Matthew 23:13

[Reformed1689]

"for you do not enter in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in."

Exactly, it says the Pharisees do not allow, but it does not say the people were actually prevented. Nor does it say that the people seeking after the Kingdom were not being drawn by the Father because they were chosen.

 

[Van]

You're hanging a lot of theology on a single verse, a verse that you admit is not to be taken literally.

Tell us, how are the Pharisees preventing people from entering the kingdom of heaven?

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL

Not sure if you are denying the Pharisees prevented people from entering the kingdom of heaven. Are you saying the verse does not mean what it says?
I accept scripture as written.

 

[Van]

Exactly, it says the Pharisees do not allow, but it does not say the people were actually prevented. Nor does it say that the people seeking after the Kingdom were not being drawn by the Father because they were chosen.

And of course Scripture does not say that God put invisible pink elephants in orbit around Mars. Putting faith in what scripture does not say is nonsense.

 

[Reformed1689]

And of course Scripture does not say that God put invisible pink elephants in orbit around Mars. Putting faith in what scripture does not say is nonsense.

Yet you are ascribing to Scripture what it does not say.

 

[Van]

"But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you shut off the kingdom of heaven from people; for you do not enter in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in.”​

If there is a verse that Van uses to support human ability, it is this..
SNIP

Yet another denial of the obvious. Why did Paul teach about avoiding a "different" or "another" gospel?
Because false teachings can hinder entry into the kingdom of heaven.

Pay no attention to those who deny scripture because it conflicts with their mistaken beliefs.

 

[Reformed1689]

Not sure if you are denying the Pharisees prevented people from entering the kingdom of heaven.

Yes, I am saying that no Pharisee ever prevented someone from entering the Kingdom that God was drawing to Himself. Absolutely.

Are you saying the verse does not mean what it says?
I accept scripture as written.

Nope. I am saying you are saying something the verse does not say and therefore you are not accepting it as written but as you have changed it.

 

[Van]

Yet you are ascribing to Scripture what it does not say.

Nope That is what you are doing.

 

[Reformed1689]

Nope That is what you are doing.

Pretty sure I've demonstrated otherwise with regard to this passage. In no way does it say that the Pharisees prevented someone from entering the Kingdom. It says that they would not allow it. That is not the same thing as preventing it.

The government does not allow people (in most states) to drive without a seatbelt on. Does that prevent them from doing so? No.

 

[Van]

Yes, I am saying that no Pharisee ever prevented someone from entering the Kingdom that God was drawing to Himself. Matthew 23:13 does not say whether the people were drawn or not, so a non-germane deflection. They were "entering." And they were prevented from entry.

Nope. I am saying you are saying something the verse does not say and therefore you are not accepting it as written but as you have changed it.

Twaddle

 

[Reformed1689]

Twaddle

This is all you have.

 

[Reformed1689]

Twaddle

By the way, do you even know the definition of twaddle?

 

[Van]

Pretty sure I've demonstrated otherwise with regard to this passage. In no way does it say that the Pharisees prevented someone from entering the Kingdom. It says that they would not allow it. That is not the same thing as preventing it.

The government does not allow people (in most states) to drive without a seatbelt on. Does that prevent them from doing so? No.

Yet another denial of the very words of Christ.

 

[Reformed1689]

Yet another denial of the very words of Christ.

I haven't denied anything. I just don't add something that is not there.

 

[Van]

On and On they post, denying Matthew 23:13. Total Spiritual inability is as bogus as a three dollar bill. The people of Matthew 23:13 were seeking God, and they were prevented from completing their entry into the kingdom of heaven because of false teaching, thereby demonstrating "irresistible grace" is also bogus doctrine.

 

[Reformed1689]

On and On they post, denying Matthew 23:13. Total Spiritual inability is as bogus as a three dollar bill. The people of Matthew 23:13 were seeking God, and they were prevented from completing their entry into the kingdom of heaven because of false teaching, thereby demonstrating "irresistible grace" is also bogus doctrine.

We have not denied anything. What you have done is refuse to exegete the passage or actually interact with our arguments against your position. Instead you just yell "Twaddle" or falsely accuse us of denying Scripture without offering any substance.

 

[Van]

On and On they post, denying Matthew 23:13. Total Spiritual inability is as bogus as a three dollar bill. The people of Matthew 23:13 were seeking God, and they were prevented from completing their entry into the kingdom of heaven because of false teaching, thereby demonstrating "irresistible grace" is also bogus doctrine.

 

[Van]

Why did Paul teach about avoiding a "different" or "another" gospel?
Because false teachings can hinder entry into the kingdom of heaven.

2Co 11:4
For if one comes and preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted, you bear this beautifully.

Gal 1:6
I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting Him who called you by the grace of Christ, for a different gospel;

Pay no attention to these destructive heresies. Scripture means what it says so do not desert God's word for man-made doctrine.

 

[InTheLight]

On and On they post, denying Matthew 23:13. Total Spiritual inability is as bogus as a three dollar bill. The people of Matthew 23:13 were seeking God, and they were prevented from completing their entry into the kingdom of heaven because of false teaching, thereby demonstrating "irresistible grace" is also bogus doctrine.

Where does it say the Pharisees prevented others from entering the kingdom of heaven with "false teaching"? In what verse may I find that?




Sent from my Pixel 2 XL

 

[Van]

Where does it say the Pharisees prevented others from entering the kingdom of heaven with "false teaching"? In what verse may I find that?
Sent from my Pixel 2 XL

See post #3

A well known logical fallacy is personal incredulity, saying a person cannot understand preventing people from entry actually means preventing people from entry.

At the end of the day, all the deniers of Matthew 23:13 is "taint so."

 

[Reformed1689]

Where does it say the Pharisees prevented others from entering the kingdom of heaven with "false teaching"? In what verse may I find that?




Sent from my Pixel 2 XL

There isn't one.

See post #3

A well known logical fallacy is personal incredulity, saying a person cannot understand preventing people from entry actually means preventing people from entry.

At the end of the day, all the deniers of Matthew 23:13 is "taint so."

Please show how the verse says it PREVENTED people going into the kingdom. It doesn't say it. You add that in there.