Not Scripturally supported?

[agedman]

Where in the Scriptures does It state that God can not look upon sin?


It is a fallen argument, for throughout Scriptures God most certainly not only looks upon sin, but works through and in partnership with the sin-filled.

The context of “God cannot look upon sin” is NOT from God, but from heathen hearted folks trying to refute the prophetic message.

It was and is a false argument to suggest God had to turn away from Christ on the cross because of sin.

 

[loDebar]

Where in the Scriptures does It state that God can not look upon sin?


It is a fallen argument, for throughout Scriptures God most certainly not only looks upon sin, but works through and in partnership with the sin-filled.

The context of “God cannot look upon sin” is NOT from God, but from heathen hearted folks trying to refute the prophetic message.

It was and is a false argument to suggest God had to turn away from Christ on the cross because of sin.

Hab. 1:13 is pretty strong "look upon" can mean "show regard"

Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity: wherefore lookest thou upon them that deal treacherously, andholdest thy tongue when the wicked devoureth the man that is more righteous than he?

 

[Jerome]

found it!

Founders Journal 98:39

God is too holy to even look upon sin, how much more to have fellowship with darkness.

founders.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/FoundersJournal98.pdf

 

[agedman]

Hab. 1:13 is pretty strong "look upon" can mean "show regard"

Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity: wherefore lookest thou upon them that deal treacherously, andholdest thy tongue when the wicked devoureth the man that is more righteous than he?

To take what you would desire it to mean would oblige the words to be spoken by someone who was speaking for God.

Such is just not the true context.

Beginning with Adam God has never avoided looking upon sin, the sinner, and sinfulness.

It is impossible for God not to look upon sin and sinner.

 

[agedman]

found it!

Founders Journal 98:39


founders.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/FoundersJournal98.pdf

Be more specific with page number so what is said is seen in context.

Thanks

 

[agedman]

Be more specific with page number so what is said is seen in context.

Thanks

found it!

Founders Journal 98:39


founders.org/site/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/FoundersJournal98.pdf

Opps, didn’t realize you had already shown the page number.

Again, as stated above, some take Habakkuk’s statement as if God was saying it.

Not so.

 

[agedman]

Perhaps, it would be good for someone to show an example of when God did not look upon sin, sinfulness, and the sinner.

Such is not found in Scripture as far as I’ve searched.

If such can be found, then John 3:16 is a lie.

 

[rlvaughn]

Where in the Scriptures does It state that God can not look upon sin?

I'm pretty sure Habakkuk 1:13 is the foundation of this phrase. That doesn't mean those who use it are using it correctly. Here is part of John Gill's comment on the text:

The Lord with his eyes of omniscience beholds all things good and evil, and all men good and bad, with all their actions; but then he does not look upon the sins of men with pleasure and approbation; since they are contrary to his nature, repugnant to his will, and breaches of his righteous law: and though sin in general may be included here, yet there seems to be a particular respect had to the "evil" or injury done by the Chaldeans to the Jews, in invading their land, spoiling their substance, and slaying their persons

 

[loDebar]

To take what you would desire it to mean would oblige the words to be spoken by someone who was speaking for God.

Such is just not the true context.

Beginning with Adam God has never avoided looking upon sin, the sinner, and sinfulness.

It is impossible for God not to look upon sin and sinner.

All verses have to be true.

look upon means regard,

Sinners, us , are condemned already. We can only have a relationship with God through Jesus.

Remember He says "depart from me I never knew ye. " of course He has knowledge of us but no relationship of us being sent to lake of fire

 

[agedman]

I'm pretty sure Habakkuk 1:13 is the foundation of this phrase. That doesn't mean those who use it are using it correctly. Here is part of John Gill's comment on the text:

All verses have to be true.

look upon means regard,

Sinners, us , are condemned already. We can only have a relationship with God through Jesus.

Remember He says "depart from me I never knew ye. " of course He has knowledge of us but no relationship of us being sent to lake of fire

Ultimately, God does look upon sin. To hold that God can not and must turn from looking upon sin is in violation of even the offer of salvation - for all have sinned.

It violates the story of Job in which the father of lies appears before God.

It violates the dealing with Adam, Eve, Cain, ... Abraham, Mosses, David, all prophets,... the apostles, even at the final judgment in which all sinners appear and are judged by God accordingly.

Certainly, it is a misuse of Habakkuk to suggest what was written is other than at best an inquiry, and much less a statement in which some doctrinal position is assumed - for there can be no supportable doctrine taken from the statement taken alone.

No single verse ever is the determination of doctrine or principle.

For the precepts of Scriptures are built upon layering.

Placing Habakkuk into proper context cannot support the view that God actually cannot look upon sin, when from Adam to the final judgment God most certainly DOES not only look upon sin, but uses sinners to His purpose.

Bottom line, God does look upon sin and sinners, uses the sinful and sinners.

God did not turn around, nor break fellowship with Himself at the crucifixion.

 

[Reformed]

God cannot abide sin (Psa. 5:4). Certainly, He sees it.

 

[HankD]

Where in the Scriptures does It state that God can not look upon sin?

It is a fallen argument, for throughout Scriptures God most certainly not only looks upon sin, but works through and in partnership with the sin-filled.

The context of “God cannot look upon sin” is NOT from God, but from heathen hearted folks trying to refute the prophetic message.

It was and is a false argument to suggest God had to turn away from Christ on the cross because of sin.

A closer rendering:
NAS Habakkuk 1:13 Thine eyes are too pure to approve evil, And Thou canst not look on wickedness with favor. Why dost Thou look with favor On those who deal treacherously? Why art Thou silent when the wicked swallow up Those more righteous than they?

KJV Habakkuk 1:13 Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity: wherefore lookest thou upon them that deal treacherously, and holdest thy tongue when the wicked devoureth the man that is more righteous than he?

In the KJV "behold" ra'ah (literally "to see" but with many extended stem nuances).

RA'AH Brown Driver and Briggs 09081-6b to look upon with favour, or pleasure

 

[37818]

God is omnipresent. God is infinitely good and holy. The knowledge of evil is a part of God's knowledge (Genesis 3:22). There has to be good in order for evil to exist. [There has to be truth in order for there to be lies.] [There has to be order in order for chaos to exist.] In God being omnipresent He is omniscient.

The sinless Christ on the cross bearing our sin, did not cease being God (Hebrews 1:3), while being forsaken by God the Father (Psalms 22:1).

 

[Dave G]

Where in the Scriptures does It state that God can not look upon sin?

" If I regard iniquity in my heart, the Lord will not hear [me]:" ( Psalms 66:8 )

" Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth." ( John 9:31 )

" Let mine enemy be as the wicked, and he that riseth up against me as the unrighteous.
8 For what [is] the hope of the hypocrite, though he hath gained, when God taketh away his soul?
9 Will God hear his cry when trouble cometh upon him?
10 Will he delight himself in the Almighty? will he always call upon God?" ( Job 27:9 )

" [Thou art] of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity: wherefore lookest thou upon them that deal treacherously, [and] holdest thy tongue when the wicked devoureth [the man that is] more righteous than he?" ( Habakkuk 1:13 )

The Lord does not look with favor on those who call on Him out of anything less than a pure heart...one which He alone has given them.
He does not regard iniquity in a man's heart of hearts.


He "looks upon" sin and sinners all the time, for He beholds their corruption and wickedness ( Psalms 14:2-3, Psalms 53:2-3, Romans 3:10-12 ), yet, He does not "hear" ( look upon, favorably ) their cries to Him.
He looks upon Christ's sheep as the apple of His eye ( Psalms 17 ) and those that He has loved ( Ephesians 2:4-10 ) and they have His favor and attention.

 

[HankD]

Habakkuk is asking the question

- LORD if you cannot look with approval upon sin why then don't you do anything when the wicked beat down the righteous? -

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Again, as stated above, some take Habakkuk’s statement as if God was saying it.

It is in the Bible, and it is a prophet of God saying it, so we must believe it, but interpret it properly. The verse cannot contradict or deny the omniscience of God. It does not mean that God hides His eyes so as not to know what is going on. In that case He would not be God.

So what does it mean? As in all such cases we have to compare Scripture with Scripture. I think some other verses may shed light.

Job 31:1. 'I have made a covenant with my eyes; why then should I look upon a young woman?' Job doesn't mean that he literally doesn't look at young women; otherwise he would keep bumping into them! He means that he doesn't look at them in a lustful way.

Matthew 7:23. 'And then I will declare to them, "I never knew you! Depart from Me you who practice lawlessness!'" This cannot mean that the Lord Jesus is totally unaware of lawless people; otherwise again, He would not be God. What it means is that He has no dealings or association with them.

Psalm 138:6. 'Though the LORD is on high, yet He regards the lowly; but the proud He knows from afar off.' God knows all about the proud, but has no dealings with them,

Proverbs 15:29. 'The LORD is far from the wicked, but He hears the prayer of the righteous.' Here we have the truth about Psalm 22:1 and Mark 15:34. The Lord Jesus, as the only truly righteous Person that ever was, enjoyed the closest possible prayer relationship with His Father (John 11:42). But when He was made sin for us, the very epitome of wickedness, the Father forsook Him and stood afar off. He suffered the fate of the wicked. The Lord Jesus had no conscious relationship with His Father (Psalm 22:2) and was left utterly bereft of fellowship with Him until propitiation was accomplished at the Ninth Hour and He cried, "It is finished!".

 

[agedman]

It is in the Bible, and it is a prophet of God saying it, so we must believe it, but interpret it properly. The verse cannot contradict or deny the omniscience of God. It does not mean that God hides His eyes so as not to know what is going on. In that case He would not be God.

So what does it mean? As in all such cases we have to compare Scripture with Scripture. I think some other verses may shed light.

Job 31:1. 'I have made a covenant with my eyes; why then should I look upon a young woman?' Job doesn't mean that he literally doesn't look at young women; otherwise he would keep bumping into them! He means that he doesn't look at them in a lustful way.

Matthew 7:23. 'And then I will declare to them, "I never knew you! Depart from Me you who practice lawlessness!'" This cannot mean that the Lord Jesus is totally unaware of lawless people; otherwise again, He would not be God. What it means is that He has no dealings or association with them.

Psalm 138:6. 'Though the LORD is on high, yet He regards the lowly; but the proud He knows from afar off.' God knows all about the proud, but has no dealings with them,

Proverbs 15:29. 'The LORD is far from the wicked, but He hears the prayer of the righteous.' Here we have the truth about Psalm 22:1 and Mark 15:34. The Lord Jesus, as the only truly righteous Person that ever was, enjoyed the closest possible prayer relationship with His Father (John 11:42). But when He was made sin for us, the very epitome of wickedness, the Father forsook Him and stood afar off. He suffered the fate of the wicked. The Lord Jesus had no conscious relationship with His Father (Psalm 22:2) and was left utterly bereft of fellowship with Him until propitiation was accomplished at the Ninth Hour and He cried, "It is finished!".

Ultimately, you then agree that using Habakkuk, in trying to show that God abandoned and could not look with favor upon His Son even at the crucifixion, is unfounded.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Ultimately, you then agree that using Habakkuk, in trying to show that God abandoned and could not look with favor upon His Son even at the crucifixion, is unfounded.

Not at all. I think it's entirely appropriate to do so. I'm not sure how you could suppose that from what I wrote, but no doubt you will tell me.

 

[agedman]

Not at all. I think it's entirely appropriate to do so. I'm not sure how you could suppose that from what I wrote, but no doubt you will tell me.

Did not the verse you posted show that God can and does interact with even the most vile sinner?

What right then does one have in selecting a single statement from Habakkuk and making some great doctrinal prroclaimation that God cannot look upon and even be pleased with the work in all aspects of the crucifixion?

Just as your own posting demonstrates the fallacy in thinking God abandoned His Son, is it not also true that, in like character, Christ will never abandon the believer, but will certainly withhold blessing and even protection that both edification and testimony of Him be magnified?

So, yes, thank you for posting supportive passages.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Did not the verse you posted show that God can and does interact with even the most vile sinner?

What right then does one have in selecting a single statement from Habakkuk and making some great doctrinal proclaimation that God cannot look upon and even be pleased with the work in all aspects of the crucifixion?

Just as your own posting demonstrates the fallacy in thinking God abandoned His Son, is it not also true that, in like character, Christ will never abandon the believer, but will certainly withhold blessing and even protection that both edification and testimony of Him be magnified?

So, yes, thank you for posting supportive passages.

I'm very happy with what I wrote.
As the saying goes, I can explain it to you but I can't understand it for you. Christ was made sin for us, and the Father, who cannot have communion with sin, forsook Him (i.e. withdrew from Him) during His time upon the cross. It's really not difficult.