Islam trying to be the worlds pariah

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:

Islam is the only major world religion today that is cited by both state and non-state actors to legitimize beheadings.

They are only partially correct. The truth is that Extremist Islam is the only major world religion today that is cited by both state and non-state actors to legitimize beheadings. Not all Muslims agree with this.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Islam is, for this determined minority of Muslims , anything but a "religion of peace." It is, rather, a religion of the sword with the blade forever at the throat of the unbeliever. http://www.meforum.org/article/713

I was wondering if you caught what your own source said about these Muslim Extremist terrorists. HMMMMMMMMMMMMM?

Joseph Botwinick

 

[LadyEagle]

I caught it and went ahead and posted it. He's just trying to be politically correct so he won't be called a bigot. No one can speak the truth anymore without having the B word attached to them. Look at the thread on Winston Churchill - someone called him a bigot.

Exploiting democracy

In 2000, Bakri told Cybercast News Service in an interview: "We will use your democracy to destroy your democracy."

Britain's legal system and its willingness late last century to offer asylum to figures like Bakri, al-Masri and Abu Qatada made it a magnet for exiled radical organizations.

"In the past decade, the United Kingdom's undisputed political, economic, and cultural center has also become a major world center of political Islam and anti-Semitic, anti-Israel, and anti-American activism," writes Hebrew University of Jerusalem academic Robert S. Wistrich, in online excerpts of an article to be published soon.

"Through its Arabic-language newspapers, magazines, and publishing houses, not to mention its flourishing network of bookshops, mosques, and community centers, radical Islam has taken full advantage of what British democracy has to offer for its anti-Western goals, reaping the benefits of London's significance as a hub of global finance, electronic media, and mass communications technology."

Osama bin Laden himself laid the groundwork for a London-based network, according to terrorism researcher Yossef Bodansky.

In his biography on bin Laden, written before 9/11, Bodansky wrote that the al-Qaeda leader based himself in the London suburb of Wembley in 1994. By the time he left, after the Saudis began demanding his expulsion, "he had consolidated a comprehensive system of entities" in the city.

Interesting article from CNS News

Of course, this article is speaking about Britain's lax immigration policies, but the USA's are no better, in reality. In fact, our own State Department brings Muslims in from Somalia and other places which breed terrorism and dump them in small communities in Maine, for instance. Maybe these are "peaceful" Muslims, though. Except after they are here for a little while, pretty soon they want a big mosque and pretty soon they get an imam who preaches hate against America and Jews. And pretty soon, another madrassa springs up so the Muslim kids can go to their own "school" where they can learn how to do the big jihad properly against the Big Satan and Little Satan.

And then pretty soon enough of them are in a town where they can have a political voice and demand calls to prayer five times a day, like they did in that town in Michigan.

It's all nuts.

 

[LadyEagle]

Oh, and Joseph, has any leading Muslim cleric in the world ever issued a fatwa against Osama bin Laden?

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
I caught it and went ahead and posted it. He's just trying to be politically correct so he won't be called a bigot.

So, are you saying he wasn't being honest? If not, why should we believe anything he says? Also, how do you know that he is just being PC? Did he tell you that? Where was that written in the article? It is interesting how far you will go to attach only the worst possible picture to all Muslims no matter what the facts show.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
Oh, and Joseph, has any leading Muslim cleric in the world ever issued a fatwa against Osama bin Laden?

I could be wrong, but I don't think that moderate Muslims issue Fatwas as that is the stuff of extremist terrorists. I do know that there are terrorists who have issued fatwas against Irshad Manji. I wonder why? Why do you think they would do that?

I also know that there are many Muslims in Iraq who are fighting and dying for freedom against the terrorists who have infiltrated their country.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[RTG]

This just in moderate Klan leader denounces violence,claims Klan doctrine misunderstood.Just wants peace.All the violent acts of the past were carried out by extremist,that were not following true clan doctrine.For the sake of peace and true clan doctrine we will let god sort this all out,one color at a time.I didn't post this to offend any one,some thing to think about.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

RTG,

That was a very stupid post considering much of the Klan claims Christianity as its religion of Choice and uses the Bible to justify much of their extremism. Those were not crescent moons they used to burn in people's yards, in case you missed it.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[LadyEagle]

Oh, I thought it was a great post, RTG.

If someone is a member of the KKK, is that person a terrorist? Or a potential terrorist?

 

[LadyEagle]

What if someone is in a Nazi group, are they a terrorist? Or a potential terrorist?

 

[church mouse guy]

Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
The name Victor Mordecai means nothing to me as I don't know who he is. Every nation in the world has had their highs and lows. There may be a day when America doesn't protect the rights of the unborn...oh wait...that day is already here. There may be a day when America does not protect the rights of black people...oh wait...we have already had that day. See my point? All mankind is capable of all manner of evil. Islam has gone through their dark time and many Muslims have themselves suffered for it. There are Muslims who are trying to embrace western ideas of pluralism and reform their religion to where their people don't embrace terrorism, and take them back to a time when they did contribute positively to the world. If you don't want to support that, then I feel sorry for you. I do support these goals however.

Joseph Botwinick

Victor Mordecai is an author and lecturer. He traces the history of Islam from an Israeli point of view.

Islam mourns the time when their empire was the greatest. No, I would not want them to return to that. The Arab League is already twice as large as the USA.

You mention abortion, slavery and racial prejudice; Islam still has these things. You say that Christianity justified those things but you cannot find in The Holy Bible any justification for mistreating people. However, you can find in the Koran, which won't flush down my toilet because my toilet isn't as good as those at Newsweek Headquarters, verses for mistreatment of women, homosexuals, Jews, Christians, and all other infidels.

Of course, men are totally depraved. However, the Koran is also totally depraved. It is a sick book.

www.vicmord.com

 

[LadyEagle]

Great post, cmg.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
Oh, I thought it was a great post, RTG.

If someone is a member of the KKK, is that person a terrorist? Or a potential terrorist?

The KKK was a terrorist organization, so yes. They are terrorists. Of course, the Klan based much of their hatred on the twisted perversions of the Bible. Does that mean that all Christians are terrorists, or potential terrorists?

 

[church mouse guy]

So you are saying that The Holy Bible is twisted just like the Koran, Joseph?

Thanks, LE!

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by church mouse guy:
You mention abortion, slavery and racial prejudice; Islam still has these things.

1. Actually, I believe abortion is considered illegal under Islamic law. I could be wrong, though. I will have to check into that.

2. Racial Prejudice....yep we still have this among many who claim Christianity today. But, of course, this is not all Christians just as it is not all Muslims.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by church mouse guy:
So you are saying that The Holy Bible is twisted just like the Koran, Joseph?

Thanks, LE!

You don't have to go very far to find that happening, CMG. Just go to the Other Religions forum sometime. Or, turn on TBN (The Blasphemy Network). That isn't a Koran being used by Benny Hinn and Ken and Gloria Copeland. Yes, of course evil men pervert and twist scripture all the time to fit their agenda just as they do in Islam.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[LadyEagle]

The KKK was a terrorist organization, so yes. They are terrorists.

What if the KKK member never burned a cross on a yard? Is he a potential terrorist?

Of course, maybe he is a "moderate" terrorist.

 

[LadyEagle]

The Bible says thou shalt not kill.

The Quran says to kill the infidel.

People who believe the Bible will not murder.

People who believe the Quran will kill.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

This is apples and oranges since the Klan has as its very foundation, hatred and racism. They perverted the Holy Bible and its message to get this hate. That does not mean that the Bible teaches that anymore than the Koran does. Are all Christians racists? This argument goes both ways because it is stupid, silly and meaningless.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
The Bible says thou shalt not kill.

The Bible says do not kill unless God tells you to:

13 When the LORD your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it.

Deuteronomy 20:13

What, you say? We should interpret scripture in light of other passages if we are to be fair? Well then, perhaps we could offer the same benefit of the doubts to the Muslims as well for fairness sake:

After so much exploring , my personal interpretation of the Koran leads me to three recurring messages. First, only God knows fully the truth of anything. Second, God alone can punish unbelievers, which makes sense given that only God knows what true belief is. (And considering the Koran’s mountain range of moods, it really would take the Almighty to know how it all hangs together.) Human beings must warn against corrupt practices, but that’s all we can do to encourage piety: warn. Third, our resulting humility sets us free to ponder God’s will — without any obligation to toe a dictated line. “Let there be no compulsion in religion,” states a voice in chapter 2 of the Koran. “Unto your religion, unto me my religion,” echoes another voice in chapter 109. In-between, there’s this: “If God had pleased, he would have made you all one people. But he has done otherwise...” Ain’t that the truth.

My interpretation sheds light on why I, as a Muslim, can’t stay quiet about Islam’s supremacists, whether they’re extreme like Osama bin Laden or mainstream like my madressa teacher, Mr. Khaki. After reaching their own conclusions “without compulsion,” they turn around and prevent others from doing the same. At that point, the Koranically decreed duty to “warn” about practices that try the faith morphs into the Koranically denied permission to intimidate. By my reading, we should not only enjoy the freedom to explore; we have to ensure that this freedom exists for everyone. Anything less undermines God’s jurisdiction as the supreme judge and jury. Such individual, independent reasoning is logical, potentially righteous, and entirely compatible with the ideals I hold as a Westerner.

http://www.muslim-refusenik.com/letters.html

Khaleel Mohammed, an imam and professor of Islam at San Diego State University: “Irshad wants us to do what our Holy Book wants us to do: End the tribal posturing, open our eyes, and stand up to oppression, even if it's rationalized by our vaunted imams… She remains obedient to the Divine Imperative: ‘O you who believe! Be upholders of justice, witnesses for God, even if it be against yourselves, or your parents and kin.’ (Quran, 4:135).”

http://www.muslim-refusenik.com/aboutirshad.html

BTW, don't you like this kind of message? Wouldn't you like to hear more Muslims clinging to this interpretation of the Koran than the one you seem to want to shove down their throats in judgement?

Joseph Botwinick