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Numbers 31 ???

Jball

New Member
Sorry that this is my first post but after lurking a while....I've decided just to come out and ask. What is this about? Why would God want this? Surely there could have been another way. Genocide commanded by God??? I am sorry mods if this is innapropriate but I can not get past this area in my study.

Sincerely looking for answers, Jim :confused:
 

rjprince

Active Member
Yep. I agree. From the standpoint of our day and age, it does indeed seem extreme.

I am not a mod and cannot speak for them, but personally I do not think any sincere question about the character and nature of God as revealed in Scripture is anappropriate.

Just quickly though, its my bedtime, I will give a brief response.

The people in the land of Caanaan were very immoral and very wicked. God delayed their judgement for 400-430 years as their iniquity reached crisis levels. The command for the Jews to wipe them out with the sword was not all that different from the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah or the global flood in Noah's day.

God is a righteous God and sin deserves His wrath. The attribute of His love requires that sin be punished. If I love my family, anything that threatens them requires action on my part!

The wickedness of the Caanaanites should not have been allowed to remain in the land at all. Israel was not fully obedient and the sins of the nations around them brought them down. They should have fully obeyed the voice of the Lord.

Not sure if this is what you wanted or expected, but about the best I can do with the time I have for now.
 

rjprince

Active Member
Welcome to the club!!! My post says I am from Georgia, but mostly I live in the state of confusion! We have lots of tourists from time to time. Me, I am a long time resident, no, better a permanent native! Most of my family lives here too, they just won’t admit it!
 

LadyEagle

<b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
Maybe I can help.

A little background on the gods of the Midianites:

They worshipped Baal.

Snipped from the Internet:
The ceremonies included burning incense, and offering burnt sacrifices, occasionally consisting of human victims. (My note inserted: I read one time that archeological evidence suggests there was cannibalism involved, too. - end of my comment)

In the Bible Baal is also called Beelzebub, or Baalzebub, one of the fallen angels of Satan.
Baal was also a related god to Molech.

The sun god of the Canaanites (Ammonites?) in old Palestine and sometimes associated with the Sumerian Baal, although Moloch (or Molekh) was entirely malevolent. In the 8th-6th century BCE, firstborn children were sacrificed to him by the Israelites in the Valleye of Hinnom, south-east of Jerusalem (see also Gehenna).

Moloch was represented as a huge bronze statue with the head of a bull. The statue was hollow, and inside there burned a fire which colored the Moloch a glowing red. Children were placed on the hands of the statue. Through an ingenious system the hands were raised to the mouth (as if Moloch were eating) and the children fell into the fire where they were consumed by the flames. The people gathered before the Moloch were dancing on the sounds of flutes and tambourines to drown out the screams of the victims.
Along with these gods was the temple prostitution of various types.

That is the background.

Here is a summary from one source (the article is very lengthy, and I only skimmed it, but here are the highlights - the lengthy discussion is found at the link / source below:

Summary:


</font>
  • The Midianites were known to engage in kidnapping and international slave trading, as well as raiding and pillage of sedentary peoples/villages.</font>
  • The Moabites, who start the chain of events leading to Numbers 31, are under no danger or threat from Israel, but nonetheless begin unprovoked attempts to vanquish the unsuspecting Israelites</font>
  • After the Mesopotamian diviner/sorcerer/prophet Balaam fails to curse Israel, he nevertheless advises the Midianite leadership on how to overcome Israel—by a sexual deception of a massive scale.</font>
  • Moab transports women into the area en masse, and Midian moves into the territory east of Shittim, to begin this initiative. Some 6,000-12,000 married women aggressively offer sex to the Israelite men (most of whom are married), and after having sex/adultery, convince then to participate in further acts (involving both sex and disloyalty to the Lord).</font>
  • Israel ‘falls for it’, and likely makes a ‘covenant’ with a Canaanite fertility god of vegetation (Baal Peor), and are judged by God (at least 24,000 Israelites die of a plague, most of which are males)</font>
  • The Moabite and Midianite women retreat out of the area, having successfully used their sex as a weapon (with full knowledge, consent, support, and encouragement from their husbands, fathers, and civic leaders).</font>
  • For this atrocity, God orders Israel to attack this specific group of Midianites (not the Moabites) and eliminate them.</font>
  • The Israelite force of 12,000 men travel east/southeast to where the Midianite sub-group is camping, and engage in combat. (They are NOT instructed to hunt “all the Midianites in the world down and kill them”—just this group that did the treachery at Baal Peor.) They kill almost all of the males in this battle, but return to the Israelite camp with the herds and property of the Midianites, as well as with the women and (mostly girl) children.</font>
  • Moses is shocked to find out that they spared the very women who used the sex-weapon against them, and even brought these women back to the Israelite camp! He orders them to execute the women, who had been involved in the treachery (but only the Midianite women—the Moabite women are spared), and any remaining males among the children.</font>
  • The remaining young girls—with an average age of 5 years—were spared and distributed throughout the people, into families. They would eventually be assimilated into Israel families, but from this moment on, they would care for them, feed them, train them, etc. for family life in Palestine.</font>
  • The 32,000 young girls could be assimilated into Israel, largely because of the death of the 24,000 adult Israelites.</font>
  • The judgment for the atrocity at Baal Peor fell both on Israel and Midian—both would have lost around 24,000 adult members of the population, and the consequences on the Midianite children (especially the boys) would have been a direct result of the choices of their parents and leaders.</font>
&lt;snip&gt;

This action/atrocity by the Midianites is an intensely sordid and depressing tale, of greater scale than even that of Sodom and Gomorrah, and of greater anti-Hebrew malice and calculating treachery than even that of the Amalekites…The removal of this exact sub-culture (without impacting the Moabites or the rest of the Midianites—for good or ill), while mercifully sparing a very large number of innocent young girls, yet without sparing the guilty Israelites, seems neither cruel nor unfair nor unwarranted, given the horrendously dehumanizing character of this crime, and given the unavoidable consequences of conflict upon children in the ancient world…
http://www.christian-thinktank.com/midian.html

Please note, I did not read the entire web page, only skimmed it. Sorry for my long post.
 

Jball

New Member
Thank you for the replies, but why wouldn't the men who had committed adultery have been punished by God? I also had read some other articles, some from a Pastor friend and others from the web, they all said very similar things.

I don't know why or if the Isreali men were brought to justice? Wasn't this a very severe crime to them? Or was it just un-faithful women?

Jim
 

LadyEagle

<b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
Originally posted by Jball:
I don't know why or if the Isreali men were brought to justice? Wasn't this a very severe crime to them? Or was it just un-faithful women?

Jim
From my post: "Israel ‘falls for it’, and likely makes a ‘covenant’ with a Canaanite fertility god of vegetation (Baal Peor), and are judged by God (at least 24,000 Israelites die of a plague, most of which are males)"
 

LadyEagle

<b>Moderator</b> <img src =/israel.gif>
Genocide commanded by God???
To answer this question, genocide came directly from God with the Great Flood. In the end times, genocide will come directly from God again when He destroys the earth by fire and creates the New Heaven and New Earth.
 

HankD

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
LE is right.

The wrath of God is not a pretty picture but we are His creation to do with as He please if we do not respond to the shed blood of His only Begotten the Lord Jesus Christ.

But, ironically, He has made Christ to be the heavenly City of Refuge where we flee to escape the wrath to come of the blood avenger.

The Caananite peoples were locally given over completely to total depravity (as manifested by cannibalism, infanticide, incest and bestiality) as presumably were the pre-flood global population and our Heavenly Father destroyed them as well as He commanded the Hebrew Nation to destroy the Amorites and the Caananites the descendants of Anak and Amalek.

Genesis 15
16 But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites is not yet full.

Soon enough the days of Noah, Sodom and Gommorah which have recently and suddenly come upon us will fully ripen into the Wrath of the Lamb.

HankD
 
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