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Jesus No Longer the Only Way?

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Marcia, Sep 9, 2005.

  1. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    Gold Dragon, thanks for explaining Inclusivism. I probably should have explained it in more detail.

    The problem I have with it is that even though Christian inclusivists say they agree with Jn. 14:6, in essence they are not agreeing with it, and they are certainly not agreeing with Acts 4:12. Taking other passages in the NT into account, it seems clear that faith in Christ must be present for salvation.

    If I were in inclusivist, I would actually not want missionaries to go to unreached people as it seems they would possibly have a better chance at going to heaven that way than hearing about the gospel and rejecting it.

    I may do a poll on this.
     
  2. Gold Dragon

    Gold Dragon Well-Known Member

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    I don't believe inclusivists would say that unreached groups have a better chance of going to heaven if they didn't hear about Christ from a missionary. They would say the opposite. Your logical conclusion about what inclusivists believe is incorrect.

    The belief that Christ MAY extend grace to those who didn't have a chance to be a Christian is not equivalent to the belief that Christ WILL extend grace to those didn't have a change to be a Christian.

    As well, inclusivism extends beyond those who have never had a chance to hear about Christianity but also includes those who had a chance but may have rejected it. Some possible reasons might be the association of Christianity with Western/white culture and a rejection of that.

    A rejection of Christianity is not equivalent to a rejection of Christ.
     
  3. Gold Dragon

    Gold Dragon Well-Known Member

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    You may be referencing this part of the Catechism.

     
  4. Gold Dragon

    Gold Dragon Well-Known Member

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    The inclusivist position has no disagreement with Acts 4:12.
     
  5. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    So a Hindu who does not know the name of Christ can go to heaven?

    Are you interpreting "name" here to be "authority" of Christ?
     
  6. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    It seems that from the strong denouncements by God re worship of false gods, that a Hindu, for example, would be unable to receive grace for heaven if he is worshiping Shiva, Kali, or some other Hindu god.
     
  7. Gold Dragon

    Gold Dragon Well-Known Member

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    So a Hindu who does not know the name of Christ can go to heaven?

    Are you interpreting "name" here to be "authority" of Christ?
    </font>[/QUOTE]
    The phrase "know the name of Christ" is not in this verse. You interpreted that.

    Inclusivists would agree that there is no other name under heaven except Christ by which we must be saved.
     
  8. Gold Dragon

    Gold Dragon Well-Known Member

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    Yes. God hates the worship of false gods.

    What seems like a logical and rational extrapolation to you and I may or may not be true.
     
  9. Craigbythesea

    Craigbythesea Well-Known Member

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    Rom. 1:18. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
    19. because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them.
    20. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.
    21. For even though they knew God
    , they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
    22. Professing to be wise, they became fools,
    23. and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures.
    24. Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them.
    25. For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. (NASB, 1995, my emphasis)

    [​IMG]
     
  10. Marcia

    Marcia Active Member

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    The phrase "know the name of Christ" is not in this verse. You interpreted that.

    Inclusivists would agree that there is no other name under heaven except Christ by which we must be saved.
    [/QUOTE]

    Acts 4.11-12:
    A name "given among men" seems to imply that one must know who Christ is, don't you think?

    And the "by which we must be saved" means what, if someone who does not know Christ can be saved?
     
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