In the SBC traditionalist just means not Calvinist I think.
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My Theology (6/24h Day Creation, Pre-Trib Pre-Mill, Provisionist, Inerrant Word of God believer)
- Thread starter Jem Simmo
- Start date
In the SBC traditionalist just means not Calvinist I think.
Yes, I'm afraid it does
I agree with you on everything except pre-trib. I think that Pope Francis is the Anti-Christ.
I listen to Brandon Howse now and then, also. Cultural marxism is trying to get a foothold in the SBC.
The cited passage - Ephesians 2:11-22 contains this -
15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man from the two, thus making peace, 16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity. 17 And He came and preached peace to you who were afar off and to those who were near.
Under the Old Covenant, the Law was given to teach holy living, & to regulate the conduct of the people of Israel as they become a nation. Circumcision was a sign of membership & acceptance of the Law.
No-one was saved by obedience to the Law - for all have sinned. Sacrifices were commanded to show both the wages of sin, & forgiveness. These pointed to Jesus Christ who, as our represenative kept the Law to perfection & suffered as a perfect sacrifice for our sins.
The Law, with all its detailed provisions & sacrifices, no longer applies as a a means of salvation & fellowship with God. If fact it never did apply as Hebrews 11 makes clear. We cannot keep the Law, we live by faith in our Saviour God, as did all the Old Covenant saints.
That does NOT mean we can flout the Law, for by the Holy Spirit the Law is in our hearts. Supremely that spiritual Law is Love, for God & neighbour, regardless of ethnicity. Jew & Gentile are redeemed by the blood of Christ, we are now children of God by adoption & faith.
We all now look forward to the return of our Saviour, for resurrection & judgment, & a perfectly righteous New Heaven & New Earth. (2 Peter 3)
All the modern focus on Israel as a nation as the fulfilment of prophecy is a false tradition that should be rejected. It is nowhere taught by Jesus & his Apostles. The church is the holy nation of Exodus 19:4-6 -
7 Therefore, to you who believe, He is precious; but to those who are disobedient,
“The stone which the builders rejected
Has become the chief cornerstone,”
8 and
“A stone of stumbling
And a rock of offense.”
They stumble, being disobedient to the word, to which they also were appointed.
9 But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; 10 who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy.
“The stone which the builders rejected
Has become the chief cornerstone,”
8 and
“A stone of stumbling
And a rock of offense.”
They stumble, being disobedient to the word, to which they also were appointed.
9 But you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; 10 who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy.
Thank you.
Thank you again!
Lets see, there is nothing wrong with calling beliefs traditions, as long as they match my traditions.
What do the Provisionist folks belief? Here is the acronym P R O V I D E.
P - People sin and are "made sinners" thus all people are separated from fellowship with God.
R - Responsible thus able to respond affirmatively to the call of the gospel.
O - Open door thus generally God allows anyone to put their faith fully in Christ.
V - Vicarious Atonement provides a way for everyone to be saved through the blood of Christ.
I - Illuminating Grace clearly reveals sufficient truth so everyone can know and respond in faith.
D - Destruction in Hades/Gehenna for unbelief and rejecting God's revelation.
E - Eternal Security for all "true" (born anew) believers.
What do the Provisionist folks belief? Here is the acronym P R O V I D E.
P - People sin and are "made sinners" thus all people are separated from fellowship with God.
R - Responsible thus able to respond affirmatively to the call of the gospel.
O - Open door thus generally God allows anyone to put their faith fully in Christ.
V - Vicarious Atonement provides a way for everyone to be saved through the blood of Christ.
I - Illuminating Grace clearly reveals sufficient truth so everyone can know and respond in faith.
D - Destruction in Hades/Gehenna for unbelief and rejecting God's revelation.
E - Eternal Security for all "true" (born anew) believers.
You’re welcome!
An interesting point. I agree with you to a point. Yes, the Jews of the New testament and the Pharisee's in particular were very interested in following the traditions as opposed to the truth of the Old Testament. Even today Orthodox Jews follow the teachings of the rabbis as opposed to reading the scriptures and searching them out themselves.
However from the point of veiw that I am coming from it isn't tradition that I am standing upon. I haven't taken this lightly nor have I just become a sheep. The scripture when read in the hermenuetical context of the Bible, doesn't sway me to believe in Covenant Theology nor Calvanism nor Old Earth Creationism. Tradition in what you are saying I think and please fill free to correct my thought is based on man's ideas of how to do something. I would say that Augustine and his teachings are a tradition that I con't get behind. If I'm going to believe something I want it to be based on the scripture. I want to view the scripture with the scripture and not with some theology that distorts the pure word.
I respect your opinion and I'm ok with the arguement. But I do disagree.
Thanks Jem - I think you misunderstood my last point -
I too totally reject the RC attitude to tradition & their false theological teachings developed down the centuries. I reject antisemitism & all religious & racist persecution.
I totally reject the modern Evangelical/Baptist/Zionist tradition that modern Israel is the fulfilment of prophecy. Modern Israel is a carnal entity at variance with New Covenant Christianity which replaces the Old Covenant centred on the nation of Israel with the New Covenant in Jesus' blood.
Support for Israel as the present nation is the support for blatant apartheid & racism that denies neighbourly love to the Samaritan/Palestinian people.
The only great divide in Gospel Christianity is between the redeemed from every nation & those who reject the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Thanks Jem - I think you misunderstood my last point -
I too totally reject the RC attitude to tradition & their false theological teachings developed down the centuries.
I question your position here -
Scripture requires Covenant Theology - in use, a Covenant is God's promise of blessing in return for faithful obedience. The Patriarchs were promised blessings for their descendants ultimately through the Seed - Christ. Their natural descendants received blessings along the way - increased numbers to become a great nation, deliverance from Egypt, the Law, sacrifices for sin, the Land, judges, a King, Prophetic guidance and finally the Messiah, our LORD Jesus Christ.
Israel repeatedly failed its Covenant obligations, but was sustained until the promised Messiah came to fulfil every aspect of the Old Covenant, & finish the saving work assigned him, so establishing the New Covenant in his own blood, a Covenant in which people of ALL nations are blessed according to the Covenant promises to the Patriarchs. The Holy Spirit applies the New Covenant to individuals by leading them to repentance, giving spiritual life and dwelling within and inclining us to keep the Law from our hearts. See e.g Acts 1 for the great commission, Acts 2 for the Gospel preached to Jews & Proselytes from "every nation under heaven" and the forgiveness of sins on repentance & baptism in the name of Jesus. Hebrews details New Covenant theology.
Many thousands of Jews welcomed the Gospel through the preaching of John, Jesus during his earthly ministry (the world is gone after him!) the Jerusalem crowds on Palm Sunday; and as recorded in Acts. John sees 144,000.
Sadly the Jewish leaders persistently rejected their Messiah & led their generation in persistent rebellion. "This generation" perished with the physical signs of the Old Covenant - Jerusalem & the temple in AD 70. The Gospel was always held open to the Jews. I reject any suggestion that God held them in unbelief for 1900 years, punishing them for their unbelief by repeated persecution until the Holocaust.
Jews are welcomed by the Gospel, as are sinners of all nations, including the Palestinians. The Palestinians should be free to live in their land & homes, managing their resources without oppression by the occupiers. Rather than carving a homeland for European Jews in the former promised land, Palestine, the Jews should have been compensated in the countries where they lived & given full religious freedom.
The US, UK & other nations should not be supporting Israel's aggression against the Palestinians. If the OT prophets do speak of a return to the land they should adopt this attitude -
Eze. 47:21 “Thus you shall divide this land among yourselves according to the tribes of Israel. 22 It shall be that you will divide it by lot as an inheritance for yourselves, and for the strangers who dwell among you and who bear children among you. They shall be to you as native-born among the children of Israel; they shall have an inheritance with you among the tribes of Israel. 23 And it shall be that in whatever tribe the stranger dwells, there you shall give him his inheritance,” says the Lord GOD.
Why are you dragging the USA into this when the UK ran Israel from World War I until about 1948? The UK sided with the Arabs.
The Pogrom That Started the Palestinian Arab-Israeli Conflict - Frontpagemag
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P - People sin and are "made sinners" thus all people are separated from fellowship with God.
Romans 3:23
for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Romans 5:19
For as through the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous.
Isaiah 59:2
But your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God,
And your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.
Romans 3:23
for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Romans 5:19
For as through the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the One the many will be made righteous.
Isaiah 59:2
But your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God,
And your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.
R - Responsible thus able to respond affirmatively to the call of the gospel.
John 20:31
"but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name." Here "the simple πιστεύειν is used emphatically, of those who acknowledge Jesus as the saviour and devote themselves to him: [SNIP] John 20:31;"
John 20:31
"but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name." Here "the simple πιστεύειν is used emphatically, of those who acknowledge Jesus as the saviour and devote themselves to him: [SNIP] John 20:31;"
O - Open door thus generally God allows anyone to put their faith fully in Christ.
1Timothy 2:1
First of all, then, I urge that entreaties and prayers, petitions and thanksgivings, be made on behalf of all men,
1Timothy 2:3-4
This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
1Timothy 2:1
First of all, then, I urge that entreaties and prayers, petitions and thanksgivings, be made on behalf of all men,
1Timothy 2:3-4
This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
V - Vicarious Atonement provides a way for everyone to be saved through the blood of Christ.
2Peter 2:1
But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
1 John 2:2
And He Himself is the propitiation (or means of salvation) for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.
2Peter 2:1
But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
1 John 2:2
And He Himself is the propitiation (or means of salvation) for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.
I - Illuminating Grace clearly reveals sufficient truth so everyone can know and respond in faith.
2 Timothy 1:10
And now He has revealed this grace through the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who has abolished death and illuminated the way to life and immortality through the gospel,
Titus 2:11
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men,
2 Timothy 1:10
And now He has revealed this grace through the appearing of our Savior, Christ Jesus, who has abolished death and illuminated the way to life and immortality through the gospel,
Titus 2:11
For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men,
D - Destruction in Hades/Gehenna for unbelief and rejecting God's revelation.
John 3:18
“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the one of a kind Son of God.
Act 7:51
“You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did.
Rev 20:15
And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
John 3:18
“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the one of a kind Son of God.
Act 7:51
“You men who are stiff-necked and uncircumcised in heart and ears are always resisting the Holy Spirit; you are doing just as your fathers did.
Rev 20:15
And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
E - Eternal Security for all "true" (born anew) believers.
Romans 8:38-39
For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
John 14:16
“I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, to be with you forever;
Romans 8:38-39
For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
John 14:16
“I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, to be with you forever;