Israel is still an enemy of the gospel of Christ

[Scott Downey]

Israel threatens to shut down new TV channel for preaching 'gospel of Jesus'

So much so, they are perhaps shutting down a TV channel for preaching the gospel in Israel.

 

[Calminian]

Why single out Israel? The Gentile nations are also a hinderance, and have been from the beginning. Some Gentiles believe, most don't, some Jews believe, most don't.

Expecting unbelievers to foster the spread of the Gospel is illogical at best.

And as Paul warned in Romans, don't be arrogant toward the root. They can become believers at any time and be grafted into the tree, and you, if your faith is found to be fake, can be severed.

 

[Marooncat79]

Good post Cal

 

[Scott Downey]

Why single out Israel? The Gentile nations are also a hinderance, and have been from the beginning. Some Gentiles believe, most don't, some Jews believe, most don't.

Expecting unbelievers to foster the spread of the Gospel is illogical at best.

And as Paul warned in Romans, don't be arrogant toward the root. They can become believers at any time and be grafted into the tree, and you, if your faith is found to be fake, can be severed.

Sure, I am not boasting against the other branches cut off by Him, God can graft them in again. Even there the impetus to that action is God, not men. Men will be judged by the gospel, since there is no other name given under heaven among men where we must be saved, a Jew in Israel can not be grafted in by being a good Jew, God has to grant to a person repentance to know the truth. Again the action is on God and His mercy, not man and his works (what he does), and a man wont believe unless God shows Himself merciful to that one. Those verses in Romans 11 have to do with nations, not individuals, because some jews did believe in Christ, but most did not.

7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded 8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.

9 And David saith, Let their table be made a snare, and a trap, and a stumbling block, and a recompence unto them: 10 Let their eyes be darkened, that they may not see, and bow down their back alway.

 

[Calminian]

...Those verses in Romans 11 have to do with nations, not individuals, because some jews did believe in Christ, but most did not....

Which is exactly why I brought these verses up. You singled out the nation of Israel. Paul spoke these verses in the context of singling out Israel, which you did quite randomly.

 

[Yeshua1]

Israel threatens to shut down new TV channel for preaching 'gospel of Jesus'

So much so, they are perhaps shutting down a TV channel for preaching the gospel in Israel.

Just as paul stated, but there are still remnant jews getting saved, and God will save national Israel when messiah returns!

 

[Calminian]

Just as paul stated, but there are still remnant jews getting saved, and God will save national Israel when messiah returns!

Indeed. Paul didn't have resentment for Israel, but rather compassion. He likely knew the persecution that was coming after the birth of the Messiah, as John depicts in Revelation.

 

[InTheLight]

From the article:

Proselytizing to anyone under 18 years old without parental consent is against the law in Israel, according to Israeli newspaper Haaretz, and the terms of the license issued to Shelanu, prohibit missionary programming.

So Israel is not singling out Christians, they don't allow any proselytizing on TV by any religious group. I presume this law is aimed at Muslims but everyone falls under its umbrella.

 

[Scott Downey]

Indeed. Paul didn't have resentment for Israel, but rather compassion. He likely knew the persecution that was coming after the birth of the Messiah, as John depicts in Revelation.

1 Thessalonians 2:14-16 New King James Version (NKJV)
14 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans,

15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men,

16 forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

Nothing has changed with them after all this time. Wrath here is from God and carried out against them by the Romans with the 70 AD destruction.

 

[Calminian]

1 Thessalonians 2:14-16 New King James Version (NKJV)
14 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans,

15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men,

16 forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

Nothing has changed with them after all this time. Wrath here is from God and carried out against them by the Romans with the 70 AD destruction.

The end-times Tribulation will make the 70AD destruction look like walk in the park. It will be marked by the return of Christ coming in the clouds, with all the tribes of the earth morning.

Matt. 24:29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.​

Paul and John knew the nation of Israel would be saved at that time. I believe them. I also heed Paul's warning not to be arrogant toward unbelieving Israel. He and John new of the coming antisemitism and persecution Israel would endure (Rev. 12). The Church should not take part in this.

 

[Calminian]

From the article:

Proselytizing to anyone under 18 years old without parental consent is against the law in Israel, according to Israeli newspaper Haaretz, and the terms of the license issued to Shelanu, prohibit missionary programming.

So Israel is not singling out Christians, they don't allow any proselytizing on TV by any religious group. I presume this law is aimed at Muslims but everyone falls under its umbrella.

Not only this, Israel is one of the most tolerant nations on earth. Certainly the most tolerant in the middle east. Christians are accommodated as well as other religions. You won't find this is any muslim nations. Yet Israel is continually singled out.

 

[xlsdraw]

There are two forms of salvation that take place in regards to the Great Tribulation. The eternal salvation of souls and the salvation of flesh.

All of those that enter the Millennial Reign of Christ upon the earth, in their flesh, accepted Christ through faith during the Great Tribulation, are saved both spiritually and in the flesh. All the unbelieving, that are in the flesh at the Lord's return, are slain. Those that accept Christ, during the Great Tribulation, shall come from all nations.

Many that accept Christ from all nations, during the Great Tribulation, shall be martyred by the Antichrist and his followers. Thereby, the salvation of their souls only.

Those surviving in the flesh shall repopulate the earth during Christ's Millennial Reign. Born into the sin-cursed flesh, the same as we have been. But absent the accentuater of sin, Satan, that we have dealt with, who is bound unable to accentuate sin upon the earth, until his release after the Millennial Reign.

The key to some Israelites and some people from all nations of the earth accepting Christ, during the Great Tribulation, is the depth of God's great love towards man.

The Great Tribulation is a time in which God and His adversary both display clearly seen supernatural power in their war for the souls of men. It's culmination is the casting down of the Antichrist's brief reign from Jerusalem and the onset of the Lord's righteous reign from Jerusalem. The fact that souls are saved from across the earth, and that 144,000 Jewish missionaries are utilized, during the time where the adversary is allowed to unleash his full arsenal, glorifies God and testifies of His faithfulness to His covenants. Israel has been targeted for extermination by God's adversary from the moment that God chose them.

Satan is afforded one last stab at Israel when he is released following the Millennial Reign of Christ. Satan has perpetually hated Israel. Israel is the apple of God's eye. A remnant of Israel shall be saved during the Great Tribulation and they shall be faithful servants of the Lord from then on. Fulfilling Ezekiel's prophecy.

 

[Yeshua1]

1 Thessalonians 2:14-16 New King James Version (NKJV)
14 For you, brethren, became imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen, just as they did from the Judeans,

15 who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us; and they do not please God and are contrary to all men,

16 forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

Nothing has changed with them after all this time. Wrath here is from God and carried out against them by the Romans with the 70 AD destruction.

They are still beloved in the sense that God always saves out a remnant among the Jews, and will at return of Christ save the nation, it shall be reborn as in a day!

 

[Yeshua1]

The end-times Tribulation will make the 70AD destruction look like walk in the park. It will be marked by the return of Christ coming in the clouds, with all the tribes of the earth morning.

Matt. 24:29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.​

Paul and John knew the nation of Israel would be saved at that time. I believe them. I also heed Paul's warning not to be arrogant toward unbelieving Israel. He and John new of the coming antisemitism and persecution Israel would endure (Rev. 12). The Church should not take part in this.

National Israel of that time shall indeed say"blessed is He who comes in the name of the lord"

 

[Covenanter]

Which is exactly why I brought these verses up. You singled out the nation of Israel. Paul spoke these verses in the context of singling out Israel, which you did quite randomly.

Just as paul stated, but there are still remnant jews getting saved, and God will save national Israel when messiah returns!

National Israel of that time shall indeed say"blessed is He who comes in the name of the lord"

The fundamental error of those who see the nation of Israel as prophetically significant is that they do not realise that God consistently speaks of the PEOPLE of Israel, rather than the nation.

The holy nation prophesied in Exodus 19 is taken up by Peter in 1 Peter 2 as the church comprising the redeemed people of God, both Jews & Gentiles as one people.

 

[Calminian]

The fundamental error of those who see the nation of Israel as prophetically significant is that they do not realise that God consistently speaks of the PEOPLE of Israel, rather than the nation.

The holy nation prophesied in Exodus 19 is taken up by Peter in 1 Peter 2 as the church comprising the redeemed people of God, both Jews & Gentiles as one people.

If you're saying, in a round about way, that the Church is now Israel, you've been deceived. Paul always drew a distinction between Israel and the Church.

If you're not saying that, your point is irrelevant (still not true), but irrelevant.

 

[Scott Downey]

They are still beloved in the sense that God always saves out a remnant among the Jews, and will at return of Christ save the nation, it shall be reborn as in a day!

That is the understanding many have, but they will never believe unless God removes the blindness He put on them all (most of them), as part of the plan of God foretold by Isaiah.
John 12
37 But although He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him,
38 that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled, which he spoke:
“Lord, who has believed our report?
And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?”

39 Therefore they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:

40 “He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts,
Lest they should see with their eyes,
Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn,
So that I should heal them.”
41 These things Isaiah said when he saw His glory and spoke of Him.

Key to understanding salvation as to why some believe and some do not is right there in those verses from Isaiah.

 

[Calminian]

That is the understanding many have, but they will never believe unless God removes the blindness....

This is true of Gentiles and Jews, so I don't get your point. Many Jews have had the blinders removed, including those in the initial Church, and billions of Gentiles are still blind.

I don't understand the fixation on jewish unbelievers.

 

[Scott Downey]

This is true of Gentiles and Jews, so I don't get your point. Many Jews have had the blinders removed, including those in the initial Church, and billions of Gentiles are still blind.

I don't understand the fixation on jewish unbelievers.

This is part of understanding prophetic scriptures, that our salvation is of the Lord, not in following the law of rules and ordinances, (The LAW which none can follow, even the Jews break the LAW) which Christ nailed to the cross and was against us.

Colossians 2:13-15 New King James Version (NKJV)
13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the [a]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

 

[Calminian]

This part of understanding prophetic scriptures, that our salvation is of the Lord, not in following the law of rules and ordinances, (The LAW which none can follow, even the Jews break the LAW) which Christ nailed to the cross and was against us.

Colossians 2:13-15 New King James Version (NKJV)
13 And you, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, 14 having wiped out the [a]handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. 15 Having disarmed principalities and powers, He made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in it.

Irrelevant to my question. Why are you fixated on unbelieving Jews rather than just unbelievers in general?