More ignore the National Anthem and take a knee!

[Zaac]

I take from this that you DO agree the NFL has the authority to fine, suspend, or ban those who express ideas the league does not like. Correct?

ed. "...the league does not like" or else challenges the image the league wishes to present for itself.

You should take it that the league has a clause that says they can discipline players, owners etc. for conduct detrimental to the league.

Ain't nothing detrimental in what Kaepernick is doing and there's no league rule that says the players have to stand for the anthem.

 

[Alcott]

You should take it that the league has a clause that says they can discipline players, owners etc. for conduct detrimental to the league.

Ain't nothing detrimental in what Kaepernick is doing and there's no league rule that says the players have to stand for the anthem.

Those other cases I mentioned-- the only way they were "detrimental"-- damaging, harmful-- to the league was that they get some people talking negatively about them. That is the same case here... except that not Schott nor Campanis, nor Snyder made any kind of gestures meant to incite violence.

 

[carpro]

Why are people so obsessed about what others do? The people who are obsessed about the protests give the protests what power they have.

I don't care if they sit, stand, kneel, stand on their head... It's their business and it doesn't bother me that other people have different opinions than I do.

It's a little deeper than that to some of us. And it's not a matter of opinion, but one of respect. Disrespect of the flag or the national anthem is a slap in the face to many that have faithfully served this country in difficult times.

I carry around in my head the names of 21 men that I either saw die in the service of this country, or knew them first hand and know when , where , and how they died. The stars and stripes graced each one of their caskets and that flag was handed off to a wife or mother or nearest relative with the greatest of respect and care. I have the flag that covered my father's casket. Our national anthem is all about that flag.

Kaepernick and his ilk, who have sacrificed nothing for this country, but have been some of the biggest beneficiaries of the opportunities offered here, that were paid for by the blood of better men, deserve all the scorn that can be heaped on them.

For someone to disrespect me doesn't bother me that much, but disrespect the sacrifice of the 21 men I knew personally who gave everything they had to give in the service of this country....well...it hits me on a completely different level.

 

[Zaac]

It's a little deeper than that to some of us. And it's not a matter of opinion, but one of respect. Disrespect of the flag or the national anthem is a slap in the face to many that have faithfully served this country in difficult times.

I carry around in my head the names of 21 men that I either saw die in the service of this country, or knew them first hand and know when , where , and how they died. The stars and stripes graced each one of their caskets and that flag was handed off to a wife or mother or nearest relative with the greatest of respect and care. I have the flag that covered my father's casket. Our national anthem is all about that flag.

Kaepernick and his ilk, who have sacrificed nothing for this country, but have been some of the biggest beneficiaries of the opportunities offered here, that were paid for by the blood of better men, deserve all the scorn that can be heaped on them.

For someone to disrespect me doesn't bother me that much, but disrespect the sacrifice of the 21 men I knew personally who gave everything they had to give in the service of this country....well...it hits me on a completely different level.

And like I said, y'all keep taking about disrespect for the folks who have served and died. It's equally disrespectful of the families whose loved ones have been murdered to again and again see no indictment or prosecution or attempts to carry out due process.

So your feeling of disrespect for the 21 should clue you in to the level of disrespect and marginalization of their lives that Blacks keep speaking to for the hundreds and hundreds of unarmed black people who keep getting murdered by police.

But we both know that it won't because certain lives just don't mean as much in these grand old United States. And thus the reason for not standing to honor that which so many think deserves to be honored while treating others as second class citizens whose lives matter less.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk

 

[Salty]

It's a little deeper than that to some of us. And it's not a matter of opinion, but one of respect. Disrespect of the flag or the national anthem is a slap in the face to many that have faithfully served this country in difficult times. ...
... For someone to disrespect me doesn't bother me that much, but disrespect the sacrifice of the 21 men I knew personally who gave everything they had to give in the service of this country....well...it hits me on a completely different level.

I would like to know why Zaac said he disagrees with this post.

 

[Don]

The problem is, taking a knee isn't changing anything, and isn't going to change anything. Increase awareness? Okay; so what next?

Expecting an overnight change in social awareness/consciousness because you took a knee? Isn't gonna happen.

USE THE SYSTEM. Change the laws. Take advantage of education as much as possible, but don't wait for someone to educate you; educate yourself. Get into the legal system. Get elected. Introduce legislation; get it passed. Make it the law of the land.

Our system is set up to allow for changes; that's one of the greatest things about this nation. Get involved in the system, and use the system to effect change.

Stop waiting on old, rich, white men and women to do it for you.

Take a knee, then go back to your million dollar paycheck and sleep well because you made someone "aware"? And now you hope someone else does something about it?

 

[Revmitchell]

Taking a knee is much like the riots. It has the opposite desire effect. It simply makes mad those with whom they want sympathy from for their issue. So long as they continue to act in this immature manner and disrespectful as well then they will never obtain the sympathy they are looking for.

 

[carpro]

I would like to know why Zaac said he disagrees with this post.

Nobody should care. I certainly don't.

But I suspect it's because he hasn't paid his dues and resents those who have.

 

[righteousdude2]

I would like to know why Zaac said he disagrees with this post.

Salty - he disagrees with this post because he is ZAAC! He is always contrary to what others believe and say! And believe me, you will never get a reason out of him; probably because he doesn't know why he disagrees, he just has to disagree! He has more posts of disagreement then he does explaining why and how he arrived at that conclusion! What does that say about him?! Second ... and more importantly, any post with my name attached to it will get his contrary comments and disagreement! Too bad, and so sad! Because like you, I'd love to know why he disagrees and even more than that, how he arrives at his conclusions! and

 

[righteousdude2]

Those who would disrespect our flag,
Have never been handed a folded one! ​

 

[Zaac]

I would like to know why Zaac said he disagrees with this post.

I would like to know where you see the word disagrees in my post? I believe folks who feel disrespected are the very ones who should be able to empathize with why others feel that way.

So if someone thinks them being disrespected means more than someone else feeling disrespected, it just is what it is.

 

[Zaac]

Nobody should care. I certainly don't.

But I suspect it's because he hasn't paid his dues and resents those who have.

Oh I know YOU don't care. That's really why no I nor a whole lot of other folks really care that folks like you feel that what Kaepernick is doing is disrespectful to those who have fought and died. Your view is hypocritical at best, but that's nothing new.

You think they should show respect for your "21" and their lives lost but you and others like you show no respect for the black lives lost.

So bump you and the horse you rode in on. Kaepernick and the ones doing what he is doing are 100% correct.

BLACK LIVES MATTER TOO.

And they don't matter any less than the lives of the 21 folks you saw die or knew.

 

[Judith]

Simple solution, boycott the teams allowing this and contact their sponsors letting them know they too will be boycotted if they continue to advertise with them.

 

[Zaac]

Those who would disrespect our flag,
Have never been handed a folded one! ​

Those who marginalize and undervalue black lives at the hands of murderous police officers generally aren't black.

 

[Zaac]

Simple solution, boycott the teams allowing this and contact their sponsors letting them know they too will be boycotted if they continue to advertise with them.

And an even simpler solution will be more and more players choosing to kneel and not stand and not play if their teams decide they have to stand.

Odd that a boycott of the teams would be mentioned because some disagree with what some players are doing. But the same folks have a problem with the players choosing to express their rights and not stand for the anthem.

 

[HankD]

It's a United States of America citizen's right to peacefully disrespect this nation.

It's also denying those who feel compelled to do this the right to "the pursuit of happiness".

I don't like what they do but it is their unalienable right.

It is also my right to take offense and respond in a peaceful manner.


HankD

 

[Zaac]

It's a United States of America citizen's right to peacefully disrespect this nation.

It's also denying those who feel compelled to do this the right to "the pursuit of happiness".

I don't like what they do but it is their unalienable right.

It is also my right to take offense and respond in a peaceful manner.


HankD

Well said Hank. If they want to express their rights, then more power to them. We don't have to like it or agree with it. But some of the responses on this board highlight the truth behind the crux of why Kaepernick started not standing.

 

[Don]

I would like to know where you see the word disagrees in my post?

You didn't use the word "disagree"; you rated Carpro's post, #23 of this thread as "disagree."

 

[Zaac]

The problem is, taking a knee isn't changing anything, and isn't going to change anything. Increase awareness? Okay; so what next?

It's like the killing of the little girls in the church in Birmingham. To a lot of white people, the loss of black life at the hands of police doesn't mean much because I think it's either on ignore or just hasn't been made real.

This is continuing the conversation whether or not folks want to believe it.

Expecting an overnight change in social awareness/consciousness because you took a knee? Isn't gonna happen.

I don't think that's what he was expecting. That's why he's still kneeling.

USE THE SYSTEM. Change the laws. Take advantage of education as much as possible, but don't wait for someone to educate you; educate yourself. Get into the legal system. Get elected. Introduce legislation; get it passed. Make it the law of the land.

Our system is set up to allow for changes; that's one of the greatest things about this nation. Get involved in the system, and use the system to effect change.

Stop waiting on old, rich, white men and women to do it for you.

Take a knee, then go back to your million dollar paycheck and sleep well because you made someone "aware"? And now you hope someone else does something about it?

Use the system to do what? To convince white people that there is a systemic policing problem in this country that is biased toward black and brown people when every other word from so many white people is that there isn't a problem?

The more I look at what Kaepernick has started, the more impressed I become. You want to know what will generate some change and actual real attention to this issue? When the NFL can't ignore it because all of the black and brown players are kneeling or not playing. The folks with the money suddenly agree that there really is a problem.

 

[Don]

Use the system to do what? To convince white people that there is a systemic policing problem in this country that is biased toward black and brown people when every other word from so many white people is that there isn't a problem?

And THAT is the perfect exemplification of what I wrote. Why do you need to "convince white people"? Isn't that the basic problem here: the dependency on the old, rich, white people to "take care of us"?

Use the system to change the laws. How hard is that to understand? If you can't get your congressperson to introduce state and/or federal laws that will change the system, then get into politics, get yourself elected, and make it happen yourself. Get into the police department, work hard to be a leader, and change the institution from within.

You're telling us there's a problem; I'm offering solutions. Kneeling during the national anthem is an attempt to tell us there's a problem; what has Colin done to provide a solution? Said that he'd donate a million dollars to a charity? Has he done it? And how is that going to solve the problem?

"Hippies" during the 60's harped about raising social consciousness; where are they now? (answer: in corporate board rooms, sitting at their $10,000 desk in their multi-million dollar law firm, etc., etc.) Quit telling us there's a problem, and let's actually do something about it.