Negativism at Home Could Produce Defeat Of U.S. Policy in Iraq

"I support our President's leadership in the war on terrorism as well as our Congressional approval and funding for it. I'm not going to cheat our troops out of the knowledge that they're fighting a just war for a just cause."

???

 

Amen Patrick!
Fact, we are in the war in Iraq,regardless of how we got there. Now that we are there we OWE it to the Iraqi people to follow through by helping them finish setting up thier government and making them FULLY capable of self defense.We also need to help them rebuild thier infra-structure just as we did in Japan and Germany.

Fact contrary to popular belief and what is written in some history books foriegn and domestic,no war has ever been executed without a multitude of mistakes, so we need to get over the fact that this one is'nt running perfectly either.As hard as it might be for some of us we need to suck it up and show support for not only our troops but also our president.He has enough people beating him up already.We need to understand the seriousness of the situation. The Jihadists and Al queda do not understand that Americans almost make a hobby out of bickering about thier government. Bin Laden is of the opinion that when we see enough blood we will quit.If we do that we will see terrorism like we have never seen or dreamed of because we will have proved him right and given him license to do what he wants when he wants to do it.Thier ultimate stated goal is to kill all of the Saturday peple first(Jews)and all of the sunday people next(Christians),that is thier form of evangelism.I truly wish this were not the case but we have no options regardless of what we think or what kind of rhetoric we put out.

 

When recruiters of the Armed Forces of the most powerful country in the world focus their recruitment talks on the many careers and educational funding one gets when one joins the Armed Forces, in other words, money, money, money, college, college, college, there is something amiss somewhere, don't you think ?

 

You are wrong dragoon Vietnam was united against
you it may be sad to admit too now, after 30 years
but history shows and tells us they were dedicated
and united to oust the occupier ..which is
not the commons soldiers fault they were the
low end of the chain and took orders loyally.
But you dragoon need to face reality and get
some healing you cannot go over there and fight
the war again or cast blame on this person or
that person or "jane fonda it's all her fault"
that's just not reality or the war hero John
Kerry its all his fault"


VIETNAM WAS UNITED AND DEDICATED EVEN IF IT TOOK
1 MILLION DEAD AND WOUNDED THEY WERE TIRED OF
OCCUPIERS...FRANCE,FRENCH-JAPAN,FRANCE,
AND THE UNITED STATES...YEAH THEY TOOK ON THE
MONIKER OF COMMUNISTS BUT THEY NEEDED SOMEONE TO
PUNCH THEIR TICKET TO GET AN OCCUPPIER OUSTED
TRUMAN CUT OFF HO CHI MINH AFTER TONS OF LETTERS
FROM HO REACHING OUT TO THE UNITED STATES..HO
FOUND ANOTHER RIDE..HE COMPROMISED BUT HE GOT HIS
COUNTRY FREE FROM OCCUPIERS.

It is not pretty but most of the credit for out
lasting the United States goes to the majority
of Vietmanese as a adversary and constant thorn
in your side.Don't they deserve honorable respect
for being dedicated and tactical smart fighters.

Today we are reconciling with Vietnam and most
of the younger generation does not know about the
war and act like they don't care...they have a
bright future and even brighter if Vietnam becomes
a good friend and changes come about.

I wonder what would have happened if Truman would not have ignored Ho Chi Minhs letters?

 

I didn't know this and thank you for posting it. Verifying it, you are absolutely correct. He wanted help from the US to unite the nation based on the Philippines model. Because his eight letters to Truman were ignored, he reached out to Chinese Communists. How sad. How horribly sad.

 

How can you think about sausages in the middle of a serious thread Ken?

 

I didn't know this and thank you for posting it. Verifying it, you are absolutely correct. He wanted help from the US to unite the nation based on the Philippines model. Because his eight letters to Truman were ignored, he reached out to Chinese Communists. How sad. How horribly sad. </font>[/QUOTE]It is indeed true that Ho Chi Minh sought help from the US for the independence of Viet Nam from French colonialism. He also used words very similar to our Declaration of Independence in his declaration. However, these things did not in themselves make him become a Communist nor did they make our ultimate stand against Communism wrong. It "might have turned out differently" is one of those speculations that could be made about many events in history including some of the early decisions of our own nation. In the end Ho Chi Minh became our enemy because he lead a effort to force Communism upon an entire nation - the majority of whom didn't want it.

Patrick

 

Canadian bacon mmmmmm!

 

http://www.ena.lu/europe/formation%20community/letter%20chi%20minh%20harry%20truman%201946.htm

http://www.fsmitha.com/h2/ch26.htm

http://hnn.us/roundup/comments/11737.html

 

</font>[/QUOTE]Between construction jobs I used to work for Kraft in the Coolwhip plant. I was always kinda jealous of you Canadians. We shipped you guys the extra creamy stuff and only got to keep the regular stuff here...bummer.

 

</font>[/QUOTE]Between construction jobs I used to work for Kraft in the Coolwhip plant. I was always kinda jealous of you Canadians. We shipped you guys the extra creamy stuff and only got to keep the regular stuff here...bummer. </font>[/QUOTE]LOL that must have "bit". Is it true that you guys don't have ketchup chips? And that you all don't eat grilled cheese sandwiches with ketchup?

 

I don't know bout all that, but I will tell this the first person to try an pass that stuff off on me is gonna be a hurting unit. Growl.

 

No, I'm correct in stating that Viet Nam was a long ways from being united against us or united for Communism! The Vietnamese people in the South, and many in the North, resisted it very hard and, even today, it's not very popular among many who live under it. When given the chance people fled from it at many points in the history of the conflict. The South suffered from war weariness, poor leadership, corruption, lack of on-going support, and other factors that lead to its defeat. Mistakes were made. Choices between bad and worse were made. However, many Vietnamese patriots fought to the very end and certainly never supported the Communist way.

I am not a "victim" of the "establishment" during the Viet Nam war. I'm a soldier that did the right thing for the right reasons. I'm proud to have answered the call and served my country. I wasn't mislead by either my military or civilian leadership of the times. It was my choice and I'm glad I did it. I'd do it again! I don't need any "healing" of the type you prescribe! Play that tune to someone else more gulible than me! I'm very much at peace with my involvement in the war. My view is a very realistic one. I lead a very normal life and don't need any "help" from liberals like you to "deal with" anything. I have a very clear understanding of Viet Nam, Vietnamese, and the Viet Nam war from a life time of experiences with them. No offense intended, Aslanpal, but from your comments, it is clear to me these are things you know essentially nothing about.

Patrick

 

Patrick, I thank you for your service as a Veteran. You are very fortunate and blessed to be able to lead a normal life.

I work in the health care profession and can tell you there are many messed up Vietnam vets who are still messed up all these years later, on psychiatric medications, or drugs and booze. And not a few in numbers of our homeless on the streets and shelters in the USA are Vietnam vets. There are also thousands upon thousands receiving VA benefits, as well, for a myriad of injuries from psychological and physical reasons. They are fortunate, as well, I suppose. At least they got to come home alive without being in a flag-draped coffin and they are not among the MIAs.

I do wonder, since it is documented that Iraq has become the new pipeline for drug flow from Afghanistan to Europe, how many of our troops will end up with addictions, either from the battle field or from legal drugs administered for the psychological issues associated with warfare. I also assume there is a pretty big drug problem in Iraq since the drugs are flowing through there so freely. I've not seen anything in the press regarding the Interim Government and what they are doing to deal with the drug trafficking problem. Perhaps they are busy with other issues.

I also wonder if our military has some sort of deconditioning program in place to help our soldiers returning from the battlefield so they can adapt to civilian life once again. I've read where some are involved in spousal abuse because they are not deprogrammed. I wonder if the military is addressing any of these issues.

It seems a lot goes into making a soldier and preparing the soldier for battle. What processes are in place to help the soldier return to a "normal" life?

Just curious.

 

I appreciate your comments. There are indeed soldiers from every war with physical and mental scars. Some of them do need professional help. It has happened in my own family. Few, if any of us, go through battle without some permanent impact to our lives. That impact, however, need not destroy one's ability to function nor become an excuse for conduct that's unacceptable to society. The vast majority of veterans adapt just fine and continue on with normal lives. The vast majority understand what it was all about and use the experiences as a foundation for valuing the cost of liberty and the reality of war. There are those with legitimate problems, some who've used it as an excuse, and some who are impostors and fakers. The military teaches people to be warriors but it doesn't teach people to be drug users, spousal abusers, murders, misfits, etc. Many of those who fall into those behaviors were headed that way regardless. In fact, some studies of Viet Nam veterans in particular, have shown that there are fewer problems in these areas among veterans than the general population of their peers. Poplar perception is that Viet Nam veterans are prone to such behavior and, in fact, became drug users and murders during the war, or are homeless now because of it. That's a long way from the truth! There are a number of good references that can be read on these subjects. Stolen Valor is one excellent book that comes to mind. Vietnam magazine frequently has good articles on these subjects. The American Legion also tries to set the record straight from time to time. These resources are, regrettably, in the minority and poplar opinion has been formed more from the entertainment world, news media, and the more visible atypical veteran. It's a shame that typical veterans are portrayed this way.

Patrick

 

First of all Dragoon I am a very independent minded person and vote that way ..you can cast
labels all you want to hang on to your bias and
hurt but I really did look into the historical
record.