No Fear of God before their Eyes !

[savedbymercy]

Rom 3:18

There is no fear of God before their eyes.

Religious people today do not have fear of God before their eyes, and when I say fear of God, I mean reverence for the Almighty, for they think of God to be like unto themselves. Paul writes of them here 2 Tim 3:5

Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

For instance, they think and believe God can will or desire a thing and then not bring it to pass, for they will say that God wills the Salvation of all men without exception from [ 1 Tim 2:4] but He does not bring it to pass, but the Testimony of scripture and the Saints states Job 23:13

13 But he is in one mind, and who can turn him? and what his soul desireth, even that he doeth.

This type of thinking about God is why it is said that Job was one that Feared God Job 1:1

There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil.

Job had knowledge of the Almighty !

David writes Ps 115:3

3 But our God is in the heavens: he hath done whatsoever he hath pleased.

This testimony comes from a heart that fears and reverences God, and states that God has done whatsoever He pleased. The word pleased here is the hebrew word chaphets and means:


to delight in, take pleasure in, desire, be pleased with

a) (Qal)

1) of men

a) to take pleasure in, delight in

b) to delight, desire, be pleased to do

2) of God

a) to delight in, have pleasure in

b) to be pleased to do

2) to move, bend down

a) (Qal) to bend down

God has done what He pleases, meaning what God wills, He does. With men this is not the case, for we oft time meet with disappointment, however this cannot be with God, because He is Almighty and Sovereign !

 

[savedbymercy]

Isa 14:27

27 For the Lord of hosts hath purposed, and who shall disannul it? and his hand is stretched out, and who shall turn it back?

Ps 33:10

11 The counsel of the Lord standeth for ever, the thoughts of his heart to all generations.

Even as God thinks [His Thoughts] so shall it come to pass, what He has purposed so shall it stand. Now in 1 Tim 2:4, the word will here means purpose :

It is the greek word thelō:


to will, have in mind, intend

a) to be resolved or determined, to purpose

b) to desire, to wish

c) to love

1) to like to do a thing, be fond of doing

d) to take delight in, have pleasure

1 Tim 2:4

Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Now the false religionists says that God, the Lord of Hosts, can purpose, be resolved, to intend, even determine for a man, but that man by his freewill can and does often times disannul it ! They say God's purpose for a man can be defeated and frustrated by mans freewill, this is some of the highest blasphemy that can from a persons mouth about God, and shows a total lack of the Fear of God !

 

[savedbymercy]

My counsel SHALL stand !



Isa 46:9-10

Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,

10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure:

The God of the Bible states, My Counsel shall stand ! What Counsel ? Eph 1:11

11 In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:

The Counsel of His Own Will, thats what Counsel !

Yes, even when men reject His Counsel [Lk 7:30], That is still the Counsel of His own Will standing !!

God's Own Counsel will stand regardless of man's idol freewill ! The God of the Bible states " I will do all my pleasure" This word pleasure means desire, purpose !

Now in light of this, how can it be the will or pleasure or desire of God, for all men without exception to be saved and come into the Knowledge of the Truth, and he not do it ? What prevents Him ? Is it the almighty freewill of man ? That is what false religionists would have us to believe ! They teach that God's counsel will not always stand !

 

[savedbymercy]

The difference !

The difference between True Religion that Honors Christ and His Atoning , Saving Death, and false religion that does not, but are opposed of His Saving Death is this, the false believers say Christ's Death becomes effectual by the sinners receiving of it, whereas True Believers say ones receiving is because Christ Death was effectual ! That Christ's Death produces the redemptive qualities of Faith and Repentance, for they are fruits of His Death ! The false teachers followers deny that Christ's death alone secures the Salvation of the sinner and relegates that act to the act of the sinner's appropriation. Those who hold such Christ dishonoring views should never be considered of the Household of Faith, but should be earnestly contended against !

 

[McWilliams]

“But to the wicked God says, "What right have you to tell of My statutes, And to take My covenant in your mouth? For you hate discipline, And you cast My words behind you.
When you see a thief, you are pleased with him, And you associate with adulterers. You let your mouth loose in evil, And your tongue frames deceit. You sit and speak against your brother; You slander your own mother's son. These things you have done, and I kept silence; You thought that I was just like you; I will reprove you, and state the case in order before your eyes.“ (Psalm 50 :16-21).

 

[mont974x4]

Fear of God is lacking due to a lacking knowledge of God. People who are not committed to knowing His Word do not know Him. These cannot fear Him.

Also, people who see church attendance as an item on a spiritual to-do list or as a social club have entirely missed the point of God's redemptive plan. They too are unable to fear Him.

 

[savedbymercy]

Fear of God is lacking due to a lacking knowledge of God. People who are not committed to knowing His Word do not know Him. These cannot fear Him.

Also, people who see church attendance as an item on a spiritual to-do list or as a social club have entirely missed the point of God's redemptive plan. They too are unable to fear Him.

All men by nature lack a fear and knowledge of God ! Rom 3:17-18

17 And the way of peace have they not known:

18 There is no fear of God before their eyes.

One of the Saving Virtues and Benefits of those Christ died for, is that they will be brought to Know the True God and Jesus Christ Jn 17:2-3

As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

This presupposes that they did not once Know the True God and Jesus Christ whom God sent !

 

[The Biblicist]

The difference !

the false believers say Christ's Death becomes effectual by the sinners receiving of it, whereas True Believers say ones receiving is because Christ Death was effectual !

Who made you judge of who are and who are not true believers???

Are you claiming that salvation is determined by ones understanding of the extent and application of the atonement rather than simple repentance toward God and faith in Christ as sufficient Savior???

If so, where and what gospel presented in scriptures contains that exception clause?

Tell me are you a hypocrit? If you are not a hypocrit then tell us how much theology you understood when you first recieved the gospel of salvation?

Tell me, does teaching doctrine come first in the Great Commission or recieving the gospel and being baptized (Mt. 28:19-20).

According to you one must be first taught and understand the proper extent and application of the atonement or they cannot be true believers!!

 

[savedbymercy]

the bib

Who made you judge of who are and who are not true believers???

Who made you judge of me ???

Are you claiming that salvation is determined by ones understanding of the extent and application of the atonement rather than simple repentance toward God and faith in Christ as sufficient Savior???

Salvation is dependent on none but God

According to you one must be first taught and understand the proper extent and application of the atonement or they cannot be true believers!!

One must believe the Gospel to be a believer ! Do you deny that particular Atonement is a Gospel Truth ?

And if you want to know what I believe the Gospel is, then checkout this thread:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=72022

 

[The Biblicist]

the bib



Who made you judge of me ???

I quoted your own words. Your own words judge you! Here again are your OWN WORDS:

"the false believers say Christ's Death becomes effectual by the sinners receiving of it, whereas True Believers say ones receiving is because Christ Death was effectual!" - SBM


Are you a lying two face hypocrit or are your own words dependable and true concerning what you believe???

According to YOUR OWN WORDS anyone who merely will "SAY Christ's Death becomes effectual by sinners receiving it" are "false beleivers"! So are you not saying by your own words that anyone who merely says this is a false believer???

One must believe the Gospel to be a believer ! Do you deny that particular Atonement is a Gospel Truth ?

Are you not saying by your own words here that unless a person is taught particular redemption and confess particular redemption they cannot be a true believer? Hence, only those who first understand and confess particular redemption are "true believers" while all others are "false believers."


You have a real tough time being honest don't you?!!??

 

[billwald]

>One must believe the Gospel to be a believer

Exactly what is the Gospel which I must believe? Does the Apostle's Creed contain sufficient info to function as a list of what one must believe? If not, what is lacking?

 

[savedbymercy]

I quoted your own words. Your own words judge you! Here again are your OWN WORDS:

"the false believers say Christ's Death becomes effectual by the sinners receiving of it, whereas True Believers say ones receiving is because Christ Death was effectual!" - SBM


Are you a lying two face hypocrit or are your own words dependable and true concerning what you believe???

According to YOUR OWN WORDS anyone who merely will "SAY Christ's Death becomes effectual by sinners receiving it" are "false beleivers"! So are you not saying by your own words that anyone who merely says this is a false believer???






Are you not saying by your own words here that unless a person is taught particular redemption and confess particular redemption they cannot be a true believer? Hence, only those who first understand and confess particular redemption are "true believers" while all others are "false believers."


You have a real tough time being honest don't you?!!??

One must believe the Gospel to be a believer ! Do you deny that particular Atonement is a Gospel Truth ?

Jesus said that he that believeth the Gospel shall be saved Mk 16:15-16

15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

16 He that believeth[The Gospel] and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

If there is no proof that one believes the Gospel, why should we call them saved ? If you cannot make a judgment like that, your christian life is worthless, for you cannot serve Christ that way !

The Gospel is the standard for fellowship ! Phil 1:5

For your fellowship in the gospel from the first day until now;

If you do not know what the Gospel is, you should not call yourself a preacher, a Biblicist ! Lol

And , Particular Atonement, for whom Christ died is a Gospel Truth, without it, no Gospel !

 

[The Biblicist]

If you do not know what the Gospel is, you should not call yourself a preacher, a Biblicist ! Lol

The question is not whether limited atonement is true or not. The question is must one understand and believe that particular aspect to be a true believer. You claim if a person merely says that the atonement must be applied that that is proof they are "false believer."

I find it very difficult to believe that you are a true believer because you are such arrogant individual. I could say the same thing about you and the fruit of the Spirit! Can anyone with your kind of attitude have the Spirit of God inside of them? What would be the acid test for the Spirit of God inside a person? Wouldn't it be the fruit of the Spirit? Hence, your salvation could be greatly questioned could it not?

 

[savedbymercy]

the bib

The question is not whether limited atonement is true or not.

That is not even the question at all, for it is True, and there is no Gospel without specifically stating and explaining it so ! The same goes for The Election of Grace Rom 11:5-6.

If you or any other man, myself included, do not or did not preach Unconditional Election of Grace, Particular Limited Atonement, we have not Preached the Gospel !!

Now, I am not stating that Believing anything is the causative reason for salvation,for that is works, however I am stating that what one believes is the evidence of Salvation.

Any man saying that he is saved by Grace, and yet rejects the Very Gospel of Grace, Election, particular atonement, to name just a few, then they have not believed the Gospel, I do not care who it is ! Its impossible to give evidence of Salvation and reject the Gospel at the same time !

 

[The Biblicist]

the bib



That is not even the question at all, for it is True, and there is no Gospel without specifically stating and explaining it so ! The same goes for The Election of Grace Rom 11:5-6.

If you or any other man, myself included, do not or did not preach Unconditional Election of Grace, Particular Limited Atonement, we have not Preached the Gospel !!

Now, I am not stating that Believing anything is the causative reason for salvation,for that is works, however I am stating that what one believes is the evidence of Salvation.

Any man saying that he is saved by Grace, and yet rejects the Very Gospel of Grace, Election, particular atonement, to name just a few, then they have not believed the Gospel, I do not care who it is ! Its impossible to give evidence of Salvation and reject the Gospel at the same time !

According to you Jesus was a false preacher because he never stated or explained any of the five points to the woman at the well or to Nicodemus or to the rich young ruler or anyone else.

CH Spurgeon then is a lost man because he was saved at a Methodist chapel without a preacher. A deacon filled the pulpit and simply told him to "look and live" - no limited atonement explained, no unconditional election explained, no total depravity explained, no irresistable grace explained, no perseverance/preservation of the saints explained!

I doubt if you or any preacher in your denomination is saved by your demand that they must be taught and understand all five points of grace before they can be a true believer!

According to your explanation Paul is a false preacher as he summarized the gospel not in five points but in simple words:

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

According to your defintion God is false preacher as God preached the gospel to Abraham in even a shorter sentence "in thee shall all nations be blessed" - Gal. 3:8 - no declaration and explanation of the five points of grace.

The gospel is not the five points of Calvin but the simple truth that you are a sinner and the promise of the Gospel is that Christ will save you from your sins by faith in the cross and his resurrection as completely sufficient.

 

[savedbymercy]

the bib

According to you Jesus was a false preacher

Another rabbit trail and false accusation !

 

[The Biblicist]

the bib
Another rabbit trail and false accusation !

A. Here is proof right from his own mouth to prove I am not making any false accusations:

"Cain was not created in Adam in the beginning...... Cain was out of that generation, and not out of that Generation in Adam ! !" - SBM post #1 (What about Cain Thread)

"This also tells us that cain was never made in the Image of God, only those in Adam were !" - SBM post #17 (What about Cain thread)

"Oh Yes I can, it means cain was not in Adam at Creation. Cain was in the Serpent, not Adam ! Yes, God stated that the serpent had a seed as well as Adam ! Gen 3:14-15" - SBM Post #21 (What About Cain Thread)

"his clearly points out that cain was not of their seed ! Neither is any of the non elect, only the Elect of God sinned in Adam, not the devil's seed ! " - SBM Post #31 (What About Cain Thread).

SBM Argues that Cain cannot be found in this geneology because he was not created "in Adam" and thus his source of sin and death cannot be traced to Adam's sin and death but rather to Satan Himself and is a whole different kind of humanity that Satan created.



B. Readers, look at this rediculous intepretation of Genesis 5 and Adam's geneology by SBM.


Here are the problems with his interpretation of that geneology in Genesis 5 as only the elect of God.

1. No other woman but Eve mentioned in this geneology and so no elect sisters, wives or daughters for 1600 years.

2. Only ONE son is mentioned birthed to all the men who are mentioned, thus none of their daughters or other sons ever a child of God.

3. They had other children even as it is explicitly stated that Adam and Eve had other "sons and daughters" after Seth was born.

CONCLUSION: Were all their wives, daughters and sisters and other sons born in the geneology of Cain?????????????? Think about this! It is such an absurd interpetation that it defies imagination that any rational person could even entertain it without histerical laughter.

If you haven't got it, it would mean Seth's wife had to be born in line of Cain because she is not mentioned in Adam's line just as Cain is not mentioned in Adam's line. It would mean all the other children of Adam and these firstborn men had to be somehow fathered by both the named man and someone from the line of Cain because they are not mentioned by name! Do you get this absolute nonsense????????

This geneology only lists the FIRSTBORN sons and lineage through whom Christ would eventually be traced through and therefore like all other geneologies that Christ would come through only first born sons are named. Only the geneologies given by Matthew and Luke contain women but no other sisters, sons or daughters.

 

[The Biblicist]

the bib



Another rabbit trail and false accusation !

Either you beleive what you said or you don't. You said that a person must understand and believe all five points to be a true believer. You said any preacher who does not preach all five points is not a true preacher. Do you want me to quote your words??? Here they are:

If you or any other man, myself included, do not or did not preach Unconditional Election of Grace, Particular Limited Atonement, we have not Preached the Gospel !! - SBM


According to your own criteria Spurgeon and probably yourself and the preachers you associate with are all false believers. According to that criteria Jesus failed to preach the gospel to the woman at the well, the rich young ruler, Zacheaus, etc.

 

[savedbymercy]

The bib

According to your explanation Paul is a false preacher as he summarized the gospel not in five points but in simple words:

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

I am glad you said it was a summary there. But even there 1 Cor 15:3, who are the Our Sins Paul is speaking of ? Its the Church Eph 5:25

Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

It was the chosen or the called of God ! Paul preached to them earlier 1 Cor 1:23-27

23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

In vs 24 " which are called" in the greek it is autoiv de toiv klhtoiv, Ioudaioiv te kai Ellhsin, Xriston qeou dunamin kai qeou sofian;

Them the called ! The definite article precedes the word called, for only a definite called People are called by the Gospel, its that definite people Christ died in behalf of, and Paul made that clear.

You actually picked a passage in 1 Cor 15:3-4 that shows us that Paul did preach a limited atonement !

Paul also would have also explained in detail who Christ is ! So when He stated Christ died for our Sins, they would have knowledge of Christ to know who it was that died for them !

 

[The Biblicist]

The bib



I am glad you said it was a summary there. But even there 1 Cor 15:3, who are the Our Sins Paul is speaking of ? Its the Church Eph 5:25

Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

It was the chosen or the called of God ! Paul preached to them earlier 1 Cor 1:23-27

23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

In vs 24 " which are called" in the greek it is autoiv de toiv klhtoiv, Ioudaioiv te kai Ellhsin, Xriston qeou dunamin kai qeou sofian;

Them the called ! The definite article precedes the word called, for only a definite called People are called by the Gospel, its that definite people Christ died in behalf of, and Paul made that clear.

You actually picked a passage in 1 Cor 15:3-4 that shows us that Paul did preach a limited atonement !

Paul also would have also explained in detail who Christ is ! So when He stated Christ died for our Sins, they would have knowledge of Christ to know who it was that died for them !

I don't deny limited atonement. What I deny is that the preacher must spell out all five points or else the gospel is not preached. What I deny is that the believer must understand all five points and believe all five points in order to be a true believer. By that criteria 1 Cor. 15:3-4 is not the gospel because even in a sumarized presentation where is total depravity mentioned? Where is irresistable grace mentioned. Where is perseverance/preservation of the saints mentioned?

By your criteria you cannot find one time in the scriptues where Jesus preached the gospel.

By your criteria Spurgeon and most likely if you would be honest, you and none ofthe preachers you claim to be gospel preachers were true believers at the time you professed salvation.