ME (Millennial Exclusion) Posts

Alexander's case must therefore be an example of the truth of 2 Cor.5:10; at least that is the way I understand it.

 

If you are referring to me as being hateful, nasty, and untruthful, you are dead wrong. I am speaking the truth in love.

I wish you would receive it.

 

I don't know where the term came from. Baptist used to be a slam. But I think you can call it whatever you want, it doesn't change anything. Denying the kingdom? Certainly we have some of those folks on this board. But I think Accountability Deniers is a more accurate term, which I think was the point of Lacy's EIREITAD (Everyone Is Rewarded Even If They Are Disobedient).

 

1. As church history has shown time and time again, there are going to be modified views on just about every doctrine.

2. I believe in Kingdom accountability, believers being rewarded with eternity with the Father, even if they missed out on crowns because of disobedience.

3. But do I believe in a 1000 yrs outer darkness punishment for disobedience? Certainly not. Period.

 

DHK -- I think he is talking about Matthew's KoH. The parables track from Adam to the 2nd coming of Christ regarding the KoH on earth.

And this might be enlightening to them as well -- we are in the KoH. We are "mustard seed" and "wise virgins" and 11th hour laborers, etc. But the various forms of the KoH are distinct and when they see "kingdom exclusion," they are really seeing the unsaved.

skypair

 

Should I assume you mean that Alexander will only lose rewards at the JSOC? What about this one?

Revelation 18:4-6
4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.

 

You make some excellent points there HoG. The other curious thing about this current broohaha, is one can stand up and say people can fall away into an eternity in the Lake of Fire, like the Arminiasts do and they will actually be treated with a bit of respect. The moment one advocates for free grace eternal security but with kingdom accountability, then that individual is identified as an occultist, heretic and they're questioned as to whether or not they're actually Baptist! 'Tis quite odd.

 

You claim that your version of the doctrine on the Kingdom, commonly called ME, is a denial of part of the gospel of the Kingdom that Jesus and John preached, yet none but your camp have seemed to get it.

 

The premise of the OP is a simple question (If I'm tracking).

Why does a christian suffer loss, if all his sins, iniquities, bad deeds, etc. are covered by the blood?

Christ's righteousness is never changing. Everyone who is saved has his righteousness imputed to them.

If we are judged, at the JSOC, solely on his righteousness, then why doesn't everyone get the same (Christ's) reward?

 

Did you forget to include v.2 in your quote?

 

1. And I suggest you use another version than the KJV at this point and read the highlighted portion in context.

2. Your use of Scripture continues to amaze me.

 

Duly noted. Does the fact that the woman is a city change the definition of works or reward?

 

1. A proper translation of Rev.18:6 I cannot deny.

2. But what is it teaching about "works or reward" is another matter.

 

Well I should hope it shows that works can be sins and that reward can be other than just losing the good kind.

 

1. I suggest this reading instead: "Pay her back as she herself has paid back others, and repay her double for her deeds; mix a double portion for her in the cup she mixed." Rev 18:6 (ESV)

2. But if a particular version helps you cause, then it's your choice.

 

Only because most here have plausible deniability of being Arminian when accused of it. Y'all don't even deny your deviance from what the rest of us believe.

Would y'all call Catholics cultists? or heretics? I wage you would not call yourselves "Catholics" yet you offer one of the same doctrines that has put them outside the Christian pale. Are you trying to bring their theolggy into the Baptist church by disguising your Catholicism?

skypair

 

I would wage that if you would actually study purgatory, you might be able to figure out the difference between what we believe and what the Catholic church teaches.

 

Yes, I embrace part of Catholic theology: I am pro-life.

But, being a good Baptist, I guess I need to immediately become pro-abortion so as not to be confused with the Catholics!

I also embrace some taoist theology: Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Better get rid of that one! I will immediately begin to be hateful, mean, and nasty to people so I won't be confused as a taoist, and will immediately be identified as a Baptist.

 

Your premise is wrong. You think we suffer loss on account of sin, but no -- we suffer on account of our thought life, our SPIRIT. I want you to imagine "spirit made flesh" or "made physical." What is New Jerusalem made of, Mike? Streets of gold, precious stones, etc. Look at Rev 21:12-19 for a sampling. How do you think those things got there? What do you think YOUR "mansion" or "place" is going to look like?

I'll tell you one thing -- it won't be made with "wood, hay, and stubble!" No "3 little pigs" are gonna live in heaven! But if you don't bring it, you ain't gonna have it! And the way you bring it is to have thoughts, wisdom, and glory of God expressed in your life HERE AND NOW! Scripture says, "Be careful how you build on the foundation of Christ."

So do you see that our theology and practice directly impact our inheritance? Here's an example: ME is NOT acceptable in heaven. You believe ME. That is "wood, hay, or stubble" to God --- it's got to come out of your thinking, your spirit. It's "Cathmonic!"

Now our teaching you how to rightly integrate your thoughts about God's judgment of sin into your faith will be, for us, more "gold, silver, and precious stones." There is a place for what you adjure -- it's just NOT 1000 years in hell!

It would.

Yes, and we have said that. It's gonna be "Check your guns at the door, boys!" meaning your selfish desires, thoughts, and wisdom have no place up here.

But now you are talking sense. You're not talking 1000 years of hell now. You're taking OUR side.

I think I just explained it. It would be like beating your child over spilled milk, for heaven's sake! If you were a believer, you didn't mean to "spill" it (on a good profession, you did intend to not spill it, right?) -- but the milk is lost, and it is YOUR loss, and now we move on ... into GLORY!

skypair

 

I have been largely ignoring your acronyms, especially the above one, and didn't know what it meant until now. Many of you take too many things for granted, and assume too much. How much do we have in common? How much do we differ?

As pertaining to a literal Kingdom of a thousand years:
Yes I believe in the Millennial Kingdoom.

As pertaining to the JSOC relating to the Kingdom:
I believe what you would call Kingdom Accountability.
This may differ a bit in form than you. But it is quite evident that different believers will be rewarded differently, as they give account of themselves to God. "Well done my good and faithful servant..."

As pertaining to your weird acronym--EIREITAD (copy and paste)
No I don't believe that everyone will be rewarded. Does that surprise you?

1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.
--It is quite evident that some shall lose their reward. But they shall not be tormented for it. They still shall be saved, as the Scripture here declares. Their reward is lost. The JSOC is a time and place to see what rewards are gained and what rewards are lost. It, however, has nothing to do with chastisement or punishment.
And there is no hint of any Millennial Exclusion anywhere in the Bible. Thus I do not believe in this concept of a "Baptist Purgatory" which is the best name for it.

There is a rapture and a resurrection in which all believers will receive a glorified body.
When that takes place believers will be ushered into heaven into the presence of Christ.
Then we will stand before him at the JSOC.
We will be rewarded according to our works. Some will gain reward and some will lose reward. Remember that there is no time in eternity, so this is hard for us to comprehend.
At the end of seven earth years we all---all the saints in heaven--will come with Jesus at the time of the Second Coming, with his angels also, to defeat the armies that have gone up against Israel, and thus to set up the MK. At that time we (NT saints) will rule and reign with Christ in His Kingdom.
To conclude that any saint with a glorified body is going to suffer further torment in a purgatory like state is just a ridiculous concept--after being with Jesus in heaven for what could have seemed like an eternity. Remember there is no time in heaven. Time only relates to earth.