More on Global Warming & Arctic Ice

[Marcia]

Any of you remember the Los Angeles smog problem 30 years ago? Was It solved because the Big Three auto makers voluntarily cleaned their exhaust emissions? Is the entire US worse off because of the EPA regulations? Any of you remember when a major river in Pennsylvania (?) caught on fire because of the pollution? Did the good Republican factory owners voluntarily clean up their act? Any of you good Republican Libertarians going to argue that we need more pollution from coal in order to combat global cooling? Bottom line, do we need a complicated reason to cut air and water pollution? Isn't clean air and water reason enough?

But what's going on and being proposed is much more than just cutting air and water pollution, which is old hat.

It's about our "carbon footprint" and giving us guilt for hurting the earth with our very existence. I was once in the animal rights movement and thus connected to the environmental movement. I know how people in that movement think.

Besides, as I've said before, I'm vegetarian and saving gobs of land for crops by not eating meat (since animals for meat must use up more land). It also saves the earth in other ways (though that is not why I'm vegetarian). So when I see those concerned for the earth giving up meat, along with their private jets and cars, I'll listen to them, maybe.

 

[billwald]

AGREE that humans are more important than humans and I don't care if barred owls move west of the mountains and push out the spotted owls. That's how evolution is supposed to work. But we can't kill off the bottom of the food chain and keep eating.

 

[rbell]

AGREE that humans are more important than humans and I don't care if barred owls move west of the mountains and push out the spotted owls. That's how evolution is supposed to work. But we can't kill off the bottom of the food chain and keep eating.

OK...our water and air got cleaned up without these stupid, draconian, "carbon footprint" legislations. So what's their point?

Secondly, what on earth is the above post about?

 

[Ed Edwards]

AGREE that humans are more important than humans and I don't care if barred owls move west of the mountains and push out the spotted owls. That's how evolution is supposed to work. But we can't kill off the bottom of the food chain and keep eating.

it makes more sense to me if read this way:

AGREE that humans are more important than non-humans and I don't care if barred owls move west of the mountains and push out the spotted owls. That's how evolution is supposed to work. But we can't kill off the bottom of the food chain and keep eating.

Save the Veggies - don't fry growing veggies!

 

[baptistteacher]

Here's the NewsWeek article from April 28, 1975:


The Cooling World
Newsweek, April 28, 1975

"There are ominous signs that the Earth’s weather patterns have begun to change dramatically and that these changes may portend a drastic decline in food production – with serious political implications for just about every nation on Earth. The drop in food output could begin quite soon, perhaps only 10 years from now. The regions destined to feel its impact are the great wheat-producing lands of Canada and the U.S.S.R. in the North, along with a number of marginally self-sufficient tropical areas – parts of India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Indochina and Indonesia – where the growing season is dependent upon the rains brought by the monsoon.

The evidence in support of these predictions has now begun to accumulate so massively that meteorologists are hard-pressed to keep up with it. In England, farmers have seen their growing season decline by about two weeks since 1950, with a resultant overall loss in grain production estimated at up to 100,000 tons annually. During the same time, the average temperature around the equator has risen by a fraction of a degree – a fraction that in some areas can mean drought and desolation. Last April, in the most devastating outbreak of tornadoes ever recorded, 148 twisters killed more than 300 people and caused half a billion dollars’ worth of damage in 13 U.S. states.

To scientists, these seemingly disparate incidents represent the advance signs of fundamental changes in the world’s weather. The central fact is that after three quarters of a century of extraordinarily mild conditions, the earth’s climate seems to be cooling down. Meteorologists disagree about the cause and extent of the cooling trend, as well as over its specific impact on local weather conditions. But they are almost unanimous in the view that the trend will reduce agricultural productivity for the rest of the century. If the climatic change is as profound as some of the pessimists fear, the resulting famines could be catastrophic. “A major climatic change would force economic and social adjustments on a worldwide scale,” warns a recent report by the National Academy of Sciences, “because the global patterns of food production and population that have evolved are implicitly dependent on the climate of the present century.”

A survey completed last year by Dr. Murray Mitchell of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reveals a drop of half a degree in average ground temperatures in the Northern Hemisphere between 1945 and 1968. According to George Kukla of Columbia University, satellite photos indicated a sudden, large increase in Northern Hemisphere snow cover in the winter of 1971-72. And a study released last month by two NOAA scientists notes that the amount of sunshine reaching the ground in the continental U.S. diminished by 1.3% between 1964 and 1972. …"

(The article continues.)

A PDF of the original article is available here:

http://denisdutton.com/newsweek_coolingworld.pdf

 

[baptistteacher]

The Ice Age Cometh: Experts Warn of Global Cooling
'Lou Dobbs Tonight' segment dismisses manmade global warming theory -- 'effects of greenhouse gas have a small impact on climate change.'

By Jeff Poor
Business & Media Institute
1/15/2009 1:18:37 PM

"If you’re fortunate enough to have it – don’t sell that oceanfront property for fear that the icecaps will melt, and rising seas swamping your property. A segment on CNN’s Jan. 13 “Lou Dobbs Tonight” explored the possibility that earth isn’t warming, but is, in fact, cooling. …

According to D’Aleo, the spike in NOAA climate data is a result of location changes where the data is recorded. He contended that with the proportional increase of urban data used versus rural data, the overall effect was a warming trend.

“Those global data sets are contaminated by the fact that two-third of the globe’s stations dropped out in 1990,” D’Aleo added. “Most of them rural and they performed no urban adjustment. And, Lou, you know, your people in your studio know that if they live in the suburbs of New York City, it’s a lot colder in rural areas than it is in the city. Now we have more urban effect in those numbers reflecting, that show up in that enhanced or exaggerated warming in the global data set.”

Another factor contributing to the global cooling period is the decline in sunspot activity according to Jay Lehr, a senior fellow and science director of The Heartland Institute. …"

Full article: http://www.businessandmedia.org/printer/2009/20090114065138.aspx

So, looks like the debate is not over, "Man-made Global Warming" is not a confirmed fact, or even a consensus, no matter what Al Gore says. Besides, science is not determined by consensus, but by facts.

 

[LadyEagle]

3-page warning: This thread will be closed no sooner than 1:00 p.m. ET by one of the moderators.

LE

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Warm it up! I will have beachfront property with a view of the Rocky Mountains right here in Colorado!! :laugh:

 

[Ed Edwards]

I'll be living at the bottom of the Gulf of Kansas ;-)

 

[Magnetic Poles]

I'll be living at the bottom of the Gulf of Kansas ;-)

Brother Ed, you and the Missus can camp out at my seaside campground, no charge! :thumbs:

 

[LadyEagle]

Closed per prior warning. LE