Islam Surprise

[Cathode]

I believe the same surprise Israel experienced from militant Islam will be experienced by the world.

“When He opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, ‘Come and see.’ Another horse, fiery red, went out. And it was granted to the one who sat on it to take peace from the earth, and that people should kill one another; and there was given to him a great sword.”

I believe militant Islam will attack and persecute Christianity and the West in general, especially in Europe.
I think Rwanda style violence will break out and set in, expanding everywhere.

Pray this is mitigated and peace prevails.

 

[David Kent]

Islam has in the past spread over much of the world, much of Asia, Europe through most of Eastern Europe, Africa, across the North of Africa, and up through Spain and Portugal and into France. Like Catholicism it imposed its religion by wars.

 

[Revmitchell]

“When He opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, ‘Come and see.’ Another horse, fiery red, went out. And it was granted to the one who sat on it to take peace from the earth, and that people should kill one another; and there was given to him a great sword.”

.

This is not that

 

[Martin Marprelate]

I believe the same surprise Israel experienced from militant Islam will be experienced by the world.

“When He opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, ‘Come and see.’ Another horse, fiery red, went out. And it was granted to the one who sat on it to take peace from the earth, and that people should kill one another; and there was given to him a great sword.”

I believe militant Islam will attack and persecute Christianity and the West in general, especially in Europe.
I think Rwanda style violence will break out and set in, expanding everywhere.

Pray this is mitigated and peace prevails.

There is a variety of interpretations of Revelation 6. Some believe that it was all fulfilled in AD 70; others that it all speaks of our own times or beyond. My view is that it speaks of all generations since the book was written. There have been dreadful massacres and mayhem all through history. "You will hear of wars and rumours of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is yet to come." We not longer get 'rumours' of wars. Today they are flashed onto our screens almost as soon as they occur. But our Lord's words still hold true, 'These are the beginning of birth-pains' (Matthew 24::6, 8). 'We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of child-birth right up to the present times' (Romans 8:22). And it will go on groaning until the Lord Jesus returns and the new age comes finally to birth.

 

[David Kent]

The seals are opened in order and are fulfilled and will be fulfilled in history, past, present and future.

 

[37818]

The seals are opened in order and are fulfilled and will be fulfilled in history, past, present and future.

As of now, all yet future.

 

[Revmitchell]

“When He opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature saying, ‘Come and see.’ Another horse, fiery red, went out. And it was granted to the one who sat on it to take peace from the earth, and that people should kill one another; and there was given to him a great sword.”

What is going on here is not that.

 

[David Kent]

As of now, all yet future.

No sir, Revelation is a history of the church and its struggles and tribulations fro the time of John till the end.

 

[37818]

No sir, Revelation is a history of the church and its struggles and tribulations fro the time of John till the end.

Give the dates of what was before now after the 7 letters.

 

[David Kent]

Give the dates of what was before now after the 7 letters.

Well we can start with what the early Church taught on prophecy. They taught that the temple in Revelation referred to the church, the let and hindrance in 2 Thessalonians were the empire and the Emperor, when they were taken out of the way the empire would be divided between ten kings. Out of them would come Antichrist and then would come the end. Mostly fulfilled, but they didn't see the long centuries ahead.I

OK, back to Revelation. The apostle was told that the things that would shortly come to pass. Under the first seal, the rider ofthe white horse caffied a bow and went forth to conquer. The Revelation couldn't have been written later than AD 96, and the Nerva was Emperor in AD 96, and went forth conquering. Nerva was followed by Trajan and Hadrian. Under these three the empire reached its greatest point, and the Empire enjoyed 100 years of peace and tranquility, which enabled the gospel to spread quickly throughout the empire.
The second seal was opened and the rider of the red horse. in AD 193 Septimus Severus came to the throne, then war and fighting broke out in many parts of the empire. Peace was taken away. Civil war soon broke out as rival emperors struggled for the throne. War with Persia broke out and Germans began attacking from the west from about 220 onwards, by the year 271 the province of Daca was given up as it couldn't be defended from the barbarians. The third century was a time of war and calamity for the empire.
The third seal revealed the black horse and its rider.who carried a pair of scales. Prices became high. The apostle heard the prices fixed. The prices of wheat and barley became high but oil and wine were not touched. Luxuries were unaffected but the staples were difficult to oobtain.in that century there was a great economic crisis in the empire, inflation was high and taxes were crushing and the middle class throughout the empire were impoverished.
The frourth seal revealed a pale horse. Disaster increased. The rider's name was death.and hell or the the grave followed him. During the second half of the third century a quarter of the population perished, pestilence contributed to the decline. Farms were deserted.
References given are Gibbon's Decline and fall of the Roman Empire, and Cambridge Ancient history, First seal, vol Xl, chaps 5,6,8,9. Second seal, voI XII chaps 1,2,5,6. third seal chap 7.

End 1of part 1. I will work on part 2.

 

[David Kent]

Give the dates of what was before now after the 7 letters.

Part 2. The previous seals cover what some call the Ephesus period and the Fitfth seal begins the Smyrna period. Great persecution broke out under Dioclecianb in AD303. The apostle saw the souls under the altar of those slain for "The word of God and the testimony they held." Thatis Christians. 1
Revelation 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held: 10 And they cried with aloud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled."
The apostle saw the souls under the altar, that is they were put to death like a sacrifice. Their souls cried out as the blood of Abel cried out to Godfrom the ground. There had been persecutions before but the great persecution under Diacletian lasted 10 years, from 303-313, the10 days of Revelation 2:10.

 

[37818]

They taught that the temple in Revelation referred to the church, . . .

Why? And what reference in Revelation?

 

[David Kent]

Give the dates of what was before now after the 7 letters.

Part 3 the 6fh seal.



AS THE LANGUAGE of this passage is very highly figurative, it may be well to call in mind what has been said relative to the figures used in this book, and the meaning attached to them. A few examples from other parts of Scripture.

When Joseph dreamed that the sun, moon, and stars made obeisance to him, his father and brethren at once understood that the paternal government was intended by the sun; and so of the other parts of the family. Jacob answered, “Shall I, and thy mother, and thy brethren indeed come to bow

down our selves to thee?” (Gen. 37:10) These eleven brethren were to be rulers, or rather founders of kin doms, or heads of distinct tribes. We find in Jeremiah the symbol of an earth quake. The prophet saw in vision the destruction of the Jewish kingdom by the Babylonians. “I beheld the earth, and lo, it was with out form and void; and the heavens, and they had no light. I be held the mountains, and lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly. I be held, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger. — For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black — The whole city shall flee for the noise of the horsemen and bow1men; they shall go into thick ets, and climb upon the rocks.” (Jer. 4:23-29) So also in Ezekiel, prophesying of the overthrow of Pharaoh, king of Egypt, “When I shall put thee out, I will cover the heaven, and make the stars thereof dark; I will cover the sun with a cloud, and the moon shall not give her light. All the bright lights of heaven will I make dark over thee, and set dark ness upon thy land, saith the Lord God.” (Ezek. 32:7) In Zephaniah, speaking of the destruction of Judah, “The great day of the Lord is near, a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress.” (Zeph. 1:14) In Isaiah, prophesying of the over throw of Babylon by the Medes, “The day of the Lord cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger; the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light; the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.” (Isa. 13:9) And, for the hiding in dens and rocks of the earth, look to Hosea speaking of Shalmanezer’s attack upon Israel: “They shall say to the mountains, Cover us: and to the hills, Fall on us,” (Hos. 10:8) i.e., not to crush, but to hide them.

Part 3 to be continued

 

[37818]

. . . . the 6fh seal.

Well, I understand that as one yet future event, Matthew 24:29-31.

 

[David Kent]

Why? And what reference in Revelation?

Not Revelation, but Paul.
1 Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.
2 Corinthians 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Ephesians 2:19 So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone, 21 in whom the whole structure, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord. 22 In him you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God by the Spirit.
1 Peter 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

 

[David Kent]

Part 3 continued.
IWhen the time came that God would deliver his people Israel out of the hand of Pharaoh in the land of Egypt, Moses was. born. (Acts 7:17-20)17 “But as the time of the promise drew near, which God had granted to Abraham, the people increased and multiplied in Egypt 18 until there arose over Egypt another king who did not know Joseph. 19 He dealt shrewdly with our race and forced our fathers to expose their infants, so that they would not be kept alive. 20 At this time Moses was born; and he was beautiful in God’s sight. And he was brought up for three months in his father’s house
When it was time to deliver them out of Babylon, Cyrus was raised up. (Isa. 44:28) So, when about to raise his Church to a state of power, Constantine appeared. Constantine raised Christianity to be the state religion but paganism lingered until Constantine became sole ruler.
In Chapter seven there is a pause with the four angels holing back the four winds, which is the calm before the storm, till the 144,000 were sealed . Why Jews when it is speaking about Christianity? The names of the patriarchs all have meanings.
JUDAH. Praise. All Christians are to offer a sacrifice of Praise and thanksgiving to God's glory.
RUEBEN. See a son. The true believer should always be pointing others to the Son of God.
GAD . A Troop. Every believer should be like a troop in the service of God.
ASHER. Blessed. Every believer is blessed because his sins are forgiven and his iniquities covered.
NAPHTHALI. Wreslings. We wrestle as Paul tells us, not against earhly powers but against principalities and powers, against the rulers of darkness.
MANNAS!SEH. Forgetting. There is much the true believer ought to forget. God says he remembers our sin no more. But he doesn't forget. Satan reminds us of our past sins, and seekIs to make us dwell on them instead of God's forgiveness.
SIMEON. Hearing. We should hearken and obey the word of God.
LEVI. Joined. The believer is joined to the Lord. "He that is joined to the Lord is one spirit."
ISSACHAR. Hire. Every believer obtains the gift of everlasting life won for him by the Saviour.
ZEBULUN. Dwelling. The true believer dwells in Christ and Christ in him.g
JOSEPH. Adding. All believers have been added to the Lord and should seek to add others.
BENJAMIN. Son of my old age. Moses blessing on Benjamin was " The beloved of the Lord shall dwell safely by him." This should be true of every believer.
To be continued.

 

[David Kent]

Well, I understand that as one yet future event, Matthew 24:29-31.

I see that as part fulfilled in AD 70 and part future. That refers to all the tribes, the 6th seal refers to Christians.

 

[David Kent]

Part 3 continued
Revelation 7:9-17
In this second.part of chapter 7, we havea picture of Christians in theit heavenly home after passing through tribula5ion, praising God for their salvation. In verse 17 the apostle saw a great multitude which no man could number. Although at many times there were only a few added, it will end as many millions. They come from every nation, tribe, and many languages. They were clothed in white robes of Christ's righteousness, imputed to every believer. They cried "Salvation to our God and the Lamb. They know that Jesus died for them and bore their sins in His body on the tree. Verse 11, Angels echo the praise but they don't mention Salvation, only the redeemed can do that. The Salvation is the result of God's wisdom, v12. The apostle is then given an explanation of the great multitude. The elder then tells John about the multitude. 1. They came out of great tribulation. This tribulation is in the Christian age. Jesus said, "In this world you will have tribulation." 2&3 They washed their clothes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 4 they are before the Throne of God. Christians can only be before th Throne of God if the have washed their robes in the blood of the Lamb. 5. They serve God day and night in His temple. 6. He who sits on the Throne will dwell amongst them. 7, 8 & 9 They shall hunger no more. They will thirst no more. The sun will not shine on them, nor any heat. 10. revelation 7:17 For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes.

To be continued.

 

[David Kent]

Give the dates of what was before now after the 7 letters.

PART 4 REVELATION 8:1-5
1 And when he had opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven about the space of half an hour. 2 And I saw the seven angels which stood before God; and to them were given seven trumpets. 3 And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. 4 And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand. 5 And the angel took the censer, and filled it with fire of the altar, and cast it into the earth: and there were voices, and thunderings, and lightnings, and an earthquake.

1-2. The first thing that we notice is silence in heaven for about ½ hour. We may think of this as the calm before the storm. That is before the judgments of God were to be unleashed on Apostate Christianity. The barbarians were gathering on the borders of the empire, and the inhabitants fad a feeling that something terrible was to come. The 7 angels were given seven trumpets
3-4 Another angel came. This angel stood before the altar of incense which was the prayers of the saints. Only the high priest could offer incense, so this angel must be our High Priest, The Lord Jesus Christ.
5. The angel took the censer and filled it with fire and cast it onto the earth. This announced judgment. We find a similar thing in Ezekiel 10:2 where the man in white linen was told to take coals from the fire between the cherubim and scatter them over the city due for judgement. So here the same high priest offers up his peoples prayers, but rejects the professing church which at this time had began to worship saints and angels instead of God through Christ. Thunders and lightnings depict war, earthquake signifies revolutionary change of government.
REVELATION 8:6-13
6 And the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound. 7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up. 8 And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became blood; 9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. 10 And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; 11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter. 12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise. 13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!

6. the seven angels prepared to sound their trumpets
PS. I completed the chapter but as i tried to post if i got a security error message to refresh, and then when I posted the rest had disappeared. I was hoping to go on to chapter 9 next with the Locusts. The first Islam surprise.

 

[David Kent]

Revlation 8:6-13
6.1st trumpet 6. The seven angels prepared to sound their trumpets. 7. Hail mixed with blood. The judgment we look for here is the fall of paganism at the time of Constantine. A third is mentioned as paganism still continued in the background. 8-9. 2nd trumpet. A mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea. See Jeremiah 51:25 where the burning mountain is Babylon. OT Babylon is a type of Rome. We see this as the Roman Empire, burning with God's wrath cast into the sea of tha barbarian nations around. This took place in 410 when the Goths sacked Rome,
10-11. 3rd trumpet. A great star fell. The goths after they sacked the city, set up a puppet Emperor, Romulus Augustulus who was deposed in 476. The western empire fell then. The type of this is the fall of the king of Babylon in Isaiah 14:12. Life was bitter beyond words at that time.
12. 4th trumpet. Darkness fell. From this time, close to the end of the sixth century, is known as the darlk ages. An angel flying in mid heaven proclaimed triple woes on the from the coming anarchy.

To be continued. The locusts.