The specifics on what Mark Driscoll has talked about deal with human sexuality which can't be discussed on this board, but for those aware of the issues, what is your opinion of Driscoll? How far can we allow acceptable theology to overtake what should be pastoral appropriate taste?
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Mark Driscoll taking it too far?
- Thread starter JRG39402
- Start date
Driscoll has cleaned up a lot since he was the "cussing pastor" but he's still in a culture in Washington where saying it like it is is the norm. He believes "free and frequent" relations in a marriage is right and healthy and I agree with him. Can he tone it down? Probably. But I do think that he's changing and growing as he matures as a pastor. Much of what was said in the article is from the past - and I don't think he'd necessarily make the same choices today.
The BPNew article is one of the worst forms of journalism out there. I highly recommend two response pieces:
http://blogs.lifeway.com/blog/edstetzer/2009/02/friday-is-for-friends-16.html
http://www.biblicalrecorder.org/post/2009/02/13/Unfair-Unbalanced-and-Unacceptable.aspx
I believe Pastor Mark Driscoll is a fine Christian leader who is leading a tremendous church that is taking the Gospel far into a culture often neglected by Christianity. He is seeing people changed for the glory of God too.
Pastor Mark's tough talk isn't for cry-baby, culturally concealed Christians who sit in their ivory towers of supposed purity and haven't encountered the reality of a Gospel in a culture of paganism. He is straight, direct, and to the point about issues that affect those outside of the Gospel. That said, in listening to Pastor Mark you can't but help hearing his compassion for his people and his unabashed pursuit for the glory of God.
He speaks directly about some things and particularly about sexuality. I don't know what "appropriate taste" is because I think varies significantly from person to person. Do I believe Pastor Mark has crossed certain lines of "taste"? I don't know. Some things he says make me crazy (mostly because of his hardline stance) but I appreciate his willingness to say them in a context where people around him need to here it.
When you are talking to someone who has been involved in a hard life of acting like a regular, non-Christian person and has indulged in the sins of the flesh there is a necessary reality that we should confront them with. Just my thoughts.
I really respect Pastor Mark Driscoll. I'm not a hardcore Calvinist, but I deeply appreciate his willingness to live by his calling and reach people who would otherwise be spurned by religious Christians.
http://blogs.lifeway.com/blog/edstetzer/2009/02/friday-is-for-friends-16.html
http://www.biblicalrecorder.org/post/2009/02/13/Unfair-Unbalanced-and-Unacceptable.aspx
I believe Pastor Mark Driscoll is a fine Christian leader who is leading a tremendous church that is taking the Gospel far into a culture often neglected by Christianity. He is seeing people changed for the glory of God too.
Pastor Mark's tough talk isn't for cry-baby, culturally concealed Christians who sit in their ivory towers of supposed purity and haven't encountered the reality of a Gospel in a culture of paganism. He is straight, direct, and to the point about issues that affect those outside of the Gospel. That said, in listening to Pastor Mark you can't but help hearing his compassion for his people and his unabashed pursuit for the glory of God.
He speaks directly about some things and particularly about sexuality. I don't know what "appropriate taste" is because I think varies significantly from person to person. Do I believe Pastor Mark has crossed certain lines of "taste"? I don't know. Some things he says make me crazy (mostly because of his hardline stance) but I appreciate his willingness to say them in a context where people around him need to here it.
When you are talking to someone who has been involved in a hard life of acting like a regular, non-Christian person and has indulged in the sins of the flesh there is a necessary reality that we should confront them with. Just my thoughts.
I really respect Pastor Mark Driscoll. I'm not a hardcore Calvinist, but I deeply appreciate his willingness to live by his calling and reach people who would otherwise be spurned by religious Christians.
Liberals hate BP News and all things conservative. They also hate the notion that the world does not need a church like them or a Jesus like them. They are in need of a Holy and Righteous God who will show them their sin, the cross that frees them from the penalty of it, and the Righteousness that delivers them from the slavery of it.
Such language does nothing but brings a reproach on the church and belittles the gospel. Until he grows up he should step down. Liberals want to point to Jesus as an example when it fits their agenda but they intentionally ignore the fact that he walked in holiness.
God is not glorified in that kind of language but Satan's agenda is. As someone who has come from physical and emotional abuse, drug and alcohol addiction, homelessness, and some other things I will not mention I can say that those who suggest the church needs to look like the world to be compassionate is not willing to recognize the value of godly and righteous living exempt of this kind of language and behavior. It is a deluded and beguiled mind that supports this. And those who do not repent of it will answer to God on this matter one day. It is not in the character of God.
Such language does nothing but brings a reproach on the church and belittles the gospel. Until he grows up he should step down. Liberals want to point to Jesus as an example when it fits their agenda but they intentionally ignore the fact that he walked in holiness.
God is not glorified in that kind of language but Satan's agenda is. As someone who has come from physical and emotional abuse, drug and alcohol addiction, homelessness, and some other things I will not mention I can say that those who suggest the church needs to look like the world to be compassionate is not willing to recognize the value of godly and righteous living exempt of this kind of language and behavior. It is a deluded and beguiled mind that supports this. And those who do not repent of it will answer to God on this matter one day. It is not in the character of God.
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I've not read everything by Driscoll but I have read a number of things - and I've certainly not read anything offensive. Yeah, he says it like it is and sometimes that's a but more edgy than softening it (like saying that the idea of a husband being the head of the wife and the wife submitting to her husband, but the husband sacrificially loving his wife - is as popular as a fart in an elevator - LOL) but offensive? Nah - not seen anything like that.
DrRandyGrace
New Member
I'm not sure this is what Paul meant when he said he had become all things to all men that he might by all means win some. Where are we headed? I am quite concerned by the direction I see the Church moving.
annsni said:
A piece of fudge, yummy as that may be, is not very appetizing if it's on top of a cow patty!
Driscoll tends to be quite on the mark in theology. But like others I reject the notion that as long as we get the basics correct we can add anything else to what we do in the name of evangelism.
thegospelgeek
New Member
I don't know anything about driscoll, but based on the discussion and the mear fact this thread is here, isn't he violating 1Tim 3:7?
Just asking.
Just asking.
Revmitchell said:
My question though - does he really add anything?
I know he was once a pastor who cursed but he was called out on that and no longer does so. Yeah, he certainly doesn't sugar-coat stuff but is what he says wrong? I don't know. I know he's certainly challenged me a number of times.
annsni said:
What I mean by "add" is those doctrines, methods, and strategies, other than the basic (not that it is all that basic) salvation message. We all add something. He has added a worldly presentation in order to be "relevant".
Revmitchell said:
I agree that he certainly changes the presentation to help bring the point across but is that wrong? Is it even worldly? I just watched some of the "Trial" one - and he's actually dressed up in a suit and tie. I laughed at that. But the messages were very good and right on target, IMO.
I'm jealous of the cool video work before the message. LOL I wish I was that good with graphics.
thegospelgeek
New Member
It's actually more difficult to have a good rep with the believers than the outsiders.annsni said:LOL - Can you name me one pastor/preacher/Christian who is not thought of badly by outsiders? I'm not saying hated by everyone like Phelps is but I'd say, from seeing BB in action, everyone has an issue with someone.
But shouldn't one at least try? I know I have personal liberty to do a lot of things but do not because I do not want to offend a brother or present a stumbling block for a non believer.
Like I said I have never heard nor seen Mr. Driscoll. Just throwing it out for discussion.
I'll have to check him out.
I believe the Church needs to be relevant and should cast off the old clothes of religiousity in order to reach those outside of her.
Thus, I should probably step away from this conversation. Our basic definitions are completely off.
I will reiterate my post that Pastor Mark is a fine servant of God and is seeing thousands truly saved and brought into the family of God through his ministry and preaching. He is good pastor.
Thus, I should probably step away from this conversation. Our basic definitions are completely off.
I will reiterate my post that Pastor Mark is a fine servant of God and is seeing thousands truly saved and brought into the family of God through his ministry and preaching. He is good pastor.