My Theology (6/24h Day Creation, Pre-Trib Pre-Mill, Provisionist, Inerrant Word of God believer)

[Jem Simmo]

I thought I would start by saying the above title is what I believe.

But I also want to say that I want a place where I can also call out people who claim they're theologians who have twisted views of the scripture because they don't operate in correct Hermeneutics or exegesis.

In regards to how the scripture should be applied with the Old Testament (I'm looking at you Covenant/Replacement Theologians, you have a lot to answer for) with the New Testament (I'm looking at you Calvinists/Arminians, when you interpret through a theology of course you thing its based on individuals. But as the body of Christ it is always a corporate view, just like God dealing with the Nation of Israel corporately in blessing and disobedience. Romans 9-11, ) I also see God as omnipotent and above all things (Yes you evolutionist/Theistic Evolutionists/Old Age Creationist, you all don't get it. God is all- powerful and beyond our comprehension, he is above all and his ability to speak things into existence is far greater than limiting it to science. When you view science through the lense of scripture and don't get technical God created this world and scientific explanation is right there. If you believe the scripture then instead of limiting the most powerful being in both time and space and outside of it too. Bottom line you can't have physical death before Sin, what is the point of Jesus death and resurrection, Romans 5:12-15 )

If I have not been humble in my opening, I must apologise. I'm sorry. As I have been growing in my understanding I have come to see that when you examine the scripture through the lens of the theology you distort the word of God. (John MacArthur, John Piper etc) tend to do this without even realising or if they do they are so cemented in their ideas of Calvinism and other theology that they are unwilling to examine the scripture purely through the scriptures. If you do this then Scripture determines your theology and not the other way round. The same can be said of a Covenant/Replacement Theologian, your unwillingness to recognise to separate entities in the Nation of Israel and Body of Christ. That's dangerous firstly you help build antisemitism and secondly the promises of God meant for the People Israel make no sense to the church. Many theologians have tried in vain to push them into the church and argue pointlessly and with extremely great difficulty eg Zechariah 14, if you actually look it matches up with Revelation 19-20. It isn't talking about Ezekiel 38-39 at all. That has more to do with Israel than it does the Amilleinnial view.

The same can be said of Lane Craig and Hugh Ross. Sure you might have mildly different views and you might argue them eloquently and scientifically. Instead of calling believers who believe what God's word says "Foolish", you are trying to defend the indefensible. The truth is God is able to calling into being by the word of his mouth everything. He doesn't need long ages to do a thing. A global flood happened not because I believe it happened but because when you actually have a scientifically biblical worldview it all makes sense.

I may just be getting started but at the end of the day if I say nothing I'll explode...I'd rather do so on here. I'm sorry for not being gentle, I'm sorry for sounding unloving. I know I'm in the minority both within Baptist circles and other denominations. I can't stay silent and I can't follow after theology over the scripture. I'm happy to converse. I'm happy to listen, please be also listening. If I am wrong pray, pray that the Lord would open my eyes to this. I'll pray for you too.

 

[Rob_BW]

You want a place where you can call out people? Weird flex, but okay.

If I had to guess, I'd say more people have changed their minds by observing others calmly and rationally explaining why they believe what they do, than by observing others attacking what they consider falsehoods. Something to consider. Enjoy your sparring.

 

[JonShaff]

Awesome—I’ll start by encouraging you to throw out your pre trib view. If you need help, just read 2 Thessalonians 1 very slowly.

 

[Jem Simmo]

You want a place where you can call out people? Weird flex, but okay.

If I had to guess, I'd say more people have changed their minds by observing others calmly and rationally explaining why they believe what they do, than by observing others attacking what they consider falsehoods. Something to consider. Enjoy your sparring.

I think I was ranting way too much. Yes I agree, calmly and rationally explaining is more Godly than what I wrote before. I can come across hard and fast and I do need to apologise. A humble spirit and gentleness like Peter says in 1 Peter 3:15-16. Thanks for your comment.

 

[Jem Simmo]

Awesome—I’ll start by encouraging you to throw out your pre trib view. If you need help, just read 2 Thessalonians 1 very slowly.

Thank you for your your comment. I spent some time reading over chapter 1. I don't agree with you, but I respect where you are coming from. I do agree that there will be persecution of the church before the Lord comes back. Totally agree and I think there is more and more of that beginning to be seen in the US, GB and in Australia. I do think that Pre-Trib rapture will occur and more because the promises in the Old Testment for Israel need to still be fulfilled. How do you read 1 Thessalonians 4 & 5. Would be interested in your thoughts.

 

[asterisktom]

If I am wrong pray, pray that the Lord would open my eyes to this. I'll pray for you too.

Now why did you not say "If I am wrong show me from the Bible"? Something like that. That omission here in a discussion group tells me all I need to know. You do not want discussion. You just want to vent. Have fun.

 

[timtofly]

Now why did you not say "If I am wrong show me from the Bible"? Something like that. That omission here in a discussion group tells me all I need to know. You do not want discussion. You just want to vent. Have fun.

One has to open their eyes before they can see. Baby steps, or crawling. Just rolling over is ok with those whose eyes are shut.

 

[timtofly]

I think I was ranting way too much. Yes I agree, calmly and rationally explaining is more Godly than what I wrote before. I can come across hard and fast and I do need to apologise. A humble spirit and gentleness like Peter says in 1 Peter 3:15-16. Thanks for your comment.

If one had a really tall soapbox, they have a lot of soap, but the harder one has to fall.

 

[church mouse guy]

What do you think of J.D. Greear?

 

[timtofly]

You want a place where you can call out people? Weird flex, but okay.

If I had to guess, I'd say more people have changed their minds by observing others calmly and rationally explaining why they believe what they do, than by observing others attacking what they consider falsehoods. Something to consider. Enjoy your sparring.

So far that seems the normal stance in most threads and all forums. An honest person is harder to find these days. Sincerity is not really honesty, most people hide behind really big sincere guns. Some are just passive aggressive.

 

[canadyjd]

Eph 2 clearly tells us that Jews and Gentiles have been joined into one new man by Jesus’ death on the cross. The Law has been abolished.

For there to be a separate future for National Israel and the Church, the unification accomplished by Christ’ death must be undone which is impossible.

peace to you

 

[church mouse guy]

Eph 2 clearly tells us that Jews and Gentiles have been joined into one new man by Jesus’ death on the cross. The Law has been abolished.

For there to be a separate future for National Israel and the Church, the unification accomplished by Christ’ death must be undone which is impossible.

peace to you

You don't post much, do you? Jews must be saved to go to Heaven. Unsaved Jews have the same bleak future that any other non-Christian has now. God restored Israel to the Jews in 1948 after He had scattered them throughout the world in 70 AD through Rome.

I don't know what you mean when you say that the Law has been abolished?

 

[timtofly]

Eph 2 clearly tells us that Jews and Gentiles have been joined into one new man by Jesus’ death on the cross. The Law has been abolished.

For there to be a separate future for National Israel and the Church, the unification accomplished by Christ’ death must be undone which is impossible.

peace to you

What future are you talking about? The 3 years of trib, or a 1000 year reign of the Word of God, Jesus Christ, the Lamb on earth?


People are funny, even in the United States we are not one joint Rebulican Democratic single like minded entity. Some times there is a 4 or 8 year period where one party makes policy and then another 4 or 8 year period for the other party. It could be 1 single 16 year period to even see both at work. The trib is only a 3 year period right now. How divided do you think having 1 year for the church, 1 for the House of Jacob, and 1 for the Nations is? God is way more concise than even one nation in this harvest of souls.

The Millennium has nothing to do with the past one iota. It is the Lord's Day for the Lord Jesus Christ. The 6000 year punishment given to Adam is over. Those in Christ will live as the original sons of God created on the 6th day. Those coming out of the Great Tribulation will replenish the earth for 1000 years. They will or will not join with Satan for one last Battle, Gog and Megog.

 

[Iconoclast]

Hello,
Glad to see that you profess faith in Jesus.
It is also good to see you desire to study the bible
Peter says as new born babes desire the sincere milk of the word that you may grow by it.
You have just started to search out a few ideas and try and formulate a theology.
These things are good and necessary.
There is a lot more to consider

One of my grandchildren came off the school bus from his first grade class, after his first week and announced that he has learned all he needed to know and did not feel he needed to return to learn anything else.
Do you agree with him?
or
Do you think he does not know,what he does not know?

 

[church mouse guy]

I thought that it was Kindergarten where one learned all he needed to know. I know--off topic.

I thought that the Tribulation was seven years.

 

[canadyjd]

You don't post much, do you? Jews must be saved to go to Heaven. Unsaved Jews have the same bleak future that any other non-Christian has now. God restored Israel to the Jews in 1948 after He had scattered them throughout the world in 70 AD through Rome.

I don't know what you mean when you say that the Law has been abolished?

I referenced scripture. Personal attacks don’t change scripture.

Scripture says the two groups have been made into one new man by Jesus and the cross. Scripture says the Law was abolished. There is no future for Israel outside the church.

peace to you

 

[Van]

I thought I would start by saying the above title is what I believe. SNIP

Hi Jem, thanks for your "full disclosure."

1) The 6 twenty-four hour day view of the creation week is widely held, and coupled with the creation of "apparent history" is pretty much bullet proof. Lets leave it that we were not there, and many widely held views might be wrong.

2) The per-tribulation view is also widely head. If you throw in all those who hold that the rapture occurs mid-trib or before, you might say we would great fellowship.

3) Christ's return at the start of the 1000 year reign on David's throne is also a widely held, with those objecting usually denying the earthly reign.

4) Not sure what "Provisionist" means exactly, but if that means you hold to the "PROVIDE" acronym, I think the view comes very close to the truth.

5) Certainly God's word is reliable and trustworthy, and is the final authority for faith and practice.

 

[37818]

I went from being taught pre-trib to post-trib. I went from believing in some kind of day-age view of Genesis to a literal earth day view. Still holding to an old universe view. Among topics I love to discuss.

 

[church mouse guy]

I referenced scripture. Personal attacks don’t change scripture.

Scripture says the two groups have been made into one new man by Jesus and the cross. Scripture says the Law was abolished. There is no future for Israel outside the church.

peace to you

Oh, I just noted that you have been here a long time and don't post very often--just thinking out loud and not a personal attack in the least. I'd be happy to hear from you more often.

Matthew 5:17-22 (KJV) Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

 

[church mouse guy]

I went from being taught pre-trib to post-trib I went from beieving in some kind of day-age view of Genesis to a literal earth day view. Still holding to an old universe view. Among topics I love to discuss.

To quote Ken Ham, I imagine that you have believed the old earth and millions and millions of years for millions and millions of years.