More Evidential Confirmation of the Big Bang Theory

[OldRegular]

No matter who screams the loudest, there really is no need to choose between science and the Bible.

That depends on what you call science!

They just are not in conflict--not unless you READ INTO the Biblical account that which it does not say.

The Biblical account states simply that God Created. In fact if you read carefully Scripture tells us how He created.

Genesis, Chapter 1

1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

3. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

6. And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

9. And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

11. And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

14. And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

20. And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

24. And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.

26. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

29. And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

Remarkable what Scripture tells us, isn't it!

 

[quantumfaith]

Hello Qf,

As i know you have a lust for anything academic if i was going to seek some science that could possibly go along with biblical revelation...i would look more into this...as it can be reconciled with the biblical account of creation......even thought it is undeveloped to an extent;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biU3W0w2Oq0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YGAo5uLCPio

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuANDlrTHyI
They deny God....however this concept i believe can mesh with Hebrews 11:3...the images in our brain take in what God allows us to "see". What do you think on this QF...there are dozens of longer versions of these two examples.

Thanks Icon, I will take a look at your links. I would "suggest" that I do "LUST" after science. I have heard this "hologram" idea before, I would not take that position.

 

[quantumfaith]

That depends on what you call science!

The Biblical account states simply that God Created. In fact if you read carefully Scripture tells us how He created.

Genesis, Chapter 1

1. In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

3. And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

6. And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

9. And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

11. And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

14. And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:

20. And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

24. And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.

26. And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

29. And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

Remarkable what Scripture tells us, isn't it!

OR, what do YOU call science?

 

[Iconoclast]

Thanks Icon, I will take a look at your links. I would "suggest" that I do "LUST" after science. I have heard this "hologram" idea before, I would not take that position.

:laugh:Qf..enjoy the links, however they are mostly unbelievers doing the speculation....I have more of a hybrid view...I believe that there are celestial bodies as scripture speaks of....and yet...I do not believe all have to be uniform, ie....light years and light years away...perhaps another thread sometime....but enjoy the ideas in the links:wavey:

PS...Some science is indeed good and needful...if they keep God at the center of their searching...many seek to oppose God and his revealed truth and will for mankind,and go contrary to the Dominion mandate.

 

[Judith]

Judith, I believe that saving faith is a gift of God and is not the same as believing that jumping out of a plane with a parachute is in any way similar to saving faith.

Martyn Lloyd-Jones in his book, God The Holy Spirit, page 140 makes the following argument [Paraphrased for brevity.]

“It is unfortunate that all too often saving faith is compared to the choices that people make in life. The argument is as follows :

Faith is a natural faculty that every person has. You are always exercising faith in your life, you couldn’t live a day without doing so. You exercise faith when you go out to start your car. You exercise faith when you board an airplane. Just as you trust that the car will start and the airplane will arrive safely, why don’t you trust Jesus Christ as Savior?

“In fact starting a car or boarding an airplane have nothing to do with faith, rather they have to do with an understanding [to a greater or lesser degree] that the probability of the desired event will happen. Therefore, such a comparison is meaningless.“




You say Actually Judith it is for the very reason you say that belief in the Big Bang is a kind of faith. Recall that Scripture tells us: Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.{Hebrews 11:1} Now those people who believe in cosmological evolution are believing in mumbo jumbo. They do this , in my opinion, because they are hoping to demonstrate that God had nothing to do with creation. That is the substance of things they hope for even in the absence of anything other than vivid imaginations and the ability to manipulate mathematical equations.

I believe I stated earlier that evolution is the religion of atheists. I also believe there is an element of faith/belief in any religion!

You must have miss-read my post. I do not believe that believing in the big bang is faith. To be kind I believe it is an exercise in futility or a lack of faith, but certainly not faith of any kind. I used an earthly example to refute any such claim not promote it. Perhaps I was not very clear in my other post.

 

[quantumfaith]

:laugh:Qf..enjoy the links, however they are mostly unbelievers doing the speculation....I have more of a hybrid view...I believe that there are celestial bodies as scripture speaks of....and yet...I do not believe all have to be uniform, ie....light years and light years away...perhaps another thread sometime....but enjoy the ideas in the links:wavey:

PS...Some science is indeed good and needful...if they keep God at the center of their searching...many seek to oppose God and his revealed truth and will for mankind,and go contrary to the Dominion mandate.

I apologize, just now getting back. I meant to say that I do NOT "lust" after science.

Yes, MANY scientists fall into either agnostic or atheist ranks. Some because they feel intellectual accuracy may be biased, others from a rabid anti-theist place.

There are also multitudes of theist and faithful Christians who are also scientists and scientifically minded. Science, as an intellectual discipline is not of necessity "godless".

 

[nodak]

Many of the most godly men I have known were geologists, therefore scientists. They based their belief in an old earth, complete with the big bang, on the Scripture, not science.

That science backs up scripture if you read scripture honestly, without a fundamentalist agenda to prove YEC, was nice.

But everyone of them I've known, had the opposite been true, would have gone with the Bible.

 

[OldRegular]

Many of the most godly men I have known were geologists, therefore scientists. They based their belief in an old earth, complete with the big bang, on the Scripture, not science.

Could you perhaps provide that Scripture that teaches an old earth for usens on this here Forum who are ignorant. Weuns would also like to see that big ole bang in the Bible. I bet thers a pichur!

That science backs up scripture if you read scripture honestly, without a fundamentalist agenda to prove YEC, was nice.

Could you perhaps provide that there Scripture that teaches an old earth for usens on this here Forum who are ignorant.

But everyone of them I've known, had the opposite been true, would have gone with the Bible.

Geology has historically denied a catastrophic history of the earth and assumed a uniformitarian history because the so-called fossil layers would then support the old earth postulate. It is my understanding that the evidence is now forcing geologists to finally recognize a catastrophic history of the earth.

 

[nodak]

OldRegular, if you want to understand the Biblical basis of old earth creationism, google it. There are very many sites out there explaining that point of view.

Now, once you understand it, you may still disagree with it. That is fine.

I personally haven't met any geologists being forced by any current science to change their views to account for catastrophism. But I do hear that a lot from YEC'ers.

 

[OldRegular]

OldRegular, if you want to understand the Biblical basis of old earth creationism, google it. There are very many sites out there explaining that point of view.

I have studied the Bible and I see nothing in it that supports an old earth theory. Scripture teaches that death entered the world through the first couple, Adam and Eve. Old earth disputes that teaching. Now if there were no Adam and Eve there was no fall and this Forum is meaningless!

I personally haven't met any geologists being forced by any current science to change their views to account for catastrophism. But I do hear that a lot from YEC'ers.

The catastrophic history of the earth shows that the use of the so-called fossil layers prove little to nothing. In fact the very idea of uniformitarian history of the earth dictates against fossils.

 

[Sapper Woody]

It is IMPOSSIBLE for science to go contrary to the Bible. The two NEVER disagree in anything. Now, men's perceptions of one or both might make it seem so, just like there are times where the Bible seems to contradict itself. The problem is not with science. It is with scientists who allow preconceived notions to cloud their objectivity.

If science were to be contrary to the scripture, then God would cease to exist, as He is the one who put all these scientific facts into place and if they disagreed with Him, He'd be contradicting Himself and lying.

 

[Judith]

Judith, I believe that saving faith is a gift of God and is not the same as believing that jumping out of a plane with a parachute is in any way similar to saving faith.

Martyn Lloyd-Jones in his book, God The Holy Spirit, page 140 makes the following argument [Paraphrased for brevity.]

“It is unfortunate that all too often saving faith is compared to the choices that people make in life. The argument is as follows :

Faith is a natural faculty that every person has. You are always exercising faith in your life, you couldn’t live a day without doing so. You exercise faith when you go out to start your car. You exercise faith when you board an airplane. Just as you trust that the car will start and the airplane will arrive safely, why don’t you trust Jesus Christ as Savior?

“In fact starting a car or boarding an airplane have nothing to do with faith, rather they have to do with an understanding [to a greater or lesser degree] that the probability of the desired event will happen. Therefore, such a comparison is meaningless.“




You say Actually Judith it is for the very reason you say that belief in the Big Bang is a kind of faith. Recall that Scripture tells us: Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.{Hebrews 11:1} Now those people who believe in cosmological evolution are believing in mumbo jumbo. They do this , in my opinion, because they are hoping to demonstrate that God had nothing to do with creation. That is the substance of things they hope for even in the absence of anything other than vivid imaginations and the ability to manipulate mathematical equations.

I believe I stated earlier that evolution is the religion of atheists. I also believe there is an element of faith/belief in any religion!

Substance is real or demonistrated as proven, not guessing.