is The Christian under still the OT sabbath day?

[The Biblicist]

You have not given an answer to the FACT that the words "of the week" are not found in ANY fourth commandment reference in scripture.

So whats your point

You have not given an answer to the FACT that the Sabbath law CANNOT POSSIBLY be restricted to the Seventh day "of the week"

Ofcourse its not restricted to the 7th day. There are feast day sabbaths also. Whats your point

Sabbath law CANNOT POSSIBLY be restricted to the Seventh day "of the week" because as a matter of FACT it is applied to the first day of the week as well in Leviticus 23 as well to seventh and fithieth YEARS

Never said it was restricted to the 7th day. If one of the feast day sabbaths fall on the 1st day of the week...so be it. Whats your point

Look at your admissions above! You are admitting God can apply it to different days and that is precisely what God did under the New Covenant, he applied it to the first day of the week (Psa. 118:20-24 with Acts 4:10-11; Mk. 16:9; Heb. 4:9-11; Rev. 1:10) and you have NOTHING to prevent God from doing so by your own admissions above.

 

[convicted1]

Doesn't "Sabbath" mean rest? Jesus is our Sabbath, and we rest in Him. We are not under the Law's sabbath, but Grace's Sabbath, which is Christ Jesus, the Lord.

For "The Biblicist", do you agree with this I posted? I don't know if you saw this post of mine, or not. Thanks in advance for your response.

 

[Chowmah]

Paul always went to "the Jews FIRST" and then to the Gentiles .

Once again you needs be corrected

The reason jew 1st and then to the gentiles. The wall of partion was not down till Christ was risen. Then the gentiles could take hold of the jews covenants

EPHESIANS 2
11 Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past GENTILES in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
12 That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and STRANGERS from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13 BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath BROKEN DOWN THE MIDDLE WALL OF PARTITION between us;

THE TWELVE
Matthew 10 [5] These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, GO NOT INTO THE WAY OF THE GENTILES, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
[6] But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

PAUL
2 Timothy 1 [11] Whereunto I am appointed a preacher, and an apostle, and a teacher of the Gentiles.

PAUL AND PETER
Galatians 2
[7] But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
[8] (For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles

Its so clear that Peter and the 12 went to the Jew 1st and then Paul to the gentile. The Jew 1st and then to the gentiles

You will find scripture below in the writings of Paul but.....

ROMANS 1 [16] For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

It dont say what you say it says Biblicist

 

[Chowmah]

Look at your admissions above! You are admitting God can apply it to different days and that is precisely what God did under the New Covenant, he applied it to the first day of the week (Psa. 118:20-24 with Acts 4:10-11; Mk. 16:9; Heb. 4:9-11; Rev. 1:10) and you have NOTHING to prevent God from doing so by your own admissions above.

Lets look at one of these verses i havent already proven doesnt pertain to a new day of rest. How about Mark 16 [9]

Mark 16:9 (KJV)
9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

Tell me Biblicist, where do you see God changing His day of rest in scripture above? You must have a very vivid imagination.

 

[Chowmah]

Hi convicted 1.

2 THES. 1 [7] And to you who are troubled REST WITH US, WHEN THE LORD JESUS SHALL BE REVEALED FROM HEAVEN with his mighty angels, [8] In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

There are them that say we need not keep Gods sabbath day because we are now resting in Jesus. As you can plainly read our rest with Jesus has not yet begun. According to above scripture its when he returns. You will notice that the flaming fire of vengeance also destroys them that do not “obey” the good news.

REVELATIONS 20 [4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

Our rest with Jesus begins with the 1000 yr period of rest spoken of in Revelations. That’s soon after the flaming fire of 2Thes.1.

ISAIAH 66 [22] For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the Lord, so shall your seed and your name remain. [23] And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and FROM ONE SABBATH TO ANOTHER, SHALL ALL FLESH COME TO WORSHIP before me, saith the Lord. [24] And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Seems that even during the 1000 yr period of rest his people will still be keeping the sabbath. Jesus is the same today, yesterday and forever!

PSALMS 132 [8] Arise, O LORD, into thy rest; thou, and the ark of thy strength.[9] Let thy priests be clothed with righteousness; and let thy saints shout for joy.[10] For thy servant David's sake turn not away the face of thine anointed.[11] The LORD hath sworn in truth unto David; he will not turn from it; Of the fruit of thy body will I set upon thy throne.[12] if thy children will KEEP MY COVENANT AND MY TESTIMONY that i shall teach them, their children shall also sit upon thy throne for evermore.[13] For the LORD hath chosen Zion; he hath desired it for his habitation.[14] This is my rest for ever: here will I dwell; for I have desired it.

Arise into thy rest, this is my rest for ever. And the children of God will also enter this rest IF they keep his covenant (law) and his testimony (of Jesus).

ISAIAH 14 [3] And IT SHALL COME TO PASS in the day that THE LORD SHALL GIVE THEE REST from thy sorrow, and from thy fear, and from the hard bondage wherein thou wast made to serve, [4] That thou shalt take up this proverb against the king of Babylon, and say, How hath the oppressor ceased! the golden city ceased! [5] The Lord hath broken the staff of the wicked, and the sceptre of the rulers. [6] He who smote the people in wrath with a continual stroke, he that ruled the nations in anger, is persecuted, and none hindereth. [7] THE WHOLE EARTH IS AT REST, and is quiet: they break forth into singing.

The bottom line is... believe the scriptures over what youve been taught by your denomination. It shall come to pass in that day (verse 3) the LORD shall give thee rest. Verse 7 says at that time the whole world is at rest. All the bad guys will be gone. 2Thes.1 tells us why. Theres gonna be a fire! The whole world is not at rest at this point in time.

DEUT.12 [9] For ye are not as yet come to the rest and to the inheritance, which the LORD your God giveth you.[10] But when ye go over Jordan, and dwell in the land which the LORD your God giveth you to inherit, and when he giveth you rest from all your enemies round about, so that ye dwell in safety;

 

[Chowmah]

Scripture below says He will give you rest

MATTHEW 11 [27] All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him. [28] Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. [29] Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. [30] For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

In order to find out what rest Jesus is speaking of simply read the next verse. Keep in mind when this was written it was one continual writing. No chapters and verses.

MATTHEW 12 [1] At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn, and to eat. [2] But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day.

MATTHEW 12 [10] And, behold, there was a man which had his hand withered. And they asked him, saying, Is it lawful to heal on the sabbath days? that they might accuse him. [11] And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out? [12] How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days.

The Jews added over a hundred laws to the original sabbath commandment which made the 4th commandment more of a burden than a blessing. Jesus sets them straight in Matthew 12 on a couple of these added laws to His 4th commandment.

 

[percho]

I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things.

When that underlined takes place will those in bold, do any work on the seventh day of a seven day week?

Will those in bold do any servile work on the 15th day of the first month of the year, on the 21 day of the first month of the year, on the fiftieth day following the weekly sabbath following the 14th day of the first month of the year, on the 1st day of the seventh month of the year, on the 10th day of the seventh month of the year, on the 15th day of the seventh month of the year, and on the 23rd day of the seventh month of the year?

Will there be work done on those days?

 

[The Biblicist]

Lets look at one of these verses i havent already proven doesnt pertain to a new day of rest. How about Mark 16 [9]

Mark 16:9 (KJV)
9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.

Tell me Biblicist, where do you see God changing His day of rest in scripture above? You must have a very vivid imagination.

Why? You don't believe anything I say anyway so why waste the time? I have spelled out the grammatical details of this text several times before and you simply jump to another text to another question. I have pointed out the distinction of Greek terms between verse 9 and verse 2 on more than one occasion and the implications of those differences. The singular "sabbatou" versus the plural "Sabbaton". The use of "mia" in verse 2 instead of "proton" in verse 9. That "proto" is were we get our own English word "proto" as in "prototype." How that "proto" is not merely numerical but the first in a series of things. That "sabbatou" is always used of the fourth commandment while "sabbaton" is the normal plural used for the first day of the week or the day following sabbaths. So the idea is that the first day of the week (v. 2) is the "first Sabbath in a new series" {v. 9) as is taught in Hebrews 4:9-10.

 

[Chowmah]

So the idea is that the first day of the week (v. 2) is the "first Sabbath in a new series" {v. 9) as is taught in Hebrews 4:9-10.

HEBREWS 4

[8] For IF JESUS HAD GIVEN THEM REST, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.[9] THERE REMAINETH THEREFORE A REST to the people of God.

You’ve heard the many say “Jesus is my rest”. Well…verse 8 contradicts that? Anyways the rest (sabbath) remains. Ive heard “the many” say verse 9 is speaking of the 1000 yr period of rest. That rest has not yet arrived, so how could it remain? Another thing that bothers me is the fact that many of the new books have changed the name of Jesus to Joshua. Why? What are they trying to hide? Plain to see. The "many" claim Jesus is their rest, while the bible (verse 8) says quite the opposite. Thus the need for the change of names

[10] For HE THAT IS ENTERED INTO HIS REST, he also hath ceased from his own works, AS GOD DID FROM HIS. [11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Well...Ya see what verse 10 says. Now lets see how God rested from His work

HEBREWS 4 [4] For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works

Yup. God rested the 7th day. Pretty simple

 

[Chowmah]

Why? You don't believe anything I say anyway so why waste the time?

I belong to no denomination. I simply want to enter the kingdom. The 1000yr period of rest. So if say anything that is backed up by scripture ill truly believe what you say. Everytime i look at the scriptures you post, they dont say what you say they says.

 

[The Biblicist]

HEBREWS 4

[8] For IF JESUS HAD GIVEN THEM REST, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.[9] THERE REMAINETH THEREFORE A REST to the people of God.

You’ve heard the many say “Jesus is my rest”. Well…verse 8 contradicts that? Anyways the rest (sabbath) remains. Ive heard “the many” say verse 9 is speaking of the 1000 yr period of rest. That rest has not yet arrived, so how could it remain? Another thing that bothers me is the fact that many of the new books have changed the name of Jesus to Joshua. Why? What are they trying to hide? Plain to see. The "many" claim Jesus is their rest, while the bible (verse 8) says quite the opposite. Thus the need for the change of names

[10] For HE THAT IS ENTERED INTO HIS REST, he also hath ceased from his own works, AS GOD DID FROM HIS. [11] Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Well...Ya see what verse 10 says. Now lets see how God rested from His work

HEBREWS 4 [4] For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works

Yup. God rested the 7th day. Pretty simple

Yes, a day following and preceding six days commemorating his work is exactly what Jesus did also. No seventh day "of the week" there or anywhere else. The day he established as the new sabbath rest was the first day of the week (Psalm 118:24 with Acts 4:10-11) or the day of resurrection in which we rejoice and be glad in it as that is what God did in response to what the jews did (Psalm 118:20-23). They killed him God raised him and God raised him on the first day of the week and God "made" it to be observed for rejoicing and gladness "in IT".

 

[Chowmah]

Look at your admissions above! You are admitting God can apply it to different days and that is precisely what God did under the New Covenant, he applied it to the first day of the week (Psa. 118:20-24 with Acts 4:10-11; Mk. 16:9; Heb. 4:9-11; Rev. 1:10) and you have NOTHING to prevent God from doing so by your own admissions above.

For instance. You say all those scriptures above speak of a change in our day of rest. None of them even come close.

 

[The Biblicist]

For instance. You say all those scriptures above speak of a change in our day of rest. None of them even come close.

Is that you made no response to the grammatical differences in Mark 16:2 versus Mk 16:9. Is that why you first admitted the fourth commandment never restricts the sabbath to any specific day of the week but God applies it not merely to other days and yearrs and yet in direct contradiction to your admission you claim Hebrew 4;4-6 must refer to the seventh day "of the week"???? You are not consistent, you can't respond, you jump from one text to another and then around the merry go round we come again - fruitless and a complete waste of my time.

 

[Chowmah]

The day he established as the new sabbath rest was the first day of the week (Psalm 118:24 with Acts 4:10-11)

This is what i mean

Acts 4:10-11 (KJV)
10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

Where do you see in scripture above anything at all about a new sabbath rest

Psalm 118:24 (KJV)
24 This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

Where do you see in scripture above anything at all about a new sabbath rest

This is what im mean.

 

[Chowmah]

HEBREWS 4 [6] Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:[7] Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, HARDEN NOT YOUR HEARTS.

You find "harden not your hearts" in Hebrew 4. You also see that in Hebrews 3. Talkin bout the same thing.

HEBREWS 3 [12]Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. [13] But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. [14] For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end; [15] While it is said, to day if ye will hear his voice, HARDEN NOT YOUR HEARTS, AS IN THE PROVOCATION. [16] For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came OUT OF EGYPT by Moses. [17] But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, WHOSE CARCASES FELL IN THE WILDERNESS? [18] And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not? [19] So we see that THEY COULD NOT ENTER IN BECAUSE OF UNBELIEF.

Scripture above (out of Egypt - into the wilderness - those that believed not - destroyed them)
Scripture below (out of Egypt - into the wilderness - polluted HIS SABBATHS - destroyed them)

EZEK.20 [10] Wherefore I caused them to go forth OUT OF THE LAND OF EGYPT, and brought them INTO THE WILDERNESS. [11] And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them.[12] Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.[13] But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and MY SABBATHS THEY GREATLY POLLUTED: then I said, I would pour out my fury upon them IN THE WILDERNESS, TO CONSUME THEM.

Hebrews 3 and Ezek 20 also speaking of the same thing. So, how do you deny God and Jesus according to this new testament scripture,and walk in the spirit of unbelief. Who are these people and why were they killed in the wilderness? The answer would be very important, as this passage from the NEW TESTAMENT tells us NOT to do as they did and walk with an evil heart of unbelief. When we go back to the old testament to see exactly what the new testament is talkin about we find that Hebrews 3 is speaking of those who did not keep the sabbath and how the Lord was to destroy them in the wilderness because of unbelief. So the scripture in Hebrews 3 is telling us, as believers we must keep the sabbath, and not to walk with an evil heart of unbelief.

 

[The Biblicist]

This is what i mean

Acts 4:10-11 (KJV)
10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.
11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.

Where do you see in scripture above anything at all about a new sabbath rest

Psalm 118:24 (KJV)
24 This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

Where do you see in scripture above anything at all about a new sabbath rest

This is what im mean.

Acts 4:10 declares what they did versus what God did in response. They killed him God raised him. This is parallel to Psalm 118:21-23.

Acts 4:11 is clearly applying Psalm 118:22-23 to the resurrection and what God did.

each verse in Psalm 118-23-24 is introduced by the same words "This is" and explains what God did in response to what they did. They killed him (Psa. 118:22) but God rasied him - "This is the Lord's doing" (Psalm. 118:23) and "this is the day" when the Lord did that (Psa. 118:24) the day of resurrection by God (Acts 4:10) and this day is "MADE" (Heb. made to be observed - same Hebrew term used for the fourth commandment in Deuteronomy 5) and the way to observe it is "we will rejoice and be glad IN IT" - that is the day God "made" to be observed - the day of resurrectionon WHEN God did this.

 

[Chowmah]

you claim Hebrew 4;4-6 must refer to the seventh day "of the week"????

HEBREWS 4
[4] For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works.[5] And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.[6] Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief

Yeah Biblicist i do make that claim. I dont know where i got my 1st clue that this might by speaking of the SEVENTH DAY but....

 

[Chowmah]

Acts 4:10 declares what they did versus what God did in response. They killed him God raised him. This is parallel to Psalm 118:21-23.

Acts 4:11 is clearly applying Psalm 118:22-23 to the resurrection and what God did.

each verse in Psalm 118-23-24 is introduced by the same words "This is" and explains what God did in response to what they did. They killed him (Psa. 118:22) but God rasied him - "This is the Lord's doing" (Psalm. 118:23) and "this is the day" when the Lord did that (Psa. 118:24) the day of resurrection by God (Acts 4:10) and this day is "MADE" (Heb. made to be observed - same Hebrew term used for the fourth commandment in Deuteronomy 5) and the way to observe it is "we will rejoice and be glad IN IT" - that is the day God "made" to be observed - the day of resurrectionon WHEN God did this.

Have you ever watched Jack Van Impe. He is so far fetched i end up having 3 or 4 belly laughs during one show. If in need of a smile give him a watch.

 

[The Biblicist]

HEBREWS 4
[4] For he spake in a certain place of THE SEVENTH DAY on this wise, And GOD DID REST THE SEVENTH DAY from all his works.[5] And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.[6] Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief

Yeah Biblicist i do make that claim. I dont know where i got my 1st clue that this might by speaking of the SEVENTH DAY but....

Where does the text say "of the week"??? Where do the fourth commandment says "of the week"??? Where does any description of the Creation Sabbath in Gensis 2 say "of the week"???

God could not say "of the week" without contradicting his own application of the sabbath law which EXCEEDS any week but is used for the seventh month, seventh year, first day of the week, tenth day of the month, 50th day, etc.

The sabbath law may INCLUDE the seventh day "of the week" but cannot be restricted to it and so God can and God has applied it to the "first" day of the week not only in Leviticus and to the FIRST year after 7 seventh year sabbaths but has applied it to the first day of the week as the resurrection day of Christ (Psalm 118:20-24 with Acts 4:10-11; Mk 16:2,9; heb. 4:9-10).

 

[Chowmah]

Where does the text say "of the week"??? Where do the fourth commandment says "of the week"??? Where does any description of the Creation Sabbath in Gensis 2 say "of the week"???

Well i figure because Jesus was keeping the 7th day of the week that He more than likely got it right.

LUKE 4 [14] And JESUS returned in the power of the Spirit into Galilee: and there went out a fame of him through all the region round about.[15] And he taught in their synagogues, being glorified of all.[16] And he came to Nazareth, where he had been brought up: and, AS HIS CUSTOM WAS, he WENT INTO THE SYNAGOGUE ON THE SABBATH DAY, and stood up for to read.