new TNIV field test

Okay, I'm not trying to be condescending here, just curious. Since you will be basing the TNIV on something, what will it be? There are two major (at least) manuscript streams and although I am not a KJVO, I recognize that the sources are different and am therefore curious as to what "three" Greek" versions you have and what "Hebrew" Bible you have. Mr. Leman has made made it very clear on his website how he feels about one of the streams. So, which one are you using as comparison? That is all I am asking. Three different "Greek" versions tells me little. If you are going to provide your opinion of the TNIV, let us start with setting a source to compare it to.
I think this might be a good place for DocCas to jump in-----this is definitely not over his head!

 

Ah! So you are not trying to be patronizing! I
never imagined that you were--until this recent
post to me! I thought you were asking me a
simple question, which I answered simply.

First of all, I never came on this BB pretending
any authority of any kind; in fact, I have stated
repeatedly all over the BB that I am not a
scholar but a student of the Bible. Believe it
or not, we students of the Bible who are not
scholars also have opinions! 8o) While some
may think that such opinions are without
foundation or that, without their particular ple-
thora of knowledge, are useless, it is what we
have. So perhaps you will think it "over [my]
head." 8o)

So you want me to list all my source Bibles
and their sources? 8o) That will have to wait.
I am off to synagogue for the day and won't
be back until well after dark.

[ October 05, 2002, 01:01 PM: Message edited by: Abiyah ]

 

Interesting quote...
“Some of the most strident voices demeaning the TNIV are associated with these new versions—a situation many translators and publishers consider a conflict of interest,” Kohlenberger wrote in Priscilla Papers, a journal of the Christians for Biblical Equality. He said the critics were associated either with the Holman New Testament published in 2000 or “served as advisers, reviewers or ‘translators’ of the evangelical revision of the RSV,” published as the ESV in 2001.

 

Interesting view, but I frankly don't agree. The TNIV, while making some improvements in the NIV text, has subcombed to the 'spirit of the age'. I'll stick with my old RSV.

 

Philip --

To answer your question

Greek:
Nestle's
Elzevir's
Stephens'

Hebrew without English notations:
Hebrew Publishing Company's Tanakh
Lowe & Drydone

Hebrew Scriptures with English notations and
translations:
Stone
Green
Jerusalem
Fisch (Koren)

[ October 06, 2002, 01:05 AM: Message edited by: Abiyah ]

 

Abiyah,

I forgot to get back to you after your last response to me, so I just thought I would say that I certainly respect you as well. As for our being "miles apart" on the "gender-neutral translation" issue, you are correct in saying that we are. However, no matter how many miles apart we are on that issue, those miles cannot separate as brother and sister in Christ! I think you would agree to that!

Pastork

[ October 09, 2002, 09:51 PM: Message edited by: Pastork ]

 

Pastork --

You have no idea how much I appreciate that
post. Thank you. It seems that so many times,
when one person is going through a tough
place, someone else just says the right things.
8o) Thank you for being the one.

 

Abiyah,
I owe you an appology too. I have been very bad at pulling things out of context lately due to some reasons beyond my control, but I feel I was extra hard on you and when I went back and read the postings I realized I was unfair.

My remark about DocCas was an attempt to pull him back into the conversation and compliment him, but it was not perceived (by either your OR ME) that way when I reread it.

I respect your position and I think that we are MUCH closer in theology of Biblical translations than you realize. Noting that you like the NASB, I do too. I still disagree as far as the TNIV is concerned, but probably for more reasons than I need to go into right now. But, we can agree to disagree on that point, I hope..??

Anyway, I am far more interested in your "denomination" of Baptist Messianic (correct me on the exact name). You refer to synagogue and obviously you retain many of the same Jewish customs of the era before Christ--bringing them forward and including Christianity instead of rejecting it as mainstream Judiasm, is this correct? Are there websites discussing your beliefs, etc. It seems fascinating, because Christianity is nothing more than an extension of the "original" Jewish worship. I hope I haven't offended you by getting something wrong here, and please don't take it that way, I would simply like to know more.

 

Good going, Philip!

[ October 08, 2002, 05:38 PM: Message edited by: Pastork ]

 

To answer bluntly, this world could use more
people like you. I certaily appreciate and accept
your apology, and the whole thing is forgotten
8o) I missread things, too, at times.

It NEVER bothers me when people disagree with
me. I would not be as happy in this world if we
all thought alike; it wouldv take out much of the
spice of living!

One pastor was Baptist-trained and trained
in Judaism as well as reared in a Baptist
pastor's home. He graduated from Northwest
Baptist Seminary in 1976 & 1980. Being Jewish,
his heart was always toward the Jews, however,
and he desired to bring them to the Messiah and
to provide for them a place to attend, where they
could worship our Lord and our God, where their
Jewishness would not be diminished.

The other pastor is still in training but extremely
knowledgeable in his teachings.

I hope that you do not mind my not stating the
name of my synagogue. I had to deal with a
cyber-stalker once and never quite got over it.
I fear putting that information out on a public
board.

That is real close to correct! 8o) We see the
customs more as those practiced by our Lord
and His disciples and other followers as well.
We do not call ourselves Christians, but Messian-
ics, though. This is because we don't practice
many of the things the Christian church practices
and we have traditions that the church does not
practice.

My synagogue has two websites, but as I said,
I feel the need not to disclose too much that will
pinpoint where I am. Since we are connected
to an organization, I will give you their website
instead: www.ffoz.org

Once again, thank you for your kindness. 8o)

[ October 08, 2002, 10:14 PM: Message edited by: Abiyah ]

 

Hey, just call me 'ole-foot-n-tha-mouth'.

Let me show you how limited my knowledge really is, maybe you can help me. I see you made the image of from your source code when I quoted you. How do I get the source, or clip and paste the other icons?

Another thing, and this REALLY shows you my ineptness...what is IMO and IMHO (or whatever the other remark is)?

I can slap my forehead when you answer.

 

Philip,

When you write a reply, there are a number of "Instant Graemlins" at the bottom left the writing screen. I just click on whichever one I want to use and it shows up when I click "Add Reply".

I think IMO means "in my opinion" and IMHO means "in my humble opinion". Do you have any idea what FWIW might mean? I have seen it before and am clueless. Here's another one, LOL. Does it mean "laugh out loud"?

Pastork

 

I know I am getting off the subject here, and I appologize to the board and moderator, but I visited the site and it is very interesting. I am not Jewish, but Israel and the Jewish people have always fascinated me. Probably eeven more than someone who has not had the opportunity to see Israel as I did some 30 years back when I went after talking my parents (who had never flown before) into it.

This was not long after the 73 war and Israel was stilll concerned about security. (I totally understand their security issues today, people don't realize the size of Israel and how much they already share their capital, Jerusalem, with the Palestinians). A quit funny story and I will wrap this up. We were on the ruins of Megiddo and a pastor was reading from Revelations to the group about the end of time. I had wandered from the group and was watching an Israeli KFIR (fighter) coming towards us flying faster than the sound barrier. I continued to watch this jet streak above us at no more than 500 feet with a boom that sounded (and felt) as if it came from heaven. You should have seen the people jump. They thought God had just opened the door.

Anyway, I recommend the trip to anyboddy who has not made it, to see the Jewish state blossom in the desert. (Just don't take pictures of the air-to-air missiles on top of Mount Carmel---that's another novel.)

Sorry, to get sidetracked, but the website brought back many wonderful memories of walking where our Lord walked and walking on the promised land.

 

Although I have not posted in this thread, I have been reading it with interest. Those of you who know me, pretty much know what my views are in this situation.

As Moderator, I want to commend you all for the civility in which you have discussed this topic. I thought it might get heated there for a minute but it cooled down again quickly. It is refreshing to see debates in which both sides of the arguement can retain their testimony.

God Bless You,

Pastor Bob

 

Pastor Bob,

There are good, kind people on Baptist Board.
I am amazed quite often at the caliber of people
here. It is refreshing.

 

Thanks RSR, I have been around and long time and it is amazing how many things that I don't know, but feel embarrassed to ask. IMHO!

Pastor Bob63 the tension was all my fault. If I get out of line in the future---just ignore me (or edit me out.) I took a perfectly reasonable conversation and jumped in with both feet. That mouth got me in trouble after school a few times and Im still learning. Hey, it works, THANKS Pastork! I like it!!!!!! Have a good day all!

 

I don't think it was entirely your fault, Philip.
(Ya' wanna fight about it?!? 8o) I looked back
at some of my earlier posts, and I reealized
that because I am so tired of this subject 8o) ,
I let that get in the way, and my early posts
here were what I would now call inflamatory.

I owe as much of an apology as anyone else.
Sso I am sorry, too. 8o)

[ October 10, 2002, 11:24 PM: Message edited by: Abiyah ]