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News: Please Do Not support Terrorism in Ireland

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by Ulsterman, Feb 27, 2003.

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  1. Ulsterman

    Ulsterman New Member

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    Thank you for your gracious correction. I would not presume to be an expert on the American War of Independence. In conversation with various American missionaries on this island I perceived the opinion I shared in point 2, to be true. It is true, however, that the Scots Irish, who today value British culture in Ireland did fight against the English in this war.

    George Washington himself is quoted as saying, "If all else fails, I will retreat up the valley of Virginia, plant my flag on the Blue Ridge, rally around the Scotch-Irish of that region, and make my last stand for liberty amongst a people who will never submit to British tyranny whilst there is a man left to draw a trigger"

    And:"When our friendless standards were first unfurled, who were the strangers who first mustered around our staff, and when it reeled in the fight, who more brilliantly sustained it than Erin's generous sons." He was referring to the Scotch-Irish from Northern Ireland.

    http://www.scotchirish.net/Fearless%20Soldiers.php4
     
    #21 Ulsterman, Mar 3, 2003
  2. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    I do not doubt in the least your quotation of General of the Army Washington (Congress in the last ten years or so posthumously promoted him, so he would be the senior most officer on the Army Lists. In life, GEN Washington only rose to the rank of IIRC Lt. General.) However, the Ulster Scots were fairly isolated on the frontier in the Blue Ridge Mountains (the Virginia/Kentucky/Tennessee/Carolinas border region). They were relative late comers to the Colonies. Now the following is speculation on my part, but it fits the pattern of 18th century immigration from Great Britain. The reason for the the large number of Ulster Scots was the practices of entailment and primogeniture (the practice of passing on the family lands only to the oldest son.). So, there were many younger sons who came here to gain some land and make their place in the world.

    I would add IIRC that some of the Scottish regiments were disbanded here in America after the Seven Years (French and Indian) War rather than be returned home to Scotland. And other Scots landed here after the Risings of '15 and '45 and the Highland clearances. These also added to the Continental Cause. (No wonder the was a reservoir of anti-Hanovarian sentiment.)

    [ March 03, 2003, 05:09 PM: Message edited by: The Squire ]
     
    #22 Squire Robertsson, Mar 3, 2003
  3. jonmagee

    jonmagee New Member

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    an interesting debate on history, but is this not a bit distant from the declared intention of the topic ref Davids concerns about support for terrorism today (albeit through ignorance)

    yours, Jon.
     
    #23 jonmagee, Mar 3, 2003
  4. Ulsterman

    Ulsterman New Member

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    Jon is right - we digress! To get back to the subject at hand Mike McK stated "I have never knowingly given money to the IRA.

    Yes, it's true that I met Martin McGuinness at the St Patrick's Day Parade in Philadelphia a few years ago but our exchange consisted of nothing more than, "Sorry we couldn't have nicer weather for you" and "It's a lovely city" and a picture with some friends from a local Hibernian Division."

    First of all I accept that he may have given money to the IRA, as many US citizens do, in ignorance, and sometimes this money is given by indirect means (e.g., to "widows" etc.). Having said that, I wonder at Mike's wisdom in attending a St. Patrick's Day parade alongside those of the Ancient Order of the Hibernian where Martin McGuinness "MP" was no doubt accorded some degree of honour. The AOH is a Roman Catholic Institution. Perhaps Mike was not a believer at the time. If he was, then I think he must admit to crossing the line in the area of Biblical separation. Martin McGuinness was chief of staff of the Londonderry unit of the IRA, one of the most notorious and murderous gangs ever to operate on this island. He over saw the deaths of hundreds of innocent Roman Catholics and Protestants. Among the atrocities he must have been involved with was the indiscriminate bombing of Claudy village in 1973 which took nine innocent lives, including those of two children. The man is complicit in multiple murders, no more, no less.

    If Mike was unaware of this, will he now acknowledge that his acquaintance with McGuinness, however casual, was naive, and if he was aware of it, will he admit that he was wrong to have anything to do with an event in which McGuinness was to be held in high regard?
     
    #24 Ulsterman, Mar 4, 2003
  5. jonmagee

    jonmagee New Member

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    No criticism intended, but merely a question. What is the feelings of the average American to the ways in which Martin Mcguiness and Gerry Adams have been honoured in past visits to US in contrast to the strong anti terrorist stance since september 11th?

    yours, Jon.
     
    #25 jonmagee, Mar 4, 2003
  6. Ulsterman

    Ulsterman New Member

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    #26 Ulsterman, Mar 4, 2003
  7. Mike McK

    Mike McK New Member

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    As I've told you, David, I've said all I have to say.

    My hands are clean. If anyone chooses to judge me otherwise, that's between them and God.

    I will say, though that I make no apologies for my friendship with Catholics, as it was Catholics who played such a large part in my becoming a Christian.
     
    #27 Mike McK, Mar 4, 2003
  8. jonmagee

    jonmagee New Member

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    ok, so I have read the other thread now. All I can say is that when it is republished in our media the impression over here is more in agreement with Squires interpretation of American press than with Mikes. You will appreciate, therefore that as you will feel offended by the actions of a young athlete, how much more so will your allies in Britain.

    yours, Jon.
     
    #28 jonmagee, Mar 4, 2003
  9. mark

    mark <img src =/mark.gif>

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    On a bit of a Rabbit trail... I used to live in a community here in Iowa that is the sister-city of Dublin. Every year a member of the Irish Parliament comes to visit. And ALMOST every year the dignitary urges the citizens (very many of Irish descent) are urged not to give to the IRA. The fact that they are urged NOT to give, indicates to me that there are some who probably do give.
     
    #29 mark, Mar 4, 2003
  10. jonmagee

    jonmagee New Member

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    #30 jonmagee, Mar 6, 2003
  11. Sherrie

    Sherrie New Member

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    No normal, average, person I know gives to any terrorist group, or groups that are asking for help in other countries. They have enough just helping their own families and communities, and local chairities.

    I have been in many an Irish Pub in my day, and I assure you no collections were being taken. The tip jar was the worry of the day.

    My grandmother was an Irish woman, and belonged to many organizations for The Irish in America, and I also never saw any mention of such things.

    It seems odd there would even be this thread.

    Sherrie
     
    #31 Sherrie, Mar 6, 2003
  12. InHim2002

    InHim2002 New Member

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    Regardless of whether or not you have personally witnessed people raising funds for the IRA the fact remains that the USA is where they get most of their funding:

    from the bbc - that is a good article you might find it informative.

    It is also true that the USA has rolled out the red carpet for Irish terrorists
     
    #32 InHim2002, Mar 6, 2003
  13. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    As this thread has gone to a third page, I am issueing the six hour warning. One of this forum's moderators will close this thread No Earlier Than 5:15pm Eastern/Board time.
     
    #33 Squire Robertsson, Mar 6, 2003
  14. Mike McK

    Mike McK New Member

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    Good. It shouldn't have been allowed to go this far.
     
    #34 Mike McK, Mar 6, 2003
  15. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    As Mr. Keeper, the landlord of the Double Eagle down in the village, says at times like this, "Closeing Time, M'Lords, Ladies and Gentlemen, Closeing Time".
     
    #35 Squire Robertsson, Mar 6, 2003
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