NT Wright

[Greektim]

I think that what he is saying is you are doing exactly the same thing that those authors are doing - interpreting what the text means. But I agree with you in that when we read something, we weigh what they are saying against Scripture and teach Scripture. Our audience should do the same (in effect, we are to our audience exactly what those authors are to us as we deliver our interpretation of Scripture).

Bingo

random smiley
:tear:

 

[PreachTony]

I think that what he is saying is you are doing exactly the same thing that those authors are doing - interpreting what the text means. But I agree with you in that when we read something, we weigh what they are saying against Scripture and teach Scripture. Our audience should do the same (in effect, we are to our audience exactly what those authors are to us as we deliver our interpretation of Scripture).

That's pretty much what I figured, but I just wanted to make sure. I guess the point I failed to properly state is that I see some people who just go blindly along with whatever someone else tells them the Scripture means. It certainly cuts down on personal study time, I suppose.

I love to read what others say, but I'll go to the Scripture first, and see what the Lord shows me on it.

Greektim - I hope you didn't take offense to what I wrote. It was certainly not my intention.

 

[evangelist6589]

I think you will enjoy this. It will help give a good understanding of life after life after death (and yes I meant to put it like that).

Now that I'm finished w/ my ThM, I haven't been reading that much. And my library is quite small because I use my pastor's library (he's a PhD in theology from Marquette) and a seminary library. I wish I owned everything I read. But alas, I do not. In fact, I only own 2 NT Wright books (How God became King & Climax of the Covenant), the latter I have not even read yet b/c I left it in the States (grrrrrr). All the rest, I have checked it out from other sources. That's one reason why you go to a church w/ an educated pastor.

Actually it was $17 on half.com as I bought some study edition by error. I agree with you. The local Calvinist church has a library and a pastor that loves books and bible study. The Arminian church he does not love books not deep study but instead is more of a counselor and people person. Each has Thor gifts.. However he does know allot on eschatology and does read in this catageory..

 

[evangelist6589]

Dumb iphone is hard to type on without errors. One reason I miss blackberry less spelling errors. Anyways GreekTim I made a few of then in my reply forgive me. No I did not intent to mention Thor, and he is no theologian but no question I bet such a culture would be interested in books on Asgard.

 

[evangelist6589]

I'm in the ministry, and while I consider it a full time calling, I also have a job to pay the bills. I would have no problem reading a book of this magnitude (length, heaviness of content, etc.). I typically have 2 or 3 books going at one time. It's like watching several TV shows. Of course, I don't always have theological books in the rotation. I read for leisure/pleasure as well as spiritual growth.



I will admit that I place a lot more emphasis on what the Scripture says than on what someone else says the Scripture says.

As do I. One reason I seriously questioned a comment a Calvinist writer said in a book last night as he is going well beyond scripture. He is no NT Scholar and his book shows this. I have read other books by NT scholars whom are not Calvinist that make better arguments despite how much I agree with Reformed thought. The scripture is sufficient and what this Calvinist author said I would dock a star in a review.

You are a tent maker? Well then maybe what I do should qualify as being in the ministry. I teach SS on occasion and am a street evangelist monthly and run a web ministry.

 

[PreachTony]

You are a tent maker? Well then maybe what I do should qualify as being in the ministry. I teach SS on occasion and am a street evangelist monthly and run a web ministry.

I accepted the calling to the ministry about 12 years ago. I've been in the church all my life, but I guarantee you that our respective points of view on matters of ministry probably differ quite a bit. A fellow church-member the other day called me a "hardshell" Baptist.

I've never been to seminary, though I have no problem with people who do go. I'm not particularly fond of someone telling or teaching someone else how to preach, as I kind of hold to the notion that God will give us the words to say when the time comes, though having a strong knowledge base is not a bad idea. We just have to remember that "much study is a weariness to the flesh."

It's my belief that a man ought to work to provide for his family, however I do not see the work of a preacher as something that should be done for the financial reward. Perhaps my views on that are skewed by the TV evangelists who harp, hem, and haw for people to send them money. (I have a good joke about that...maybe I'll get to tell you that one someday.)

I'm not a "tent-maker," per se. I spent the last five years writing training and operator manuals for the US Army for communications equipment. I'm one of those guys who literally would have to kill you if I told you what all I actually knew. :smilewinkgrin:

I'm now working for a lab equipment company, designing operator and installer manuals for their equipment. Like I said, it pays the bills. Some people disagree with that point of view. My Mom and I came up with a saying many years ago, "Not my church; not my ways." Other people say "Not my circus, not my monkeys."

 

[Greektim]

That's pretty much what I figured, but I just wanted to make sure. I guess the point I failed to properly state is that I see some people who just go blindly along with whatever someone else tells them the Scripture means. It certainly cuts down on personal study time, I suppose.

I love to read what others say, but I'll go to the Scripture first, and see what the Lord shows me on it.

Greektim - I hope you didn't take offense to what I wrote. It was certainly not my intention.

Back at ya. I hope I wasn't abrasive. I apologize if I was.

 

[Greektim]

Actually it was $17 on half.com as I bought some study edition by error. I agree with you. The local Calvinist church has a library and a pastor that loves books and bible study. The Arminian church he does not love books not deep study but instead is more of a counselor and people person. Each has Thor gifts.. However he does know allot on eschatology and does read in this catageory..

That is funny... each has Thor gifts. I wish I wielded a hammer like Thor.

 

[evangelist6589]

That is funny... each has Thor gifts. I wish I wielded a hammer like Thor.

I like his personality as well as that of Captain America. I probably could not work well with the other characters due to personality differences. Definitely Natisha and Tony Stark. I'd imagine us bumping heads all the time.

 

[Greektim]

I like his personality as well as that of Captain America. I probably could not work well with the other characters due to personality differences. Definitely Natisha and Tony Stark. I'd imagine us bumping heads all the time.

That's also funny. I always thought my personality was like ironman. Must be why we get along so great!

 

[evangelist6589]

That's also funny. I always thought my personality was like ironman. Must be why we get along so great!

Well maybe me and him have some things in common with the panic attacks and he had it bad in Iron Man 3. I used to experience similar things. But I would guess it was the events in the Avengers that raised his anxiety and caused him issues. Panic attacks are not all mental and sometimes can only be control by medications due to chemical imbalances as in my case.

 

[Greektim]

Well maybe me and him have some things in common with the panic attacks and he had it bad in Iron Man 3. I used to experience similar things. But I would guess it was the events in the Avengers that raised his anxiety and caused him issues. Panic attacks are not all mental and sometimes can only be control by medications due to chemical imbalances as in my case.

I just realized... you have over 4,000 posts!!! And you haven't been here that long. Holy frijole!

Edit: you've been here longer than I realized.

 

[Yeshua1]

A FB friend of mine was singing his praises and pointed me to his The Resurrection of the Son of God book, however it looks deep and at 740 pages not sure I can handle such a book, especially since I am no longer in seminary. Greek Tim is in school so he does not understand my situation, but I have got wonder how many laymen read such books? Does any laymen (former graduate students, and not working in ministry FT) read these kinds of books. Are there any?

www.ligonier.org/ learn/ articles/ whats-wrong-wright-examining-new-perspective-paul/
reformedacademic.blogspot.com/ 2011/ 09/ what-are-we-to-do-with-nt-wright.html
Please read that information!

While we can be thankful for the work of NT Wright in establishing the valdidty of the resurrection of Christ, His attempt to redefine pauline Justification has been far less successful, as still hold to what the reformrs and others saw Paul as saying there regarding how a sinner is reconciled back to God by the death of christ!

 

[Greektim]

www.ligonier.org/ learn/ articles/ whats-wrong-wright-examining-new-perspective-paul/
reformedacademic.blogspot.com/ 2011/ 09/ what-are-we-to-do-with-nt-wright.html
Please read that information!

While we can be thankful for the work of NT Wright in establishing the valdidty of the resurrection of Christ, His attempt to redefine pauline Justification has been far less successful, as still hold to what the reformrs and others saw Paul as saying there regarding how a sinner is reconciled back to God by the death of christ!

You can't condense the brilliance of a man around one issue. NT Wright is more than just a voice on the NPP. He is a staunch defender of the historical Jesus according to the Gospel accounts as well as the bodily resurrection. That alone makes him alright in my book since he has a readership of liberal as well as non Christian academics. I refuse to throw the baby out with the bathwater just b/c you don't like his view of Paul's meaning of a Greek word (which is really what the NPP is all about).

 

[evangelist6589]

Does the book I am getting have any NPP? He is a NT scholar no question about it. I do not like the Rob Bell endorsement but I will strive to read the book despite it.

 

[Yeshua1]

Does the book I am getting have any NPP? He is a NT scholar no question about it. I do not like the Rob Bell endorsement but I will strive to read the book despite it.

Just remember that NT Wright does not seem to uphold a Inerrant view of the scriptures, and that the Church has mistaken pauline Justification past 2000 years, as the reformers just "missed it"

That right there would be a red flag to me...

 

[JonC]

Just remember that NT Wright does not seem to uphold a Inerrant view of the scriptures, and that the Church has mistaken pauline Justification past 2000 years, as the reformers just "missed it"

That right there would be a red flag to me...

His argument is not that the Church has mistaken Pauline Justification these past 2000 years. It is that the Reformers understood Pauline Justification through the lens of what they were going through and that we mistakenly take up a Reformation view of Justification rather than allowing Scripture to dictate that view.

 

[Greektim]

Just remember that NT Wright does not seem to uphold a Inerrant view of the scriptures, and that the Church has mistaken pauline Justification past 2000 years, as the reformers just "missed it"

That right there would be a red flag to me...

He is saying that he is helping the church to rediscover what it once knew to be true but has been lost b/c of the dominance of the RCC (dark ages) and the Reformers based their understanding of justification on that context.

As to his views of inerrancy, he may be more liberal than I am on that one, but I allow for mistakes as well... so long as I can clarify what I mean (but that is for another thread).

I don't advocate all of Wright wholesale, but he does nonetheless have the ear of the world and I for one want to join in and listen.

 

[Greektim]

Does the book I am getting have any NPP? He is a NT scholar no question about it. I do not like the Rob Bell endorsement but I will strive to read the book despite it.

Not that I recall. Even if it did, I can't see it affecting anything negatively.

 

[evangelist6589]

He is saying that he is helping the church to rediscover what it once knew to be true but has been lost b/c of the dominance of the RCC (dark ages) and the Reformers based their understanding of justification on that context.

As to his views of inerrancy, he may be more liberal than I am on that one, but I allow for mistakes as well... so long as I can clarify what I mean (but that is for another thread).

I don't advocate all of Wright wholesale, but he does nonetheless have the ear of the world and I for one want to join in and listen.

That would be understandable. Reformed theology got heavily influenced by Catholicism and moved away from everything except catholic eschatology. But you know what I am reading a 4 view on revelation book and will let them explain their views to me better.