Obama: Ban Parents from Having Children Counseled Not to be ‘LGBTQ+’

[annsni]

Matt Moore will be posting a blog post on this soon (he's working on it) and I'm really interested to see what he says. If any of you don't know who he is, he's a young man who has lived in the gay community for years and still struggles with same sex attraction but became a Christian and has had a very good, healthy stance on the subject since. His blog is moorematt.com

My feeling is that this is just another area that the church will need to address - and will struggle with in the future. It will become "hate speech" and a crime to call sin "sin".

 

[targus]

Based on my expert knowledge, you can feel free to look it up yourself.:wavey:

Quit now and fewer people will know that you are simply talking through your hat.

 

[Zaac]

Quit now and fewer people will know that you are simply talking through your hat.

Poor thing. You honestly think that I care what you or other folks think?

Go do your homework.

 

[Revmitchell]

Sometimes I wonder if we start certain threads or post certain posts, just to get Zaac spun up....

I was posting things like this long before his mommy let him start using the computer.

 

[matt wade]

I was posting things like this long before his mommy let him start using the computer.

It's ironic that you attempt to categorize Zaac as childish by making a childish comment yourself.

 

[Scarlett O.]

I agree that "therapy" isn't the answer. The issue here is the slipperly slope. Will it become illegal for a pastor to counsel a youth on this subject?

No, it shouldn't. Normal therapy/counseling isn't what they are talking about.

The Obama administration is talking about conversion therapy for minors, not general therapy (pyschotherapy)/counseling.

I first learned about conversion therapy from a television program years ago. I don't like conversion therapy for homosexual minors. I never have. And I don't think it works in the long term for adults. It's way too intense - too Freudian. It USED to (in the olden days) involve institutionalization and even castration. It can now involve electro-shock therapy (I won't tell you where the shocks are given), "re-teaching" of self-gratification, aversion therapy (such as forcing a drug-induced nauseau/vomiting while showing them homo-erotic images), and far too many "physical" techniques that are questionable and do NOT address the spiritual, emotional, and mental states.

There's too much shaming as part of the treatment - convincing the person that he is "defective".

If I had a minor child who told me he was a homosexual, conversion therapy would not even be a blip on my radar screen of choices to lead him from this.

I believe that legally there is a difference between counseling and therapy. Therapy is intended to correct. Counseling is to advise and the person decides for himself.

So I don't think it would affect Christian Counseling.

This piqued my interest and since I am having insomnia, I just spent the last hour looking at medical sites about this. Actually, there is no "legal" difference in terms of one being possibly banned and the other not. The two words are used interchangeably with only small actual differences.

Counseling doesn't require an advanced degree and is for the short-term present issues. Counseling looks at the coping of an issue.

Therapy (pyschotherapy) is more for chronic issues and usually requires an advanced degree. Therapy looks at causality of a person's issues.

They both involve talking with a trained individual and learning self-help techniques to deal with problems.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Matt Moore will be posting a blog post on this soon (he's working on it) and I'm really interested to see what he says. If any of you don't know who he is, he's a young man who has lived in the gay community for years and still struggles with same sex attraction but became a Christian and has had a very good, healthy stance on the subject since. His blog is moorematt.com

My feeling is that this is just another area that the church will need to address - and will struggle with in the future. It will become "hate speech" and a crime to call sin "sin".

Thank you for this head's up. I am anxious to hear what this man has to say.

I believe that homosexuality is a great sin, but I also know that you can't just "pray the gay away".

Yes, God can and has miraculously delivered people from terrible sins. But the church (who is not God) has not taken a deep enough look into the strongholds of homosexuality to understand the psychological and mental issues nor does the church, in general, reach out to these people the way that Christ would have.

I pray all of the time for the homosexual students that are now adults that I once taught. I love them, they know that I love them, and they know that I do not condone their lifestyle.

And I know that my prayers are heard, AND I know that it's going to take more than just my little prayer for their healing.

I am anxious to hear what Mr. Moore has to say.

 

[Zaac]

Thank you for this head's up. I am anxious to hear what this man has to say.

I believe that homosexuality is a great sin, but I also know that you can't just "pray the gay away".

But breaking strongholds does involve an element of prayer. I admit, I would find it odd if people who profess to be followers of Jesus Christ would be proponents of dealing with sin using corrective therapy as opposed to the Holy Spirit.

Yes, God can and has miraculously delivered people from terrible sins. But the church (who is not God) has not taken a deep enough look into the strongholds of homosexuality to understand the psychological and mental issues nor does the church, in general, reach out to these people the way that Christ would have.

AMEN.

I pray all of the time for the homosexual students that are now adults that I once taught. I love them, they know that I love them, and they know that I do not condone their lifestyle.

And I know that my prayers are heard, AND I know that it's going to take more than just my little prayer for their healing.

:applause:

 

[targus]

But breaking strongholds does involve an element of prayer. I admit, I would find it odd if people who profess to be followers of Jesus Christ would be proponents of dealing with sin using corrective therapy as opposed to the Holy Spirit.

And who here has even suggested such a thing?

Please point to the specific words.

 

[Use of Time]

Thank you for this head's up. I am anxious to hear what this man has to say.

I believe that homosexuality is a great sin, but I also know that you can't just "pray the gay away".

Yes, God can and has miraculously delivered people from terrible sins. But the church (who is not God) has not taken a deep enough look into the strongholds of homosexuality to understand the psychological and mental issues nor does the church, in general, reach out to these people the way that Christ would have.

I pray all of the time for the homosexual students that are now adults that I once taught. I love them, they know that I love them, and they know that I do not condone their lifestyle.

And I know that my prayers are heard, AND I know that it's going to take more than just my little prayer for their healing.

I am anxious to hear what Mr. Moore has to say.

Hey Scarlett thanks for back to back post that really nail how I feel about this issue as well. Extremely well said. I would never allow one of my children to go through such a treatment. The conversion therapy looks to be dangerous for the mental maturity of a child in general and I would be curious to see the long term effects on the patient's psyche.

 

[Zaac]

And who here has even suggested such a thing?

Please point to the specific words.

How about you point to the specific words where I said someone here suggested a thing?

I guess you're my new "I'm gonna take him on and put him in his place" person of the month. :love2:

 

[Scarlett O.]

But breaking strongholds does involve an element of prayer. I admit, I would find it odd if people who profess to be followers of Jesus Christ would be proponents of dealing with sin using corrective therapy as opposed to the Holy Spirit.

Homosexuality IS a stronghold, yes. A stronghold is a "castle" inhabited by demonic influence. It doesn't come tumbling down easily.

They have to be bound by God.

That's why a simple prayer is not enough. When the disciples in Matthew 17 couldn't heal a boy after Jesus had empowered them to heal and deliver, they asked why?

Jesus said that this kind required prayer and fasting.

What kind of prayers?

• prayers of righteous people
• expectant, believing prayers
• persistent and unceasing prayers
• corporate prayers
• prayers from a pure heart (no unconfessed sin)
• prayers accompanied with gratitude
• prayers in Jesus' name

Our prayers are many times too flippant and are not accompanied by the above.

I also believe God heals through the medical profession. I believe in Christian and Bible-based psychotherapy and counseling. It may take a while to find a competent Christian in this field, but they are there.

 

[Zaac]

Homosexuality IS a stronghold, yes. A stronghold is a "castle" inhabited by demonic influence. It doesn't come tumbling down easily.

They have to be bound by God.

That's why a simple prayer is not enough. When the disciples in Matthew 17 couldn't heal a boy after Jesus had empowered them to heal and deliver, they asked why?

Jesus said that this kind required prayer and fasting.

What kind of prayers?

• prayers of righteous people
• expectant, believing prayers
• persistent and unceasing prayers
• corporate prayers
• prayers from a pure heart (no unconfessed sin)
• prayers accompanied with gratitude
• prayers in Jesus' name

Our prayers are many times too flippant and are not accompanied by the above.

Amen to all of this.

I also believe God heals through the medical profession.

Yes.

I believe in Christian and Bible-based psychotherapy and counseling. It may take a while to find a competent Christian in this field, but they are there.

Perhaps. I just don't see a competent Christian attempting to fix a sin problem with psychotherapy.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Perhaps. I just don't see a competent Christian attempting to fix a sin problem with psychotherapy.

Sin is very multi-layered sometimes. Sometimes a drunk is a drunk because he is bitter about a dysfunctional family he was raised in. Sometimes a woman is promiscuous because she never had that loving father or father figure to teach her her value as a human being.

Yes, we sin because we are sinners. But sometimes the devil will attack someone with a particular weakness in an area that predisposes them to epic failure. The devil, as Beth Moore said, “plays hardball”. She said, “(we ignorantly) hope that the devil would draw the line where the fight would be fair, but he has no such scruples. When we have a disaster, we can count on him being right there at our weakest and most vulnerable place to (kick us when we are down).”

Sometimes a hoarder who is living a life fueled from depression is doing so because his prescription meds have a side effect of depression or perhaps he/she was sexually abused as a child and the hoarding "covers it up" and he/she doesn't have to deal with it.

Yes, sinners need to repent and sin is a spiritual problem.

But sometimes, getting to the root of WHY we do that warped things that we do can be a tremendous help in battling sin.

Psychotherapy is just an intense counseling with a doctor who is trained to lead you into an insight about yourself. It might incorporate an anti-depressant or that may never come up. It might incorporate a lot of techniques.

A competent Christian who practices psychotherapy in my mind would be a God-send to someone who is suffering from sinful behavior and attitudes. They could competently address the sin from both a spiritual point of view and a medical and life experience point of view.

 

[annsni]

I posted the wrong link in my post referencing Matt Moore. It's moorematt.org not .com

 

[annsni]

Here is the article. I haven't read it yet but wanted to post the link.

Again, Matt Moore is a young man who has been in the gay community as a gay man for many years but he came to know Jesus and now has a very good Biblical view of homosexuality in today's culture.

http://www.moorematt.org/a-better-alternative-to-gay-conversion-therapy/

OK - reading:

From the article:

But it’s my belief that the the worst thing a same-sex attracted Christian can do is over focus on their same-sex attraction. And let’s just be real – when someone is partaking in therapeutic exercises in order to rid themselves of same-sex desires, they’re going to over focus on their same-sex desires. Transformation doesn’t come by overanalyzing our sin to death, but by beholding the beauty of Jesus and being conformed to his likeness. Putting a big fat magnifying glass over our sin week after week doesn’t bring freedom or transformation, but only prolonged enslavement and spiritual narcissism.

 

[Sapper Woody]

That man's words can be taken for any addiction. Very well put.

 

[annsni]

That man's words can be taken for any addiction. Very well put.

I just told him that on Facebook. An EXCELLENT article.

 

[Zaac]

Here is the article. I haven't read it yet but wanted to post the link.

Again, Matt Moore is a young man who has been in the gay community as a gay man for many years but he came to know Jesus and now has a very good Biblical view of homosexuality in today's culture.

http://www.moorematt.org/a-better-alternative-to-gay-conversion-therapy/

OK - reading:

From the article:

Very well said.