Jesus Christ and Ceremonially Unclean

[atpollard]

Leviticus 15:25-30 [ESV]
25 "If a woman has a discharge of blood for many days, not at the time of her menstrual impurity, or if she has a discharge beyond the time of her impurity, all the days of the discharge she shall continue in uncleanness. As in the days of her impurity, she shall be unclean. 26 Every bed on which she lies, all the days of her discharge, shall be to her as the bed of her impurity. And everything on which she sits shall be unclean, as in the uncleanness of her menstrual impurity. 27 And whoever touches these things shall be unclean, and shall wash his clothes and bathe himself in water and be unclean until the evening. 28 But if she is cleansed of her discharge, she shall count for herself seven days, and after that she shall be clean. 29 And on the eighth day she shall take two turtledoves or two pigeons and bring them to the priest, to the entrance of the tent of meeting. 30 And the priest shall use one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. And the priest shall make atonement for her before the LORD for her unclean discharge.

Matthew 8:2-4 [ESV]
2 And behold, a leper came to him and knelt before him, saying, "Lord, if you will, you can make me clean." 3 And Jesus stretched out his hand and touched him, saying, "I will; be clean." And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 4 And Jesus said to him, "See that you say nothing to anyone, but go, show yourself to the priest and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a proof to them."

The first quote illustrates the general principle that the LAW took "clean" and "unclean" seriously ... to the point that merely TOUCHING something "unclean" made you "unclean" until you were purified.

The second quote illustrates that Jesus touched people that were "unclean" according to the LAW and still adhered to the LAW by having those healed follow the prescriptions in the Law and present themselves to a Priest to be declared "clean".

So was Jesus rendered "unclean" under the LAW and followed the prescribed ritual to be made "clean" (and the Gospel writers merely omitted the detail since they could not record everything) ... or was Jesus (as fully God and fully man) incapable of becoming "unclean"?

I was just wondering what other people thought.

 

[Paleouss]

Greetings atpollard. Nice reading your stuff again. Hope your week was blessed.

The first quote illustrates the general principle that the LAW took "clean" and "unclean" seriously ...

Illustrating sin as being unclean, imo. And the need to be clean (without sin).

The second quote illustrates that Jesus touched people that were "unclean" according to the LAW and still adhered to the LAW by having those healed follow the prescriptions in the Law and present themselves to a Priest to be declared "clean".

Sounds like you are heading toward Christ's work and how it relates to doing it 'through' the Law.

So was Jesus rendered "unclean" under the LAW and followed the prescribed ritual to be made "clean" (and the Gospel writers merely omitted the detail since they could not record everything) ... or was Jesus (as fully God and fully man) incapable of becoming "unclean"?

Hmmm... So as I understand it, the ritual of being deemed pure had to do with being 'fit' for holy activities or interactions. So to be 'unfit' would mean one is not fit for holy activities or interactions. In other words, this ritual process has nothing to do with being morally or spiritually unclean.

(Mark 7:14-16 NKJV) 14 When He had called all the multitude to [Himself], He said to them, "Hear Me, everyone, and understand: 15 "There is nothing that enters a man from outside which can defile him; but the things which come out of him, those are the things that defile a man. 16 "If anyone has ears to hear, let him hear!"

Christ here, in Mark 7, seems to be saying that nothing from the outside makes us 'unfit' for holy activities or interactions with people outside the temple (I'm assuming He would keep to the ritual symbolism within the temple).

Based on what I just wrote, it seems that maybe Jesus was clearing up what ritual uncleanness actually was outside the temple (the Pharisees had gone to some extremes). However, He did have to contend with the Pharisees and their influence outside the temple. So maybe Jesus told her to go and be deemed 'clean' so the woman would be seen by the people as clean. Even though she may have already been seen as clean by God. Or maybe He told her to go and be deemed clean to follow the ritual symbolism under the law. Not that he was ever in jeopardy of becoming unclean.

Just my quick thoughts.
Peace to you brother

 

[Charlie24]

Leviticus 15:25-30 [ESV]
25 "If a woman has a discharge of blood for many days, not at the time of her menstrual impurity, or if she has a discharge beyond the time of her impurity, all the days of the discharge she shall continue in uncleanness. As in the days of her impurity, she shall be unclean. 26 Every bed on which she lies, all the days of her discharge, shall be to her as the bed of her impurity. And everything on which she sits shall be unclean, as in the uncleanness of her menstrual impurity. 27 And whoever touches these things shall be unclean, and shall wash his clothes and bathe himself in water and be unclean until the evening. 28 But if she is cleansed of her discharge, she shall count for herself seven days, and after that she shall be clean. 29 And on the eighth day she shall take two turtledoves or two pigeons and bring them to the priest, to the entrance of the tent of meeting. 30 And the priest shall use one for a sin offering and the other for a burnt offering. And the priest shall make atonement for her before the LORD for her unclean discharge.

Matthew 8:2-4 [ESV]
2 And behold, a leper came to him and knelt before him, saying, "Lord, if you will, you can make me clean." 3 And Jesus stretched out his hand and touched him, saying, "I will; be clean." And immediately his leprosy was cleansed. 4 And Jesus said to him, "See that you say nothing to anyone, but go, show yourself to the priest and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a proof to them."

The first quote illustrates the general principle that the LAW took "clean" and "unclean" seriously ... to the point that merely TOUCHING something "unclean" made you "unclean" until you were purified.

The second quote illustrates that Jesus touched people that were "unclean" according to the LAW and still adhered to the LAW by having those healed follow the prescriptions in the Law and present themselves to a Priest to be declared "clean".

So was Jesus rendered "unclean" under the LAW and followed the prescribed ritual to be made "clean" (and the Gospel writers merely omitted the detail since they could not record everything) ... or was Jesus (as fully God and fully man) incapable of becoming "unclean"?

I was just wondering what other people thought.

Christ was subject to the Law as any other man, but yet He kept it perfectly.

The only explanation I can see in Matt. 8:3 is that Christ was reaching out to touch him and speaking to him at the same time.

The very instant Christ said, "I will" the leper was healed, I think this took place the instant before His hand touched him.

 

[atpollard]

Christ was subject to the Law as any other man, but yet He kept it perfectly.

The only explanation I can see in Matt. 8:3 is that Christ was reaching out to touch him and speaking to him at the same time.

The very instant Christ said, "I will" the leper was healed, I think this took place the instant before His hand touched him.

Maybe ... I don't think the wording of Matthew 8 supports that particular order of events, but that is not a hair I am willing to split. So let's assume it at least possible that Jesus HEALED and then TOUCHED.

Mark 5 speaks of Jesus raising a little girl from the dead. Touching a corpse makes one "unclean" until purified according to the LAW.

Mark 5:39-42 [ESV]
39 And when he had entered, he said to them, "Why are you making a commotion and weeping? The child is not dead but sleeping." 40 And they laughed at him. But he put them all outside and took the child's father and mother and those who were with him and went in where the child was. 41 Taking her by the hand he said to her, "Talitha cumi," which means, "Little girl, I say to you, arise." 42 And immediately the girl got up and began walking (for she was twelve years of age), and they were immediately overcome with amazement.

Here Jesus clearly touched a corpse and then raised her from the dead (he took her hand and then commanded her to rise).
So, was Jesus "unclean" for touching a corpse or was "God Incarnate" incapable of being made "unclean"?

... When the "unclean" touches flesh and blood (a man) then the man becomes unclean until purified.
... When the "unclean" touches the Holy (like the unclean lips touching the coal from the altar in the vision), it is purified.

So what happens when the "unclean" touches Jesus Christ?

 

[Charlie24]

Maybe ... I don't think the wording of Matthew 8 supports that particular order of events, but that is not a hair I am willing to split. So let's assume it at least possible that Jesus HEALED and then TOUCHED.

Mark 5 speaks of Jesus raising a little girl from the dead. Touching a corpse makes one "unclean" until purified according to the LAW.

Mark 5:39-42 [ESV]
39 And when he had entered, he said to them, "Why are you making a commotion and weeping? The child is not dead but sleeping." 40 And they laughed at him. But he put them all outside and took the child's father and mother and those who were with him and went in where the child was. 41 Taking her by the hand he said to her, "Talitha cumi," which means, "Little girl, I say to you, arise." 42 And immediately the girl got up and began walking (for she was twelve years of age), and they were immediately overcome with amazement.

Here Jesus clearly touched a corpse and then raised her from the dead (he took her hand and then commanded her to rise).
So, was Jesus "unclean" for touching a corpse or was "God Incarnate" incapable of being made "unclean"?

... When the "unclean" touches flesh and blood (a man) then the man becomes unclean until purified.
... When the "unclean" touches the Holy (like the unclean lips touching the coal from the altar in the vision), it is purified.

So what happens when the "unclean" touches Jesus Christ?

You could be right! I base my theory on the fact that Christ never broke the Law in any form, and maybe the persons involved were healed before He touched them.

I can't see Christ willingly breaking the Law, so I come to that conclusion.

But I will admit there could be another explanation.

 

[Alan Dale Gross]

Jesus touched people that were "unclean" according to the LAW

And, therefore, they had to be Made clean when He did so and then to go to the priests to be purified was just a matter of making it Official before all others, religiously.

Think of the woman with the issue of blood who Jesus said that her Faith had made her Whole. Her Faith had been the very fact that since Jesus was to be without Spot or Blemish as a Perfect Sacrifice, she reasoned that by touching the hem of Jesus' garment, He COULD NOT BE MADE UNCLEAN so ipso facto, SHE WOULD HAVE TO BE HEALED. That was what He was saying that she had Faith in and she was right.

So, was Jesus "unclean" for touching a corpse or was "God Incarnate" incapable of being made "unclean"?

Jesus was incapable of being made unclean. We don't see Jesus touching a corpse in Luke 7:14, we see He touched the bier, for them to stop the procession; 12 Now when he came nigh to the gate of the city, behold, there was a dead man carried out, the only son of his mother, and she was a widow: and much people of the city was with her. 13 And when the Lord saw her, he had compassion on her, and said unto her, Weep not. 14 And he came and touched the bier: and they that bare him stood still. And he said, Young man, I say unto thee, Arise. 15 And he that was dead sat up, and began to speak. And he delivered him to his mother.

Healing the dead man didn't require Jesus to touch him, only, as we know like the Centurian said about his son, "SpeakYour Word only", by Your very Authority and it will be so.

... When the "unclean" touches flesh and blood (a man) then the man becomes unclean until purified.

Jesus didn't become unclean the unclean, like the woman with the issue of blood, became clean and then went to be declared purified.

... When the "unclean" touches the Holy (like the unclean lips touching the coal from the altar in the vision), it is purified.

Now, there you have the teaching right from the Book.

So what happens when the "unclean" touches Jesus Christ?

The woman with the issue of blood had Faith that she would be Made Whole and she was, just like that, BECAUSE SHE HAD TO BE. JESUS WAS GOING TO BE A PERFECT CEREMONIALLY CLEAN SACRIFICE no matter what came along and touched Him.

 

[percho]

He that toucheth the dead body of any man shall be unclean seven days. Num 19:11

Was Jesus as a dead person, unclean?

I wonder if being regenerated on the third day would have cleansed him?

V 12 He shall purify himself with it on the third day, and on the seventh day he shall be clean: but if he purify not himself the third day, then the seventh day he shall not be clean.

 

[Alan Dale Gross]

Was Jesus as a dead person, unclean?

John 17:19 "And for their sakes I Sanctify Myself,
that they also might be Sanctified through the Truth."

Jesus Sanctified Himself for God's children He died for.

Jesus' body did not see corruption.

Googles' AI gives this Elaboration:

• Ritual Uncleanness:
  The Old Testament laws emphasized ritual purity and separation, often involving temporary states of uncleanness due to contact with death, certain illnesses, or other specific events.
  
  
• Jesus and Uncleanness:
  While Jesus' death would have triggered the laws of ritual uncleanness, Christian theology interprets this within a broader context of His Sacrifice and the Atonement for sin.
  
  
• Cleansing and Redemption:
  Jesus' death is seen as a means of cleansing from sin, and His Resurrection as a demonstration of Victory over death and the Power of God.

Here are what I think are the main points to consider: from Timothy Smith.

1, Jesus had Risen from the dead. No dead body = no ceremonial uncleanness. The writer of Kings says nothing at all about Elijah or Elisha becoming unclean when they Raised people from the dead (1 Kings 17:22; 2 Kings 4:35).

2, Anyone from Pilate’s court would know that they were the ones who removed Jesus’ body (Mark 15:44-45). At the same time, they would have no reason at all for telling any of the Jews who had taken down the body.

3, Joseph had gone to ask in secret for fear of the council (John 19:38).

4, Nicodemus and Joseph were members of the Sanhedrin (John 3:1; Mark 15:43; Luke 23:50).

5, For the sake of fulfilling the law of Moses, they may have felt or probably did feel obligated to undergo the rites for being ceremonially unclean, so that they would not be “cut off from Israel” (Numbers 19:13).

6, It is permissible for a Christian to observe elements of the law when it may harm the faith of another (1 Corinthians 8:7,11,13).

"Looking at these things, I think it is likely and even probable that these two God-fearing men did in fact undergo the full seven-day ritual, but I can’t say that for certain, because this detail isn’t addressed in the holy Scriptures.

"We can be relieved that we are freed from these things, but not because they seem like an inconvenience. Nothing God Commands should be taken as an inconvenience by us, but as a joyful lesson in holiness and righteousness.

"No, we can be relieved because Christ Himself is the End of the law (Hebrews 9:11-13). He has Cleansed our consciences “from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the Living God” (Hebrews 9:14).

"Praise Jesus, not only for bringing an End to the law, but for bringing an End to the consequences of our sins. Through Jesus we are forgiven, and we are Made Clean forever. In Christ, Pastor Timothy Smith.

For Jesus to be Able to Cleanse His children, He could not have been unclean.

 

[atpollard]

Jesus was incapable of being made unclean. We don't see Jesus touching a corpse in Luke 7:14, we see He touched the bier, for them to stop the procession; 12 Now when he came nigh to the gate of the city, behold, there was a dead man carried out, the only son of his mother, and she was a widow: and much people of the city was with her. 13 And when the Lord saw her, he had compassion on her, and said unto her, Weep not. 14 And he came and touched the bier: and they that bare him stood still. And he said, Young man, I say unto thee, Arise. 15 And he that was dead sat up, and began to speak. And he delivered him to his mother.

Healing the dead man didn't require Jesus to touch him, only, as we know like the Centurian said about his son, "SpeakYour Word only", by Your very Authority and it will be so.

I think this points out a fascinating dichotomy in how Jesus did things in public (before gathering of Jews) and in private (or among gentiles). Jesus seemed to know the deeper truth, but avoided appearing to violate ceremonial law on “uncleanliness” to prevent that from becoming a stumbling block to his message and mission. Yet in private, and among those not bound up in the details of Ceremonial Uncleaness, Jesus was free to reveal the deeper truth that HE made the unclean, clean by his touch … which was the reason that Jesus was here (to make the TRULY unclean -damned humanity - to be TRULY clean - righteous children of God).