Originally posted by Gina L:
Scott, how many Americans were killed by Iraq in the two years prior to our attack on Iraq?
How many British were killed by Germany in the 6 years prior to the Nazi invasion of Poland? How many Americans were killed?
What I can tell you is that appeasement cost many more lives than acting with foresight and leadership.
Concerning national security, why are we safer attacking Iraq? So far, the threat to our security is higher than before we did so.
And... before we did so we had cities attacked, ships attacked, embassies attacked,.... We even had the bodies of American servicemen who trying to restore order in a muslim African nation rife with civil war mutilated for all the world to see. And yet our liberal reaction to Abu Ghraib was much louder than Mogadishu.
Since Iraq, we have been killing and consuming the resources of our enemies in what they consider their home turf... rather than our backyards.
Have we at least retained our freedom? No. I have less freedom now than I did before Iraq.
You think you have given up more freedom than would be required if we went purely defensive? The only ways to prevent terrorism are to destroy them before they get here, monitor society thoroughly to prevent infiltration, or some type of combination of the two.
I for one have no affinity for the idea that we should wait until Saddam found a way to realize his stated goal- to see more terrorism against the US... especially considering that he had already shown the capacity to develop and use WMD's. By all accounts, his sons were more evil than he is.
I would hope I would choose to die at the hands of a terrorist than kill one innocent Iraqi to save myself.
But would you be willing to defend that Iraqi, yourself, and many others from tyranny, oppression, and, yes, death by fighting that terrorist. That is what we as a nation are doing.
I have peace in knowing that justice will prevail in the end, in the hands of God.
Boy am I ever glad you weren't in charge instead of Churchill.
Now, if Iraq had attacked us, you might have a reason to make me rethink.
If we had waited for Iraq to attack... you very likely wouldn't have had the opportunity to "rethink". The 9/11 attacks threw our economy into a recession. Imagine what would happen if our 10 largest cities were hit with gas attacks or dirty nukes.
Oh but you profess: Saddam wouldn't... he couldn't. He would as demonstrated by attacks on his neighbors and own citizens. He could as demonstrated by his past development of chemical/biological weapons and by the nuclear plans hidden by his scientists.
If what Magnetic Poles stated concerning the sanctions and other unjust acts we levelled against Iraq prior to the war were untrue, I'd have cause to rethink.
Then you should certainly "rethink".
Have you actually looked at the photos of the dead and mangled?
Yes... and I have looked at pictures of Nazi concentration camp victims. I have seen pictures of those maimed and destroyed due to pre-WWII appeasement... the biggest difference other than clothing styles... is that the price of appeasement was about 600 times worse than even the worse estimates of what we have done in Iraq.
Bringing it home, appeasement cost 291,000 Americans their lives. We have maybe 200,000 men devoted to the war against Islamofascists... Some 16 million had to leave home to defeat the Axis.
War isn't an idea, it isn't a noble thing where the good and great go out and conquer the terrible and evil.
Yes. It is a noble thing for the righteous to make a stand against the unrighteous... to liberate the oppressed... and to secure the peace over the oppressors.
The majority of those who die are innocent.
The majority of the Kurds that died horrible deaths from Chemical weapons attacks ordered by Saddam were innocent men, women, and children. Undoubtedly, he was a man who would have shown no discretion whatsoever about US targets.
The reality of war is pain, torn flesh, death, and suffering.
The reality of appeasement is much more of those things.
Tyranny and oppression win when good men... do nothing.
Go view photos of what war really is, come back, and tell me that our Father has put his stamp of approval on it.
Go view statistics of the costs in lives and property in WWII because men sitting in a chair similar to GWB decided that they couldn't act to forestall Hitler's ambition. Then look at the pictures of towns leveled... and bodies ripped apart.
Or I'll even make it easier for you, watch the invasion scene from "Saving Private Ryan" with the realization that only 3000 of the 291,000 American deaths occurred during Operation Overlord.
Only the shortsighted don't/didn't recognize that Saddam was a threat to the US and world so long as he was in power and that his sons were even more of a threat. Even Bill Clinton recognized that the policy on Iraq for the US had to be regime change.
GWB did what had to be done for the sake of our children or grandchildren... regardless of the hindsight judgments about the WMD intelligence mistakes.
