But the LORD, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt with great power and a stretched out arm, him shall ye fear, and him shall ye worship, and to him shall ye do sacrifice.[37] AND the statutes, AND the ordinances, AND the law, AND the commandment, which he wrote for you, ye shall observe to do for evermore; and ye shall not fear other gods.

AND means AND

1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

And although the law of circumcision was nailed to the cross, Gods law (the 10 commandments) are to be kept.

 

[billwald]

>Have you ever read Mark 2:26-27 and Hebrews 4:2-11?

Yes. Mark was spoken to Hebrews and Hebrews was written for Jews. Jews/Hebrews are obligated by the 613 statements, not gentiles. How about a verse which specifically obligates gentiles to worship on Sunday?

Paul instructed his gentiles that, to them, all days are theologically the same. The intent is to choose one day and stay with it. The Church has always chosen The Lord's Day (Sunday) for worship. Further, if you adopt a Jewish calendar and clock, the day runs sundown to sundown thus in the winter most "Sunday" evening services are on Monday.

 

[Chowmah]

>Have you ever read Mark 2:26-27 and Hebrews 4:2-11?

Yes. Mark was spoken to Hebrews and Hebrews was written for Jews. Jews/Hebrews are obligated by the 613 statements, not gentiles. How about a verse which specifically obligates gentiles to worship on Sunday?

There is no verses which obligates gentiles to worship on sunday. However..

JOHN 10 [14] I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. [15] As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. [16] And OTHER SHEEP I HAVE, WHICH ARE NOT OF THIS FOLD: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

OTHER SHEEP I HAVE.....These “other sheep” are the gentile believers

ISAIAH 56 [1] Thus saith the Lord, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for MY SALVATION IS NEAR to come, and my righteousness to be revealed. [2] Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil. [3] Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the Lord, speak, saying, The Lord hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree. [4] For thus saith the Lord unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; [5] Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. [6] Also THE SONS OF THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; [7] Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people. [8] The Lord God which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, YET WILL I GATHER OTHERS TO HIM, beside those that are gathered unto him.

OTHER SHEEP I HAVE = YET WILL I GATHER OTHERS. As plain as the nose on my face, these “others” are keeping Gods sabbath day. They have taken hold of His covenant. No way around it. So, have “many” come in the name of Jesus and decieved many as the bible said would happen? I reckon so. You must be keeping the sabbath in order to be saved to the kingdom. No doubt about it.

 

[Chowmah]

If you dont believe the scriptures about the "others". How about us gentile "strangers"?

EPHES. 2 [11] Wherefore remember, that ye being IN TIME PAST GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands; [12] That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANTS OF PROMISE, having no hope, and without God in the world: [13] BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ. [14] For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

It was for Israel only. Was. We were once strangers from Gods covenants of promise, having no hope. BUT NOW in Christ, should we take hold of those covenants, we have hope

ISAIAH 56 [6] Also the sons of THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and TAKETH HOLD OF MY COVENANT; [7] EVEN THEM WILL I BRING TO MY HOLY MOUNTAIN, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for ALL PEOPLE.

 

[The Biblicist]

>Have you ever read Mark 2:26-27 and Hebrews 4:2-11?

Yes. Mark was spoken to Hebrews and Hebrews was written for Jews.

Not so! Mark was written under Peter's supervision and most likely at Rome for ROMANS rather than Jews.

Hebrews was written to Hebrew CHRISTIANS not unconverted Hebrews but Hebrews under the NEW COVENANT whether there is neither Jew or gentile, bond or free, male or female.

 

[The Biblicist]

If what you say was true

ACTS 17 [2] AND PAUL, AS HIS MANNER WAS, went in unto them, and three SABBATH DAYS reasoned with them out of the scriptures,[3] Opening and alleging, that Christ must needs have suffered, and risen again from the dead; and that this Jesus, whom I preach unto you, is Christ.

Why was Paul keeping the sabbath? AS HIS MANNER WAS

Here is your problem. When you get pinned to the mat and shown you are wrong about one text and context (Galations) you simply jump to another one and finally return to using the very same ones you were proven wrong - and so it is a endless merry-go-round when dealing with you.

I have rode this merry-go-round method with you several times before and it does no good to discuss anything with you because you simply start over again with the very same arguments based on the very same texts already proven wrong! You have a "seared" conscience and no amount of Biblical evidence, no amount of proving you are wrong will change your mind. I have better things to do then to play this silly game with you.

 

[Chowmah]

Here is your problem. You think youre right and the scriptures are wrong. When the scriptures pin you to the mat you simply give up and flee to play elsewhere. Quite frankly im surprise you lasted these few days.

 

[The Biblicist]

A. Fact #1 - The fourth commandment IS the sabbath law. There are no other commandments in scripture to draw the Sabbath law from.

B. Fact #2 - God applies the Sabbath law to other periods of time other than the seventh day in the month but to the first day, tenth day, 50th day as well as other periods of time such as a seventh "month" and seventh "year" and 50th "year."

C. Conclusion: The interpretation of the fourth commandment cannot be restricted to the seventh day "of the week" as God's own application of the Sabbath law EXCEEDS that restrictive interpretation. To demand that restrictive of interpretation is to condemn God's own application of the same law that EXCEEDS any specific day "of the week."

The Truth is that the Sabbath law can be inclusive of the seventh day of the week but not restricted to the seventh day of the week without doing violence to the Biblical application of that law to other time periods.

The Seventh Day of the week Sabbatarian can rant and rave but the above three principles cannot be HONESTLY overthrown.

The anti-fourth commandment person can rant and rave but the Old Covenant Sabbath is abolished (Col. 2:16) while the New Covenant Sabbath is estalished in type (Levitucs 23,25) in prophecy (Psa. 118:20-24) and in application (Mark 16:9; Acts 4:10-11; Heb. 4:1-11; Rev. 1:10).

 

[billwald]

If so then God could/should have been clearer in dictating/inspiring the NT. It would have been a simple matter for the Jerusalem Church to order Paul to teach his gentiles to obey the Ten Words or the 613 statements but God didn't because that would conflict with Peter's "Sheet" vision. God had the Apostles order Paul to teach the Noahic Covenant to his disciples.

There is no verses which obligates gentiles to worship on sunday. However..

JOHN 10 [14] I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. [15] As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep. [16] And OTHER SHEEP I HAVE, WHICH ARE NOT OF THIS FOLD: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

OTHER SHEEP I HAVE.....These “other sheep” are the gentile believers

ISAIAH 56 [1] Thus saith the Lord, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for MY SALVATION IS NEAR to come, and my righteousness to be revealed. [2] Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil. [3] Neither let the son of the stranger, that hath joined himself to the Lord, speak, saying, The Lord hath utterly separated me from his people: neither let the eunuch say, Behold, I am a dry tree. [4] For thus saith the Lord unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; [5] Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off. [6] Also THE SONS OF THE STRANGER, that join themselves to the Lord, to serve him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be his servants, every one THAT KEEPETH THE SABBATH from polluting it, and taketh hold of my covenant; [7] Even them will I bring to my holy mountain, and make them joyful in my house of prayer: their burnt offerings and their sacrifices shall be accepted upon mine altar; for mine house shall be called an house of prayer for all people. [8] The Lord God which gathereth the outcasts of Israel saith, YET WILL I GATHER OTHERS TO HIM, beside those that are gathered unto him.

OTHER SHEEP I HAVE = YET WILL I GATHER OTHERS. As plain as the nose on my face, these “others” are keeping Gods sabbath day. They have taken hold of His covenant. No way around it. So, have “many” come in the name of Jesus and decieved many as the bible said would happen? I reckon so. You must be keeping the sabbath in order to be saved to the kingdom. No doubt about it.

 

[Chowmah]

If so then God could/should have been clearer in dictating/inspiring the NT. It would have been a simple matter for the Jerusalem Church to order Paul to teach his gentiles to obey the Ten Words or the 613 statements but God didn't because that would conflict with Peter's "Sheet" vision. God had the Apostles order Paul to teach the Noahic Covenant to his disciples.

Im not following you BillWald. Conflict with Peters sheet vision? Paul did say to keep Gods commandments

 

[Chowmah]

the New Covenant Sabbath is estalished in in prophecy (Psa. 118:20-24)

Psalm 118:20-24 (KJV)
20 This gate of the LORD, into which the righteous shall enter.
21 I will praise thee: for thou hast heard me, and art become my salvation.
22 The stone which the builders refused is become the head stone of the corner.
23 This is the LORD'S doing; it is marvellous in our eyes.
24 This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

So where is this prophecy of a new covenant sabbath?