Nativity Scenes and the Second Commandment

[dan e.]

1. We have no idea what Christ looked like, so any image is a false image of him.
2. During the 6th and 7th Century during the Iconoclastic Controversy the decision made by the Iconoclast was that we cannot make an image of Christ because of his Divine Nature. Even if we knew what Christ looked like and was able to paint a picture of him we would be dividing his nature.. Christ is fully God and fully Man. If we paint him we are painting only the man for we can not paint his divine nature thus dividing his nature.

At the very least it is nestorianism and it could also be monophysite...

So it is still forbidden....

That is my two cents for what it is worth....

1. I think you're assuming an "image", such as a small baby in a toy manger, is the same thing as what the Bible condemns when talking about making an image of God for the purposes of worship.
2. At the very least....you are looking way to much into this if you use all of those big words to come to a conclusion about having a ceramic baby to include in your manger.

 

[webdog]

I am not climbing on anyones backs. I am asking an honest question.

What if we had a statue of Jesus in our churches all the time?
How about a statue of mary?
The catholics do? WHy shouldn't we?

...catholics also bow down and worship the statue. Huge difference.

 

[J.D.]

...catholics also bow down and worship the statue. Huge difference.

So having the statues is okay as long as we don't bow down in front of them, right?

 

[SBCPreacher]

So having the statues is okay as long as we don't bow down in front of them, right?

As long as it's not a statue of me in my church (after I'm dead and gone). I don't want my "image" to be the one to scare people off!

 

[Alcott]

That's quite funny. But (and there's always a but), The lowest male voice is called bass, not base.

Only if he sings like a fish.
But no; I knew that, and in fact I changed it from bass to base because the other parts are also changed to suit the spelling of the words punned. But I see I forgot to add "ver" to "soap ran o..." Okay, so it's not perfect harmony with which to teach the world to sing, or buy the world a Coke.

 

[Alcott]

That reminds me... years ago I was in the choir of a church and we had an old man who was a good bass singer named R.G. Bass, pronounced like the fish. But one I pronounced his name like 'base,' and it caught on, and he seemed to like it.

 

[Gold Dragon]

How can you harmonize the use of nativity scenes with the second commandment?

The same way you harmonize hanging pictures of your family in your house and a cross in your church, both images.

 

[Rubato 1]

That reminds me... years ago I was in the choir of a church and we had an old man who was a good bass singer named R.G. Bass, pronounced like the fish. But one I pronounced his name like 'base,' and it caught on, and he seemed to like it.

I wonder if he had a nativity scene at his house...

 

[Dale-c]

The same way you harmonize hanging pictures of your family in your house and a cross in your church, both images.

We don't hang crosses in our church.

 

[Alcott]

I wonder if he had a nativity scene at his house...

To me he never said.

 

[webdog]

So having the statues is okay as long as we don't bow down in front of them, right?

I don't recall saying that.

 

[Joshua Rhodes]

You're not going to stop nativity scenes. Just stop looking at them if they offend you. Of course if you're driving by, don't close your eyes. That could be bad.

 

[Aaron]

The second commandment forbids images and any form of worship that God has not commanded....

Does that allow for images outside of worship of God?

I still believe it is forbidden but not because of the second commandment..... After studying the historical and theological arguments regarding images outside of worship here are my conclusions...

1. We have no idea what Christ looked like, so any image is a false image of him.
2. During the 6th and 7th Century during the Iconoclastic Controversy the decision made by the Iconoclast was that we cannot make an image of Christ because of his Divine Nature. Even if we knew what Christ looked like and was able to paint a picture of him we would be dividing his nature.. Christ is fully God and fully Man. If we paint him we are painting only the man for we can not paint his divine nature thus dividing his nature.

At the very least it is nestorianism and it could also be monophysite...

So it is still forbidden....

That is my two cents for what it is worth....

Excellent post and I agree whole heartedly.

 

[menageriekeeper]

Interesting the things we chose to worry about being sin.

Let's quote the whole commandment:

Ex 20:4Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth:Ex 20:5Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them:

Now the question becomes: Are these two separate commandments or does verse 5 provide clarification for verse 4?

If verse 4 is a commandment in it's own right, ya'll better get rid of your photos, your avatars, all the portraits, painting and sculptures in your house and your photocopiers cause we can stretch this commandment out to the point to where it forbids making copies of the original. Also, shouldn't have star charts for cause that would be a graven image of something in heaven above. No road maps cause that would be the earth below. Hey wait! That would mean no GPS device in your cars!

I think I've carried this out far enough.

A nativity scene is simply a three diminsional representation of a historical event. That's it. It is not an object one would consider a god. No need to make life more complicated than it is already.

 

[Joe]

I agree with MK :thumbs:

 

[Dale-c]

That's it. It is not an object one would consider a god.

Last time I checked, Jesus wasn't "a god" He is THE God.

 

[Alcott]

I have said these same things before, along with my contention there are 8 1/2 commandments remaining from the decalogue for NT Christians. We are not forbidden to have any likeness of anything-- photographs, engineering drawings, Mr. Potato Heads, et al-- but we are forbidden from worshipping objects, and this is compounded to mean worshipping or loving anything-- money, prestige, a Cadillac/Lincoln/Jaguar/Mercedes, a house...-- other than the one God.

[That's the half commandment to which we are not obligated; the full on is the sabbath-- Ryan Warning!]

 

[Dale-c]

I found this interesting:

Dunham writes: “It is not lawful to have pictures of Jesus Christ…because, if it does not stir up devotion, it is in vain, if it does stir up devotion, it is a worshipping by an image or picture, and so a palpable breach of the second commandment.”[4]

I found this from this page:
http://www.entrewave.com/view/reformedonline/Are%20Pictures%20of%20Christ%20Unbiblical.htm

 

[Amy.G]

We have a beautiful iron cross hanging on the wall in our house. We do not worship it or put it above the Lord Jesus Christ. It is like the altars that people built to the Lord. It is a reminder of the love of Christ for us just as the altars were reminders to OT saints of the faithfulness of God.

 

[Dale-c]

Amy, read the article I posted above, you will see there is a lot more to it than what many think.