O.S.A.S. (Once. Saved. Always. Saved)

Yes. He will work to bring us back into the covenant, just as it is wonderful when a couple who divorce are reconciled and re-establish their marriage covenant.

Even if that thing was your spouse, who broke your marriage covenant and wanted a divorce? What would you do, lock her in the basement?

Christ purchased us with his blood, yes (Acts 20:28, 1 Cor 7:23, 1 Cor 6:20, etc.), but even those servants of his, who he bought, he will destroy if they have not been faithful (2 Pet 2:1, Matt 22:9-13, Matt 24:48-51, Matt 25:30, Luke 8:13, etc.)

 

natters said in part, "...but even those servants of his, who he bought, he will destroy if they have not been faithful (2 Pet 2:1, Matt 22:9-13, Matt 24:48-51, Matt 25:30, Luke 8:13, etc.)"

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Which is where me and my friends come along and remind you that those are not salvation verses but exclusion warnings to believers.

Now do you folks see how the "mess" can get cleared up simply by believing ALL Scripture for what it says?

Blood bought children of God can and will be "destroyed" for unfaithfulness but as Rev 20 states, they will not lose their salvation. "Destroyed" does not always mean "Lake of Fire".

As natters has pointed out; there are very clear warnings to believers. And it behooves us to pay attention to them, lest we let things slip, and find ourselves hearing at the JSOC, "Depart from Me".

In HIS service;
Jim

 

O.S.A.S. is a man-made doctrine that totally contradicts a multitude of passages in the Bible. Except for Baptists, Presbyterians, and post-1960 charismatics, most Christian denominations and groups have never accepted the O.S.A.S. doctrine. Every single so-called proof text for O.S.A.S. has been more than adequately refuted in other threads on this board, and I shall not bother to repeat those refutations unless I am specifically asked to do so.

 

I believe in Once Saved Always Saved because it was stated in the Word of God --

John 1:12-13
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
[13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will
of man, but of God.

If we were born in the family of God NNE can unborn us or it also means NNE can UNSAVE us, even the devil himself cannot do anything about it.

The verse said God gave us power to become 'sons of God'... It speaks of our sonship. It means eternal relationship and it continues. It never suggest ON/OFF relationship, but we might experienced IN/OUT fellowship or IN/OUT in the will of God but NEVER unborn.

It is the WILL OF GOD for us to be SAVED and if it so, so be it.

 

if you "Stop believing" then you didn't believe at the beginning.

Now1161 faith4102 is2076 the substance5287 of things hoped for,1679 the evidence1650 of things4229 not3756 seen.991

"EVIDENCE"

 

I don't think that makes sense. You can't stop doing something (believing, painting, driving, etc.) that you weren't doing in the first place.

Luke 8:13 says they believed "for a while". That means they believed, then stopped believing.

In some families, the son born to the parents will grow up and decide they don't want anything to do with the parent anymore and never sees them again. In other cases, the parents will disown the son for something he did. Biologically, the person is still a son, but the relationship has been broken.

 

As you said the person is still a son .

The son and Father relationship we have to God is much SURE and CANNOT be unrelated to each other. The case you've given is based on HUMAN perspective regarding family, but not DIVINE perspective according to the Word of God.

If we can EXPLAIN everything which God does in our lives and as HE 'PURPOSED' in everything, then WE are GOD like Him. But we are NOT. Most of the time, we CANNOT comprehend His will toward us and even HIS UNFAILING LOVE.

How could we doubt His power to save as the Bible says ...With men it is impossible, but not with God: for with God all things are possible.

 

Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved.


The above is Scripture. Here is how some of you are trying to INTERPRET it (WARNING THE BELOW IS NOT SCRIPTURE):

because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved; if you keep continuing to believe in your heart and you do not break too many of my commandments.

For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved; as long as you continue to keep believing.

If you will read the salvation scriptures, everlasting life is given through the grace of God at the moment of salvation. In other words, when you are given everlasting life, you HAVE everlasting life, PERIOD.

If you will read through the entire New Testament, you will realize that OSAS is the context of God's grace through Jesus Christ. Man cannot HOLD it himself, only Christ can.

 

Then what of all the scriptures I've referred to, which speak of remaining faithful, continuing to believe, standing firm? What especially of Luke 8:13, which says "they hear, receive the word with joy" and "for a while believe", yet later "fall away"?.

Why does John 3:16 ("...whosoever believeth in him...") have a continuous ongoing tense for the verb "believe" (present participle), instead of a simple one-time action (aorist or another tense)?

Why is it called the New Testament ("new covenant") if it is not really a covenant, but rather an unconditional guarantee?

I have read the entire New Testament through several times.

I agree man does not HOLD it himself. Man does not need to "do this" or "not do that" to keep the covenant in place. I do not HOLD our marriage covenant either - it simply remains intact as long as both parties are faithful to the conditions of the covenant. If both parties in a marriage are faithful, their covenant will remain intact for the duration set out in the establishment of the covenant ("till death do us part").

Similarly, in the New Covenant, the covenant will remain intact as long as both parties are faithful to the coveant - but with salvation, there is no "till death to us part", it is an eternal covenant - but a covenant nonetheless. Jesus will always remain faithful to the covenant (we don't have to worry about him breaking the covenant on us), and no-one else can break the covenant on our behalf (no one can snatch us out of his hands) but that does not mean that we cannot break and leave the covenant ourselves.

 

One thing that I haven't seen discussed here that I think is very valuable is the adoption into God's family. We are the adopted sons and daughters of God by His grace through faith.

So one might ask, so what? Well when the words were written regarding adoption they were written to a people that had an understanding of what that meant. So what did it mean? Roman adoption laws were such at the time that it was unable to be reveresed. Once you were adopted into a family that was it . . . it was done for good regardless of what happened by either party.

And so it is the same for us as we are adopted into the family of God. We didn't do anything to get into the family except accept God's gift of grace through faith. So there is nothing that we can do to be unadopted.

One other point regarding the sheep. Sheep go astray, but they are still sheep. They don't suddenly become cows because they go astray.

Just my .02 as I have studied and felt led by the Holy Spirit.

 

J.Jump. That was a good two cents.
More importantly than the fact that we are sheep, is the Shepherd the sheep has. This is the one thing that makes the OSAS the absolute truth:
The Good Shepherd is in charge of the sheep. Those who cannot grasp that fact, live in insecurity.

 

What do those that do not believe in eternity security do with Phil 1:6? Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ.

 

I also like this terminology better, "Once Saved Always SAFE"

 

The phrase "OSAS" is very misleading, and is actually a bad doctrine.
Why? It often gives assurance to those who are not truly saved.

The doctrine of Perseverance of the believer is a much more Biblical statement of what many of you want to say.

 

Paul is talking specifically about the ministry of the Philippians:

As Paul considers the beginnings of God's work among the Philippians (from the first day), it is natural that he also consider the day when that work will be complete - and to be confident in God's ability to complete that work

 

I disagree and the reason is that I am one of those people who thought I was saved at 9 years of age. I went forward and listened to the preacher pray and had no idea what I was doing there. (Although I grew up in church and knew Jesus was the Son of God.) From a few years later, I KNEW that I wasn't saved. OSAS NEVER had an effect on my life because if you are not saved and the Holy Spirit convicts you, there is NO DOUBT in your mind. Now, I was in denial. I would make excuses to myself saying that I grew up in church knowing Jesus, etc. But I knew, down deep inside, that I was NOT a child of God.

Once I did accept him as the leader of my life and repent; he will be there even if I get so mad I tell God I hate Him (which, heaven hopes I NEVER do.) God loved us enough to die on a cross for us. If he loved us that much, I think he could stand a little teenage rebellion against our parent (God).

OSAS is the truth, so therefore is not a dangerous doctrine to teach.

I feel sooo sorry for those people who never know for sure if they are going to make it to heaven or not. No matter what they say about knowing they don't break the "contract", but how do they really know they haven't had a feeling that was against the Lord in a short fit of madness. Does this require a new salvation? Sad.

Paul was clear that Christ would have to be sacrificed again. Why would he say this otherwise?

God gives us eternal life from the moment we accept him onward. No "if you live right" or don't "turn against me even if it is for two seconds because you are made I didn't heal you from cancer".

Natters, the verses you refer to are not salvation verses. Read the actual salvation verses and you see no "conditions" applied. We are ALL sinners.

Let me ask a question. How about a peron who becomes old and forgetful and forgets they were a Christian (if you don't believe this happens spend some time in a nursing home). Many of these don't accept him. They are clearly thinking, they just don't have long-term memory. Their short-term memory is good. Are they lost because they broke the covenant?

The big question to ask if there is a question is whether or not that person has ever been saved in the first place. Usually, you will find out they have not been.
I adopted three girls (my wife's kids who were abused by their father and the state took his rights away). So, I adopted them. My name is now on their birth certificates as the father.
The kids can do NOTHING, including claim that I am not their father. The LAW says I am their father. We are adopted by God when accepting His Son. My daughters had to give their permission by state-law (at their age--the age of accountability). They accepted, I became their dad even on their birth certificate.

Let me add another thing. We are taught that we are his sheep and he is the shephard. A good professional shephard will not loose his sheep even if they try to run off. Just because a sheep doesn't want to follow the shephard some day does not mean that a good shephard (which God is the perfect shephard) will catch us and put us right back in the flock. This is the reason "adoption" and "sheep" is used in these comparisons with our relationship with God.

Do you stop being the father of your children when they rebel as a teenager? Say they hate you? Tell you that you are not their father?

Peter denied Christ three times. This sure sounds like trying to break a covenant to me. In fact, if I am not mistaken I think he even swore he did not know Jesus.

Did he have to be "saved" again? Somehow, I doubt it very seriously.

 

Phillip: "OSAS is the truth, so therefore is not a dangerous doctrine to teach."

Amen, Brother Phillip -- Preach it!

 

OSAS has dangerous ramifications. Many people confer assurance on people who are not truly saved, and then on the basis of "OSAS" they believe they are saved and that they shoudl never doubt their salvation.

OSAS is NOT the Biblical doctrine of Perseverance.

I agree that true believers can never lose their salvation, but OSAS and Perseverance are different doctrines. OSAS is a misunderstanding and misuse of perseverance.

 

Peter did have to be converted, see Luke 22:32, but it wasn't because he denied Christ. Just like all of us, Peter had to be saved in a NT way.

 

Jesus is the Lamb of God from before the foundation of the world. Were the OT saints saved differently than the NT saints? If yes, how?

Seems Eph. 2:8-10 would apply to the OT all the way back to and including Adam.

Selah,

Bro. James