Mothers,wives, and priorities

[Molly]

Neither of these examples show that they worked outside the home--

 

[donnA]

The Word of God teaches that a woman is to be a keeper of the home. We cannot be a keeper of the home if we are not there.

I have a friend who keeps her home spotless, and her kids and their clothes clean, and cooks everynight, except when her husband whats to eat out, but now thats shes put the whole family on a diet isn't too often anymore. But, she does all this and works 40 hours a week. Keeper of the home, is one who takes care of her own home. Now one who never goes out the door.

 

[donnA]

Did your mother work outside the home or was she a homemaker?

Yes and no. She worked sometimes, and stayed home most of the time. I remember before Iw ent to school my mother worked in as ewing factiry, and we had the most wonderful older woman for a babysitter, and stayed out on their farm. Since our grandmother on my mom's side lived in Chicago, she was our substute grandmother. We loved her.

My grandmother on the other hand, did work. She made tanks during WWII, her and other women like her built the machinery that helped the men win the war.

 

[donnA]

Neither of these examples show that they worked outside the home

Acts16:4Now a certain woman named Lydia heard us. She was a seller of purple from the city of Thyatira,

Lydis was outside the home at the point that they met or saw her, because it sasy she was "from the city Thyatira", which shows she was not in her home, or in her home town.

They were working women, you just refuse to see scripture that disagrees with you, and as I have noticed anytime you disagree you call it taking scripture out of context. You just don't care to see that there were women in the bible who worked and earned money. Do you think the Proverbs 31 woman looked at a field and considered it from inside her house?

Acts9: 39Then Peter arose and went with them. When he had come, they brought him to the upper room. And all the widows stood by him weeping, showing the tunics and garments which Dorcas had made while she was with them

She worked to make clothing, it doesn't matter if she earned her money sewing at home or a sewing factory.

It may be best for you and your family if you stay home,(it was the right thing for our family) but it may not be best for every family. You can not say it is, nor can you dictate God's will for everyone else.

 

[Clint Kritzer]

Hi Karen -

originally posted by Karen: Yet I wonder why this subject makes you as mad as it does.

First of all let me state that I have not typed anything in anger. My typos are always a dead giveaway of that and I only remember doing so three times since I have joined this board and not on this subject.

My problem with this whole thing is that this board is visited by about a thousand people a day and we never know the intent of their coming here. Some may be curious, others scoffing, some evaluating us against their own beliefs, and some actually looking for answers. It frustrates me to no end that a small click will gang up on someone and try to tell them what God's Will is because of seven disjointed words in the New Testament and a lot of presumptions made on other scriptural references.

Personally, I think that the Apostle Paul would have fallen over in a faint if he had ever suspicioned that his words would be used as an excuse for someone to not use the talents that God gave them. I don't see you on a lot, but this all began in this forum on the 26th of April with this thread: http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=10&t=001260&p=

and that thread was triggered by this one: http://www.baptistboard.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=14&t=000279&p=

If you take some time and read through these threads, you will see a judgemental attitude that is absolutely unwarranted and definitely, non-Christian.

So say some Christian teenage girl comes through here and wants to go to college because she's got some real talent to help this world but she's about to marry her boyfriend after graduation. Why should she try to better herself? What if she buys into this dictate of what God's Will is? Even worse, suppose she is a weak Christian and knows that an education and job are her calling and turns away from Christianity thinking that this minority voice is represenative of the whole?

Have we furthered the Kingdom of God in allowing this? Is that what this Christian ministry of a priesthood of believers is looking to accomplish?

I don't care who works and who doesn't. I really don't. I don't approve of laziness or idleness, but if a person feels that they have accomplished something in a day and they feel good about it, then more power to them. But for someone to tell me that my wife and I are not listening to God, or to CONVINCE someone else that they are not living according to God's Will from an anonymous position on the internet, in my mind, is intolerable, especially on a BAPTIST board!!!

This subject usually sits down in the women's forum and basically the women who work and the ones who support them either stay quiet and roll their eyes. Every so often, however, one of these women will speak up and when she does, Lord help her! There's power in numbers and arrogance in power and that one woman will be rebuked mercilessly by her own sisters in Christ. Invariably they are told, "Well, you just don't know the Bible." That's when it gets WRONG!

So Margie started this up here, and sister, I DO know the Bible and I also know how to research it.

After watching a dozen women leave this board, one of our sisters was being ganged up on and this one has some real needs at this point in her life. She is need of good Christian fellowship and she came to the Baptist Board to find some of it and what did she hear?

I simply don't understand women today.

I don't understand what it is that the family has to have that the husband cannot provied.

When you do things God's way, He blesses you and you are happy.

I think from example of the OT law and the commandments given to the church, that if a woman is not under a husband, then she is to place herself back under her father or male relative.

career is thumbs down- you know, a suit every day, a sitter or daycare every day, but not a few hours here or there to get away so that you can come back refreshed!

I feel some are forced to work and hense put the children aside but others choose to work to make their children's life what they think will be "better" which is just insane.

I could go on but I'm sure you've read it all before.

I have a personal commitment to this board and the goals under which it was established. This isn't about who is holier, or better, or Godlier. This board is about understanding and Christian fellowship and what we as Baptist want to project to the world.

So don't think that I'm mad. In fact, please bear in mind that I have the ability to completely delete this topic into cyber ash, but I would never do that. Instead, I will debate it and I will use the Scriptures to do so. We've been seeing each other on here for half a year now Karen, and I think by now you may realize that I am a man who stands by his convictions.

Someday, Karen, I may come to your aid as well. But for now, it's the women who have been spiritually battered by their very own sisters in Christ.

 

[donnA]

Benefits you recieve from working women,
food, they work to grow it, harvest it, can or freeze, or otherwise prepare it for sell.
clothing, only women sew in sewing factories, men cut the fabric out.
medical, women doctors, nurses, cleaning lady, the women who wash medical instruments in hospitals,(if you ever have surgery you'll be thankful for these women) who stock each department with needed item, towels, sheets, personal items.
police women, help uphold the law
attorneys, and assistance
do yu ever eat in resturants? waitress, kitchen workers(not just men in that kitchen)
Anyone else care to add the list? I know there are many many more.

 

[Headcoveredlady]

Hi Katie,
I know of several women who have home businesses making clothing for others. They homeschool, serve their husbands and keep their homes and run their businesses. In fact two of these ladies I know have their children participate in the business. What a great way for the children to learn to run a business right there under mom. I love to call this one business and the daughter answeres the phone. She is very polite and meek.
Have you ever looked up what the word keeper means? It means to guard and protect,it does not mean housecleaning only. A born again Christian woman is to guard her precious treasures. Those are her children.

HCL

 

[donnA]

I read in a discussion like this a few months ago,don't know which thread, or where, or who said it, someone said that a woman who works is upsuring her husbands authority. So what do you think?

Is she upsuring his authority by working(earning money), or by doing it outside the home? Just which part do you think is upsuring his authority?

This question is for anyone.

 

[donnA]

HCL, what about the women I just listed? Do you use their services? If you do you are giving your permission for them to work.
Christian women? What happens if all christian women decide to stay home? It may mean some of these things are not available to you anymore. Medical care and cleanliness? food availabilty? How many of those we could list are you willing to give up?

 

[Headcoveredlady]

Katie,
THe question would have to be more specific. Did the husband command her to work? If so then no. He may need some extra until he gets on his feet better. I know for us my husband would not ask me to work if we needed it. He would get a part time job himself.
Women usurp authority when they try to rule over them. Some husbands are afraid to fight against their wives because their wives are so dominant that they would rather have peace. So, if your husband says something like, "I kind of would like you to be home, but you can do what you want." And then you mosey on off to a job, you are usurping his authority. Especially if you are dominant to him. LIke I said many men prefer peace then to fight with their wives so they give in to their bossiness and nagging and let her have her way, even though it is not what they want. The most submissive wives are the ones who do what their husbands want even when they may have not even specified what they want.

HCL

 

[Molly]

Katie,

I have only stated things have been taken out of context when they have been...I did not say your post was,I just didn't see evidence of leaving the home every day, day in and day out to hold a job,while someone else ran her home or taught her children. I just don't see that there in those passages. they are good references for women doing work,though. More than likely she was in the home mostly,but did this occassionally and of course we all know sewing is done from the home.

I asked my husband about these women you all have been mentioning and I want to share with you what he has said(he needs to start posting on the baptist board,I doubt he will,he thinks it is kind of silly)but he said,and I think it is true,that the examples of women doing work of any kind are mentioned to be used as an example to allow women leaving their home for a career. that was not the intention of why it was written. They are biographies of women and what they did,etc,we can learn a lot about God and his providential plan which ultimately points to Christ through these women and their stories.....but he said where the bible has direct instruction to believers,you think the biographies of what people did or how they lived outweigh the direct instructions of Paul,or it gives an excuse or reason to not heed the instructions. He explained to me the instructions are what we need to obey. The other is beneficial,but not direct instruction like Paul's letters are to the believers in the different churches. Just thought I'd share that with you so you could understand why what you say really doesn't change Paul's instructions. They are there for teaching and specific instructions to us.

Thanks!

 

[donnA]

He may need some extra until he gets on his feet better

What does this mean? What if he is already earning all that he is able too?Yet it is far short of what he needs just to supply a home, and food for his family?This is not a man who just needs to get on his feet. Some women are willing to go out side of their comfort level for their families survival. I posted a story of what people ar ehaving to live with and the money available to one working man, and got no responses on how little you expect some men to take care of a family. No one answered my questions about hungry children going to bed hungry? Soem dont believe it happens in this country, those people know very little about whats really going on in this country, and are sheltering themselves from reality.

So, if your husband says something like, "I kind of would like you to be home, but you can do what you want." And then you mosey on off to a job, you are usurping his authority

And why do you say "you"? I have always been home. And how do you know just what a husband means when he says that? Did you ask my husband when he said it too me? No you didn't, so don't speak for him.

 

[donnA]

What hppens if a woman totally believes it is a biblical command that she stay home. ANd her husband demands that she go to work?

What if the husband can not for some reason work for a while? Does the wife?

What if you have children, and your husbands work does not supply medical insurance? Is it alright not to have it?

 

[Molly]

Clint,you said Paul would fall over knowing we are finding excuses to not use our talents....I am using my talents in my home,just like he instructs. I am not hiding or burying my talents or gifts,I am allowing God to use them in our home to teach and guide my children,which satisfies God's instruction in Deut to teach our children when we rise,when we lie down,etc...I don't know it word for word and I don't have my Bible right here with me. So,Paul would fall over in disappointment with me....? That's an interesting view on scripture. Did you know you are diagreeing with:

James Dobson
John MacArthur
Adrian Rogers
Ted Tripp(Sheperding a Child's Heart")
Michael Farris

The list could go on and on...why refuse instruction from these men,don't just take my word for it. Why would all these men say and teach the role of women,if it was twisting of scripture? And,they have gone a step further to say that they recommend all mothers of young children to be home. Why? Is it best for the family? Does Paul instruct it? Could it be that we are seeing the breakdown of the family in our culture? Why is that? What are we doing wrong? What could we be doing better?

 

[Clint Kritzer]

So,Paul would fall over in disappointment with me....?

I never said you nor did I call any names.

originally posted bgy Clint Kritzer: Personally, I think that the Apostle Paul would have fallen over in a faint if he had ever suspicioned that his words would be used as an excuse for someone to not use the talents that God gave them.

 

[Clint Kritzer]

originally posted by Molly: Did you know you are diagreeing with:

James Dobson
John MacArthur
Adrian Rogers
Ted Tripp(Sheperding a Child's Heart")
Michael Farris

The list could go on and on...why refuse instruction from these men,don't just take my word for it. Why would all these men say and teach the role of women,if it was twisting of scripture?

Acts 5:29
Peter and the other apostles replied: "We must obey God rather than men!

 

[Clint Kritzer]

Deuteronomy 6

4 Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. 5 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. 6 These commandments that I give you today are to be upon your hearts. 7 Impress them on your children. Talk about them when you sit at home and when you walk along the road, when you lie down and when you get up. 8 Tie them as symbols on your hands and bind them on your foreheads. 9 Write them on the doorframes of your houses and on your gates.

[ May 03, 2002, 09:46 PM: Message edited by: Clint Kritzer ]

 

[Molly]

Yes,but these are godly men who are teachers,who know the Word better than us...does that matter to you?

Who,then were you directing that to? You were saying it to women who stay home,who are hiding their talents,right? Like I said,that is very intersting.

 

[Clint Kritzer]

Molly, do you worship those men? Do you think that they are the Baptist equivelant to the Pope?

I was directing my comments toward anyone to whom they may apply.

 

[Clint Kritzer]

This may interest you. Here's a bio on James Dobson's wife: http://www.nationaldayofprayer.org/media/bios.cfm

Evidently, Dr. Dobson has no problem with his wife being a proffessional woman either.