Modest Swim

[Hardsheller]

I was unaware as a young pastor that Mixed Bathing was synonymous with Males and Females swimming together.

--------------------------
A preacher was asked - "Pastor do you believe in mixed bathing?"

He replied - "No, the bathtub you provided in the parsonage is too small."

He was never asked that question again.
---------------------------

 

[timothy 1769]

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
Again, please explain how this is justification for modest swimwear.

it's not.

 

[timothy 1769]

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
Additionally, since we have all been deceived by what you deem to be a popular addition, perhaps you could shed light on what the true meaning is.

here's the true meaning:

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

note that it says ALL, not just those that do it for sexual gratification. ALL.

 

[HankD]

should we toss scripture as a guide to what god expects from us, then?

Matthew 5
28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut if off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Matthew 19
Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

Bye?

HankD

 

[Dr. Bob]

Originally posted by timothy 1769:
dr. bob, either you believe what the bible says here, or you don't.

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

so choose, i recommend taking the bible at face value.

btw, the bit about being only about transvestites is not in the text, but is a popular addition allowing this bit of scripture to be ignored.

You've missed a couple of salient points

(1) Even YOU do not believe you have to keep every command in the Bible. Or do you offer bullocks regularly. The Law made lousy Jews and even worse Christians.

(2) I didn't just suck the "transvestite" phrase out of my thumb. The word speaking of men wearing apparrel of women is using the common words for UNDERCLOTHING. It is saying a man parading around in a bra and panties is an abomination. THAT I believe.

To say then that this means a woman can't wear slacks or whatever is ludicrous.

Hope this clarifies.

 

[Jailminister]

Here are some basic rules that we need to measure our dress standards by:

1. Never try to "Christianize" the world's dress and make it your own. (Some ladies who live in jean skirts, for example, wear them every bit as tight as they used to wear their jeans! The idea behind wearing dresses and skirts was to make certain parts of your body literally INVISIBLE!)

2. Open, low necklines, sleeveless tops and dresses, short and slit skirts and dresses, tight, slinky, form-fitting attire and pants or shorts, have no place in a Christian woman's wardrobe. (You might say, "Sleeveless?! Oh, come on!" Ever notice what advertisers say about "bare" shoulders? Words like sexy, soft, and alluring are always right there.)

3. Culottes were invented in order to give a lady the freedom to move around-- i.e.. gardening, cleaning, bike riding, etc.-- and yet still look like she has a skirt on. If you want to wear culottes, make sure they look like a skirtfront and back.


In all areas of our lives, we should try to live godly. Let us especially be circumspect in our attire. The virtuous woman has the utmost respect for God and His Word. So the virtuous woman covers herself. And her husband praises her.

Encouragingly yours,

Liz


[Liz Graf is the wife of John Graf, Pastor of the The First Baptist Church, Sayville, New York. They are the parents of Jennifer (19), John (18), Timothy (15), and Ashley (12).

This seems to be some good advice from a lady to the ladies.

 

[Wisdom Seeker]

I am so glad not to be part of this attitude any more.

 

[Baptist in Richmond]

Originally posted by timothy 1769:
here's the true meaning:

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

note that it says ALL, not just those that do it for sexual gratification. ALL.

Wow, I sure am glad you amplified that with providing the "true meaning." I will inform the Rabbi that he is dead wrong.......

 

[Baptist in Richmond]

Originally posted by Jailminister:
Here are some basic rules that we need to measure our dress standards by:

1. Never try to "Christianize" the world's dress and make it your own. (Some ladies who live in jean skirts, for example, wear them every bit as tight as they used to wear their jeans! The idea behind wearing dresses and skirts was to make certain parts of your body literally INVISIBLE!)

2. Open, low necklines, sleeveless tops and dresses, short and slit skirts and dresses, tight, slinky, form-fitting attire and pants or shorts, have no place in a Christian woman's wardrobe. (You might say, "Sleeveless?! Oh, come on!" Ever notice what advertisers say about "bare" shoulders? Words like sexy, soft, and alluring are always right there.)

3. Culottes were invented in order to give a lady the freedom to move around-- i.e.. gardening, cleaning, bike riding, etc.-- and yet still look like she has a skirt on. If you want to wear culottes, make sure they look like a skirtfront and back.


In all areas of our lives, we should try to live godly. Let us especially be circumspect in our attire. The virtuous woman has the utmost respect for God and His Word. So the virtuous woman covers herself. And her husband praises her.

Encouragingly yours,

Liz


[Liz Graf is the wife of John Graf, Pastor of the The First Baptist Church, Sayville, New York. They are the parents of Jennifer (19), John (18), Timothy (15), and Ashley (12). [/b]

This seems to be some good advice from a lady to the ladies.

can't...............stop..............laughing.

It is interesting to note that there was no Scripture provided to support these claims.

 

[I Am Blessed 24]

1873 Bathing Suits for Women. Hand colored engraving from Harper’s Bazar, titled "Ladies’ and Misses’ Bathing or Gymnastic Suit."

HISTORY OF WOMEN'S SWIMWEAR

During the 18th century, spas where men and women engaged in public bathing began appearing in France and England. Men and women still bathed infrequently however and the typical "swim" was a brief dip in the water with ladies on one side of the beach and men on the other.

The earliest bathing suit may have possibly been an old smock resembling a kind of "bathing gown." Modesty was the dictum with style not much of a consideration in those days. The first suits were far from practical or comfortable; ladies went as far as to sewing lead weights into the hem of the "bathing gown" to prevent the dress from floating up and exposing her legs.

CLICK HERE FOR MORE HISTORY

 

[Jailminister]

Baptist in Richmond, Laugh all you want to laugh. I did not give this as scripture, it was some advise from a godly lady who happens to be a pastor's wife who has study the issue and has observed things over the year.
Just forget it I don't care. Let your daughter or wife go naked if you want to do so. Let them wear tight fitting close that exposes their body. You have to answer to God for that.

 

[timothy 1769]

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by timothy 1769:
here's the true meaning:

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

note that it says ALL, not just those that do it for sexual gratification. ALL.

Wow, I sure am glad you amplified that with providing the "true meaning." I will inform the Rabbi that he is dead wrong....... </font>[/QUOTE]funny, simply requoting scripture word for word, adding nothing whatsoever, somehow qualifies as "amplification".

rabbinc jews believe many ludicrous things about the bible - like adam was 80 ft tall and tried having sex with all the animals in eden. be sure to ask him about jesus, and while he's at it, have him explain why the biblical command prohibiting stealing doesn't apply to things belonging to gentiles.

today's orthodox rabbis (spiritual descendants of the pharisees) aren't bible experts - they're deluded, lost heretics. why any christian would venerate them is beyond me.

15:1 Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying, 2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread. 3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition? 4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death. 5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; 6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition. 7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying, 8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. 9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. 10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand: 11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man. 12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying? 13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up. 14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

obey jesus and "let them alone". follow them not and avoid the ditch!

 

[timothy 1769]

Originally posted by HankD:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr /> should we toss scripture as a guide to what god expects from us, then?

Matthew 5
28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart.
29 And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30 And if thy right hand offend thee, cut if off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

Matthew 19
Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.

Bye?

HankD </font>[/QUOTE]i believe the first without reservation. don't you? obviously we should be willing to give up anything that causes us to sin. regarding the second, it's questionable if this applies to everyone, but i've been looking into it. i feel that in general all of us (that includes me) are way, way too lax in living for jesus.

 

[timothy 1769]

Originally posted by Dr. Bob Griffin:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by timothy 1769:
dr. bob, either you believe what the bible says here, or you don't.

The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman’s garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

so choose, i recommend taking the bible at face value.

btw, the bit about being only about transvestites is not in the text, but is a popular addition allowing this bit of scripture to be ignored.

You've missed a couple of salient points

(1) Even YOU do not believe you have to keep every command in the Bible. Or do you offer bullocks regularly. The Law made lousy Jews and even worse Christians.

(2) I didn't just suck the "transvestite" phrase out of my thumb. The word speaking of men wearing apparrel of women is using the common words for UNDERCLOTHING. It is saying a man parading around in a bra and panties is an abomination. THAT I believe.

To say then that this means a woman can't wear slacks or whatever is ludicrous.

Hope this clarifies. </font>[/QUOTE]as i said earlier in this thread in general these commands are for the jews, but concerning crossdressing we know it applies to gentiles as well because of the extra info in the text. some other parts of old testament apply for the same reason.

simlah is used around 30 times in the old testament, always translated in the kjv as garment, clothes, raiment, cloth, apparel, or clothing, but never as underwear.

the same word is used in Ruth 3:3. should it be translated this way?

3:1 Then Naomi her mother in law said unto her, My daughter, shall I not seek rest for thee, that it may be well with thee? 2 And now is not Boaz of our kindred, with whose maidens thou wast? Behold, he winnoweth barley to night in the threshingfloor. 3 Wash thyself therefore, and anoint thee, and put thy BRA AND PANTIES upon thee, and get thee down to the floor: but make not thyself known unto the man, until he shall have done eating and drinking. 4 And it shall be, when he lieth down, that thou shalt mark the place where he shall lie, and thou shalt go in, and uncover his feet, and lay thee down; and he will tell thee what thou shalt do.

in deut 22:5 my kjv doesn't say underwear, nor any of the other versions i've checked. in this case i think i'll go with combined scholarship of every major english bible translation over your opinion.

i do agree that this verse says nothing about pants per se. the question is: in our culture are pants men's clothing? they certainly used to be.

 

[Baptist in Richmond]

Sorry for my delay in responding to this as I was in Summit, NJ on business.....

Originally posted by timothy 1769:
rabbinc [sic] jews believe many ludicrous things about the bible - like adam was 80 ft tall and tried having sex with all the animals in eden. be sure to ask him about jesus, and while he's at it, have him explain why the biblical command prohibiting stealing doesn't apply to things belonging to gentiles.

Direct quote from rabbi: "Adam was 80 feet tall and tried having sex with the animals in the garden? Perhaps you could persuade him to teach me Hebrew, as he is offering himself out as an expert?"

today's orthodox rabbis (spiritual descendants of the pharisees) aren't bible experts - they're deluded, lost heretics. why any christian would venerate them is beyond me.

Ah, yes: once again you invoke your favorite word - heretic. Let's see: if memory serves me well, that is the fourth person to be impugned by your recalcitrance.

To address your last comment, I venerate this rabbi [to usurp your word (suprisingly appropriate for my attitude towards him)] because he is wise, gracious, congenial, and shares my deep love for the Lord God of Abraham. Moreover, I make an effort to display the love of Christ to him, and pray for him every single day.

 

[timothy 1769]

Originally posted by Baptist in Richmond:
Direct quote from rabbi: "Adam was 80 feet tall and tried having sex with the animals in the garden? Perhaps you could persuade him to teach me Hebrew, as he is offering himself out as an expert?"

can he sing as well as dance?

To address your last comment, I venerate this rabbi [to usurp your word (suprisingly appropriate for my attitude towards him)] because he is wise, gracious, congenial, and shares my deep love for the Lord God of Abraham.

no, he doesn't.

John 14
21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Given the knowledge and opportunity, has he repented and been baptized? if not, he doesn't love God.

24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father’s which sent me.

Rabbinic Jews are idolators. They have lovingly created their own false god to worship and carefully pass it down from generation to generation, denying the true Living God.

If you have to venerate a Rabbi, try Jesus of Nazareth

Moreover, I make an effort to display the love of Christ to him, and pray for him every single day.

I think that's good, but try preaching the gospel to him.

1Corinthians 1:21
For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

I will pray as well.

 

[Baptist in Richmond]

Originally posted by timothy 1769:
can he sing as well as dance?

I will allow this comment to stand on its own merit....

To address your last comment, I venerate this rabbi [to usurp your word (suprisingly appropriate for my attitude towards him)] because he is wise, gracious, congenial, and shares my deep love for the Lord God of Abraham.

no, he doesn't.

Actually, yes he does.

Rabbinic Jews are idolators. They have lovingly created their own false god to worship and carefully pass it down from generation to generation, denying the true Living God.

Well, at least you finally spelled it correctly...
Once again, I will allow your puerile generalizations stand on their own merit.

 

[timothy 1769]

Baptist: To address your last comment, I venerate this rabbi [to usurp your word (suprisingly appropriate for my attitude towards him)] because he is wise, gracious, congenial, and shares my deep love for the Lord God of Abraham.

Tim: no, he doesn't. [words of Jesus snipped]

Baptist: Actually, yes he does.

--

John 14
21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father’s which sent me.

You accept Jesus as the God of Abraham, correct? If your rabbi knows about but doesn't keep the sayings of Jesus (including repentance and baptism), he doesn't love the God of Abraham, period.

Perhaps he will one day though.

 

[Baptist in Richmond]

Undoubtedly, "words [sic] of Jesus snipped" was undoubtedly interjected for my edification. Please consult John 1:1 and you will find that "Word" is capitalized.

Originally posted by timothy 1769:
If your rabbi knows about but doesn't keep the sayings of Jesus (including repentance and baptism), he doesn't love the God of Abraham, period.

Once again, you are wrong: in fact, you are DEAD WRONG. I am sure that you will quote the Scriptural Passage a third time, and I will once again maintain that you are still dead wrong. Do I accept Jesus as the Lord God of Abraham? Of course. Does he? Not yet. Does he love the Lord God of Abraham (God the Father) as much as I do? Yep.
I especially enjoyed the "period" you interjected. That is quite an assertive statement, given the fact that you don't even know the beloved rabbi.

 

[timothy 1769]

Thanks for the capitalization tips.

Perhaps if I break this down some more you will understand my point. Consider the following four statements:

1) Jesus is God
2) Jesus says those who love him obey him
3) Your rabbi does not obey Jesus
4) Your rabbi loves God

Now at least one of the statements must be false. Obviously 1 and 2 are true and if you grant me 3 then 4 must be it.

Do you see another possibility?