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Jesus was 6'4" ?
- Thread starter LarryN
- Start date
Humblesmith
Member
I'm not necessarily arguing for the shroud, but this is the first that I've heard of the "red ocre." Do you have a published source for that?
Thanks.
Humblesmith
Member
I heartily agree.
T
TexasSky
Guest
I don't necessarily think that the shroud of Turin is Christ's burial shroud (nor do I care whether it is or not). However, new studies show that the original carbon dating was in error, as it tested an edge of the shroud that was added later, nearer the middle ages. The new studies indicate that it is, indeed, of a proper time frame to have possibly been the shroud of Christ, and the fabric of the shroud is only made in that particular part of the world, by certain Jewish tribes. Ergo, it could very well be a Christian shroud of a first generation follower of Christ, or I suppose, even of Christ. (Per the Discovery Channel.)
I doubt the Shroud of Turin because of Christ's statements about an evil generation seeking signs. I think He wants faith to be 100% faith, and therefore would not make a shroud available.
I doubt the Shroud of Turin because of Christ's statements about an evil generation seeking signs. I think He wants faith to be 100% faith, and therefore would not make a shroud available.
D
dianetavegia
Guest
I guess I should have been more verbose. Popular Mechanics/ Shroud of Turin.... Get it?
Our only authority should be the Holy Bible.
Our only authority should be the Holy Bible.
T
TexasSky
Guest
I tried to look this up in the Josepheus letters and the DSS scrolls from Quman but I can't even find a reference to Peter.
Good answer.
God does not want us to know what Jesus looked like, for if we did we would paint pictures of Him, and make statues, and figures and bow down before these images, knowing surely these exact likeness’ of Him have power and forgiveness when we pray to them. Or maybe just hang His picture on the wall and not worship it, but just have it to make us feel safe and secure knowing He is there with us while we are at home; and in the car; and in the church. Well really I do suppose I should also get a really good picuture of him and carry in my billfold, or purse. Safe and secure at last.
And perhaps, just perhaps that movie star that looks just like Jesus. If he says he is Jesus I will believe him, some would say. Look! I see Jesus on that screen door, and I can't believe it, there is Mary too.
No. God does not want us to know anything of Jesus, of angels or anything else in heaven other than what He tells us in His Word.
This is no different than if God allowed us to know the exact date that Jesus was born, for then we would observe His birthday, of which He never asked us to do. Just remember me as oft as you do this is what I hear Him telling me.
Leave it to man to foul up things, making Holy Days, not really caring when Jesus’ birthday was. If it was I they made a Holy Day to worship, and it was not my birthday, I would have to wonder about these people. I believe I would just wait, and when the time comes I will ask them why they observed that which they had no idea of; especially since I didn’t want them to remember my birthday, for I have no beginning and no end. Christian faith, ituttut Galatians 1:11-12
Humblesmith
Member
Dr. Walter McCrone, with other colleagues at McCrone Associates, was one of the teams examining the Shroud in 1979. He identified pigment on the Shroud to be red ochre, a pigment used by artisans of the 1300's. </font>[/QUOTE]Again, I'm not necessarily arguing for the shroud, but I do believe the following quote:
"Allow me to notice a more general and more destructive weakness of the entire composite of explanations for the Shroud image: it cannot explained simultaneously as "a paint layer made up of red ochre or vermillion and collagen tempera" (McCrone), a jeweler's rouge powder rubbing (Joe Nickell), a carbon powder rubbing (Emily A. Craig and Randall R. Bresee, "Image Formation and the Shroud of Turin," in Journal of Imaging Science and Technology, Vol. 38, No. 1, Jan.-Feb. 1994, 59-67), an aloes and myrrh powder rubbing (Kersten and Gruber, Das Jesu Komplott), AND a photo."
http://www.shroud.com/scavone.htm
So whether it's red ochre or jeweler's rouge or carbon or aloes, we can be pretty sure that it's not all of them. Somebody is wrong.
I suggest reading The man Nobody Knows by Bruce Barton(1886-1967), a business exec who tried to present the human side of Jesus from Scripture, plus a history of how the Jews & Romans of that time & place lived. He tells us that all Jewish men of the time wore a beard if they could grow one, and that they kept their hair cut short as did the Romans...and that Jesus wouldn't have been an exception. From remains found in tombs & catacombs, it is ascertained that the average Jewish male was about 5'9", about 160 lb. The carpentry work of the time was largely physical labor, so Jesus had developed great physical strength. This was evident from the fact that He physically expelled SEVERAL merchants from the Temple. They did NOT know He was God in the flesh. However, the Jews' "uniform of the day" concealed muscularity, so Jesus' physical attributes didn't stand out. (The Romans of that time & place were generally a little taller & somewhat heavier than the Jews were, and many a Roman soldier "worked out" to develop his muscles, which their short-sleeved and skirted uniforms showed off. it was quite common to see a 200-lb Roman soldier. The weight estimates are made from the degree of development of the points of the skeleton where the muscles were attached.)
The Scriptures Diane quoted remind us He was average-looking, neither handsome nor ugly nor tall nor short. If either He or Peter woulda been 6'4", a very unusual stature for that time & place, it woulda been noted in Scripture, as Saul's & Goliath's heights were, or Zacchaeus' lack of height was, and/or have been clearly mentioned by Josephus or Tacitus.
A little aside...Peter was a very poor swordsman. It would take a wild sword swing indeed to have cut off a man's ear without further harming him, or a little chopping stroke aimed at the top of the head, which Malchus dodged almost completely. But Scripture mentions only the ear, and that Jesus replaced the ear.(There are apocryphal stories that Malchus & a few witnesses to his ear replacement became believers shortly after Jesus' death and began evangelical work among the Romans since the Jews wouldn't listen.)
The one notable exception to the averageness of Jesus was His oratory and His steadfast gaze. It's evident He had a very powerful, commanding voice, as He addressed more than one large crowd. And His oratory was far greater than any ordinary man could ever have spoken. I believe Jesus stood out from the crowd ONLY when He performed miracles or addressed an audience or gazed earnestly upon someone as He did Peter.
The Scriptures Diane quoted remind us He was average-looking, neither handsome nor ugly nor tall nor short. If either He or Peter woulda been 6'4", a very unusual stature for that time & place, it woulda been noted in Scripture, as Saul's & Goliath's heights were, or Zacchaeus' lack of height was, and/or have been clearly mentioned by Josephus or Tacitus.
A little aside...Peter was a very poor swordsman. It would take a wild sword swing indeed to have cut off a man's ear without further harming him, or a little chopping stroke aimed at the top of the head, which Malchus dodged almost completely. But Scripture mentions only the ear, and that Jesus replaced the ear.(There are apocryphal stories that Malchus & a few witnesses to his ear replacement became believers shortly after Jesus' death and began evangelical work among the Romans since the Jews wouldn't listen.)
The one notable exception to the averageness of Jesus was His oratory and His steadfast gaze. It's evident He had a very powerful, commanding voice, as He addressed more than one large crowd. And His oratory was far greater than any ordinary man could ever have spoken. I believe Jesus stood out from the crowd ONLY when He performed miracles or addressed an audience or gazed earnestly upon someone as He did Peter.
I think that's a bit of a stretch (no pun intended). I do vaguely recall a Josephus reference referring to Jesus being closer to 5 feet in height, older-looking, thin haired and stooped, with joined eyebrows. In other words, Jesus probably looked like most Gallilean men of the day, and would have been of average height.
If Jesus were 6 feet tall, he would have most cetainly been described as a "giant", using the terminology of the day. Scripture makes no such reference whatsoever. In fact, you get the impression from scripture that Jesus blended easily into a crowd. There certainly would have been no reason for the Temple leaders to have paid Judas to identify Jesus at his arrest in the Garden of Gethsemane, since a 6 foot tall man would have stuck out like a sore thumb. </font>[/QUOTE]
