Gb93433, I disagree with the following statement you made:
"Disciples are much different than converts."
I did look at the web site you referenced. The author had some nice things to say about Dawson Trotman. I am certainly a Trotman fan, having been involved in the Navigators 2:7 discipleship program. I disagree with the following statement from the web site:
"You can lead a soul to Christ in from 20 minutes to a couple of hours. But it takes from 20 weeks to a couple of years to get him on the road to maturity, victorious over the sins and the recurring problems that come along."
http://www.bibleteacher.org/Dm118_8.htm
I believe that if a person is really a Christian, then he is a disciple. I don’t believe that a person can become a Christian and later become a disciple. A true convert is a disciple. A person is on the road to maturity at the moment he becomes a Christian. In the Great Commission (Matthew 28:19-20), Jesus said,
“Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.” (NASB)
Notice that we are to baptize disciples, not mere converts. The key verb is “make disciples” (matheteusate), and it is an aorist tense, active voice, imperative mood verb, indicating that it involves a command to do summarized action (punctiliar action) rather than continuing action. Of course, discipleship continues after a person becomes a disciple (the teaching in verse 20), but a person becomes a disciple at a point in time. Usually the aorist verb refers to action in the past, but the aorist imperative is different because a command is given with no consideration of past, present, or future time. The Greek scholar A.T. Robertson discussed the aorist imperative in his four-inch thick book on Greek grammar and pointed out the clarity of the imperative mood in comparison with the indicative mood:
"Here the distinction between the punctiliar (aorist) and the durative (present) is quite marked. Indeed Moulton (Prol., p. 129) holds that to get at “the essential character of aorist action, therefore, we must start with the other moods” than ind. It is easier, for the time element is absent."
Robertson, “A Grammar of the Greek New Testament in the Light of Historical Research” (Nashville: Broadman Press, 1934), page 855.
Some people argue that in the Hebrew way of thinking the baptizing and teaching are the details that fill out the overview of going and making disciples, but their argument has not yet convinced me. In other words, they say that the baptizing and teaching together form the discipling. The obvious point, however, is that Scripture never suggests that there is a point after conversion when a person becomes a disciple. There are levels of spiritual growth mentioned—the spiritual baby (1 Corinthians 3:1) and the person who is “mature” (Hebrews 5:14). The same Greek verb used for “make disciples” in Matthew 28:19 is also used in Acts 14:21:
“And after they had preached the gospel to that city and had made many disciples, they returned to Lystra and to Iconium and to Antioch.” (NASB)
Thus, the making of disciples was intimately related with preaching the gospel. The same verb is also found in Matthew 13:52:
“And He said to them, ‘Therefore every scribe who has become a disciple of the kingdom of heaven is like a head of a household, who brings forth out of his treasure things new and old.'”
The Greek preposition before kingdom is “eis” which can mean “into” or “unto.” Robertson, however, pointed out some manuscript differences:
"In Mt. 13:52 MSS. vary between the mere locative te Basileia and en with locative and eis with accusative."
Robertson, page 521.
The Textus Receptus uses “eis”; and the Westcott-Hort text does not use “eis.” So, “eis” would seem to indicate movement into the kingdom when a person becomes a disciple. Robertson says:
"Here a scribe is made a learner to the kingdom."
http://bible.crosswalk.com/Commentaries/RobertsonsWordPictures/rwp.cgi?book=mt&chapter=13&verse=52
In Luke 14:26-33 Jesus described disciples. He indicated that they were people who cared more about Him than their families or their lives. He also indicated that they were willing to take up the cross, follow Him, and give up everything for Him. This is summed up in our most recent Southern Baptist confession of faith, the 2000 Baptist Faith and Message:
"Repentance and faith are inseparable experiences of grace. Repentance is a genuine turning from sin toward God. Faith is the acceptance of Jesus Christ and commitment of the entire personality to Him as Lord and Saviour."
A person who has surrendered his life to Christ in repentance and faith is more than a convert; he is a disciple.
[ March 22, 2005, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: koreahog2005 ]
I'm not sure I'm in it.
