Layman's Confession of Faith

[Alan Gross]

No red lettering?

Are you sure about all this?

There's no red lettering to back it up.

Now that Bible verses are officially 'verbiage'.

Or, is that not actually 'official', since it's not in red lettering?

Old Yestament Saints had to wait to be Saints

AND THEY had to be 'made alive', because they weren't dead.

Are you SURE?

 

[Van]

Yet another false charge, this time saying I did not know all the OT Saints were spiritually dead in their sins.

Note how making endless false charges diverts the thread. This is the goal, to block any actual discussion of scripture.

1) No OT Saint was made perfect before Christ died, they had to wait in Abraham's bosom. Hebrews 11:39-40

2) No one was regenerated (made alive together with Christ) until after Christ died. Ephesians 2:5

Therefore all the OT Saints gained approval through faith without being made alive, quickened, or regenerated!

 

[Alan Gross]

Or, in Adam all died.

In the same way God Said, "In the Day you eat thereof, you shall surely die".

Your manifesto 'gives' something you are saying, like, "all the OT Saints gained approval through faith without being made alive, quickened, or regenerated!"

That is something you attempt to give all New Testament "Saints".

That they "gained approval through faith without being made alive, quickened, or regenerated!"

Since, they were Physically alive and dead, Spiritually, as you and God are saying,

I am going to call your 'faith', that you have in your manifesto, 'Physical'.

I am going to give you this 'Physical', 'Historical', 'belief', in a person who lived on Earth, named 'Jesus', or 'Christ'.

I will say that you have 'faith', in some Christ, here or there, that may have been an Historical character, who lived, Physically and in the exact same way a person may be a fan of David Bowie, you 'believe' he and a 'Jesus', were here on Earth, Physically.

That Physical, Spiritually Dead, 'faith' is rationally feasible and possible within the exceptable realm of Reality.

A Spiritually Dead Rock having Spiritual 'Faith', without Jesus Saying to them, "if these should hold their peace, the stones would immediately cry out", as in Luke 19:40, is not a 'faith' that is rationally feasible and possible within the exceptable realm of the Higher Spiritual Reality.

You have invented The Theory of Evolution in a "Life Comes from Non-Life" manifesto.

The God of The Bible did not bring you that route.

 

[Van]

Yet another false charge, this time saying I claimed the NT Saints were not made alive.

Note how making endless false charges diverts the thread. This is the goal, to block any actual discussion of scripture.

1) No OT Saint was made perfect before Christ died, they had to wait in Abraham's bosom. Hebrews 11:39-40

2) No one was regenerated (made alive together with Christ) until after Christ died. Ephesians 2:5

3) Everyone God put "in Christ" after His death on the Cross has been made alive together with Christ, Ephesians 2:5

On and on they post, one false charge after another, because the doctrine they defend is as bogus as a 3 dollar bill.

 

[Alan Gross]

I'm saying they were dead, prior to being Made Alive.

I'm saying that you say that you had 'faith', before being Made Alive, by God's, First, and that that is what you believe took place in all conversions, in The Old and New Testaments:

"That they "gained approval through faith without being made alive, quickened, or regenerated!"

Just like I said where you "invented The Theory of Evolution in a "Life Comes from Non-Life" manifesto.

A rock turns into a Prince.

 

[Yeshua1]

I'm saying they were dead, prior to being Made Alive.

I'm saying that you say that you had 'faith', before being Made Alive, by God's, First, and that that is what you believe took place in all conversions, in The Old and New Testaments:

"That they "gained approval through faith without being made alive, quickened, or regenerated!"

Just like I said where you "invented The Theory of Evolution in a "Life Comes from Non-Life" manifesto.

A rock turns into a Prince.

Dead sinners cannot suddenly will themselves to come alive again!

 

[Van]

Dead sinners cannot suddenly will themselves to come alive again!

Did anyone say the lost make themselves spiritually alive? Nope, so yet another strawman deflection to hide the truth.
How are we made alive? God puts us in Christ, where together with Christ we are made alive, Ephesians 2:5

Why all the false charges, misrepresentations, and bogus claims? To obfuscate, to deflect. This is all they have to hide the truth.

1) No OT Saint was made perfect before Christ died, they had to wait in Abraham's bosom. Hebrews 11:39-40

2) No one was regenerated (made alive together with Christ) until after Christ died. Ephesians 2:5

3) Everyone God put "in Christ" after His death on the Cross has been made alive together with Christ, Ephesians 2:5

On and on they post, one false charge after another, because the doctrine they defend is as bogus as a 3 dollar bill.

 

[Alan Gross]

There has to be some reason Spiritual Passages, by a Spiritual God, can't be Spiritually decerned.

Being Led of The Spirit of God is how The Bible says God's children Spiritually Love God and Worship Him, Giving Him Glory in Salvation, and The Honor of Being The One Who Wrote The Bible.

Because, they are Teachable, in The Spiritual Realities God Has Revealed, in Revelation, and the rest of The Bible.

 

[Van]

There has to be some reason Spiritual Passages, by a Spiritual God, can't be Spiritually discerned. SNIP

If you look past the absurdity of the question, the reason why people cannot understand spiritual solid food (meat) is because those things can only be discerned with the help of our indwelt Spirit. However, the lost can discern spiritual milk, the fundamentals of the gospel, 1 Corinthians 3:1.

 

[Van]

Of Saving Faith - Faith God credits as righteousness, being from the heart, fully committed and devoted to Christ, having more to do with our love of Christ than believing the right doctrines, Romans 4:4-5; 24.

Of God's Covenant – God’s eternal covenant was to provide eternal life for those of His choosing, based on crediting their faith as righteousness, keeping His covenant of love. James 2:5

Of Repentance unto Life and Salvation – God grants repentance via His revelatory grace, i.e. providing us with an understanding of God’s perfection and our sins and their consequences. When we repent we give glory to God. 2 Timothy 2:24-26; Revelation 16:9.

 

[Alan Gross]

If you look past the absurdity of the question, the reason why people cannot understand spiritual solid food (meat) is because those things can only be discerned with the help of our indwelt Spirit. However, the lost can discern spiritual milk, the fundamentals of the gospel, 1 Corinthians 3:1.

I Corinthians 3:1 is talking to Saved souls, who are needing to be instructed in the basics, as if you would to the lost.

The lost see the Gospel as absurdity and never talk about how foolish it is.

They don't get God, for some reason.

Oh, they're dead in their carnal, finite, flesh filled, wretched wickedness.

That's the reason.

Blind.

Can't "see the kingdom of God".

 

[Alan Gross]

Of Saving Faith - Faith God credits as righteousness, being from the heart, fully committed and devoted to Christ, having more to do with our love of Christ than believing the right doctrines, Romans 4:4-5; 24.

Of God's Covenant – God’s eternal covenant was to provide eternal life for those of His choosing, based on crediting their faith as righteousness, keeping His covenant of love. James 2:5

Of Repentance unto Life and Salvation – God grants repentance via His revelatory grace, i.e. providing us with an understanding of God’s perfection and our sins and their consequences. When we repent we give glory to God. 2 Timothy 2:24-26; Revelation 16:9.

"Faith God credits as righteousness, being from the heart"...

That is Not "Saving Faith".

That is not "Repentance Toward God" of Hellbound SIN that God Will Credit with Everlasting PUNISHMENT in The LAKE of FIRE.

This is HERETICAL 'EASY BELIEVISM', with no acknowledgment of sin, or the need for Jesus Christ's Eternal Work of Salvation, Accomplished in His Death, Burial, and Resurrection.

You "boast".

 

[Van]

I Corinthians 3:1 is talking to Saved souls, who are needing to be instructed in the basics, as if you would to the lost.
The lost see the Gospel as absurdity and never talk about how foolish it is.
They don't get God, for some reason.
Oh, they're dead in their carnal, finite, flesh filled, wretched wickedness.
That's the reason.
Blind.
Can't "see the kingdom of God".

Yet another post full of false assertions, devoid of truth.

1) Talking to them as to people without the Spirit! Therefore people without the Spirit can understand Spiritual Milk. 1 Corinthains 3:1

2) Not all the lost all the time see the gospel as absurdity, recall Soil #2 and #3 of Matthew 13. Calvinism's false claim is the absurdity.

3) Being spiritually dead does not mean unable to seek God (Matthew 23:13) and trust in Christ, Romans 4:4-5, 24.

4) Again it is a misrepresentation of scripture to say the lost cannot be aware of the kingdom of God.

5) Remember we were chosen through faith, 2 Thessalonians 2:13.

 

[Van]

"Faith God credits as righteousness, being from the heart"...
That is Not "Saving Faith".
That is not "Repentance Toward God" of Hellbound SIN that God Will Credit with Everlasting PUNISHMENT in The LAKE of FIRE.
This is HERETICAL 'EASY BELIEVISM', with no acknowledgment of sin, or the need for Jesus Christ's Eternal Work of Salvation, Accomplished in His Death, Burial, and Resurrection.
You "boast".

On and on the falsehoods flow
The poster does not even comprehend the view he is disparaging.
If God credits our faith as righteousness, it is saving faith. Period. End of Discussion.

 

[Yeshua1]

On and on the falsehoods flow
The poster does not even comprehend the view he is disparaging.
If God credits our faith as righteousness, it is saving faith. Period. End of Discussion.

Sinners have NO inherit saving faith within them, as that itself is the gift of God towards his own Elect in Christ!

 

[Van]

Sinners have NO inherit saving faith within them, as that itself is the gift of God towards his own Elect in Christ!

Yet another made up assertion without any biblical support. If God credits a person's faith as righteousness, no matter how worthless it might be, it becomes saving faith. Close to a dozen verses refer to "your faith" or "his faith" but not one ever says your God given and instilled faith. Not one.

 

[Alan Gross]

Yet another made up assertion without any biblical support. If God credits a person's faith as righteousness, no matter how worthless it might be, it becomes saving faith. Close to a dozen verses refer to "your faith" or "his faith" but not one ever says your God given and instilled faith. Not one.

You might want to pick up a Bible, Van.

“By grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God.”

- Ephesians 2:8

 

[Yeshua1]

Yet another made up assertion without any biblical support. If God credits a person's faith as righteousness, no matter how worthless it might be, it becomes saving faith. Close to a dozen verses refer to "your faith" or "his faith" but not one ever says your God given and instilled faith. Not one.

How can a lost sinner, enemy at war against God, and spiritual deaf and blind, suddenly will themselves to now believe in God?

 

[Van]

How can a lost sinner, enemy at war against God, and spiritual deaf and blind, suddenly will themselves to now believe in God?

Yet another denial of scripture. Read Matthew 23:13 and answer your own question. Lost, spiritually dead, people were seeking God, as shown by being in the process of "entering" the kingdom.

All they have folks are false assertions, but no actual support from scripture.

They assert being spiritually dead means unable to seek God, but Matthew 23:13 proves otherwise.
They assert people without the Spirit are unable to understand spiritual milk, but 1 Corinthians 3:1-2 proves otherwise.
They assert our election for salvation was unconditional, but 2 Thessalonians 2:13 proves otherwise.
They assert Christ did not die for all mankind but 1 John 2:2 proves otherwise.

 

[Yeshua1]

Yet another denial of scripture. Read Matthew 23:13 and answer your own question. Lost, spiritually dead, people were seeking God, as shown by being in the process of "entering" the kingdom.

All they have folks are false assertions, but no actual support from scripture.

They assert being spiritually dead means unable to seek God, but Matthew 23:13 proves otherwise.
They assert people without the Spirit are unable to period, understand spiritual milk, but 1 Corinthians 3:1-2 proves otherwise.
They assert our election for salvation was unconditional, but 2 Thessalonians 2:13 proves otherwise.
They assert Christ did not die for all mankind but 1 John 2:2 proves otherwise.

Election based upon the Will of God , period, based upon His choosing, not upon Foreknowledge!