One More Question on Obama

[righteousdude2]

Oops! You Did it Again!?!?!?!?!

None of us think he is a cute, harmless blessing parked on our lawn. No one is saying his views on abortion are not wrong. But that's not what your own OP asked. You asked if he should change his name. People have answered this question. So, what name would ease your mind, since you are questioning his faith even after he has already professed. Maybe "I.B. Christian"? Would that make you feel better? I doubt it...you were just looking for others to support your suspicions of this man. Well, congratulations, you found them. Really, this whole thread is totally absurd.

love,

Sopranette

I am truly sorry that you feel that way kiddo....it is a long way from the truth of what was in my heart. If you knew me, you'd know that I am a sincere person; the things I ask never have the intention to gain support for my ideas. I ask you to tell me what I gain if your guess is factual about my hidden agenda? What would I gain from having people side with me? How powerful is this BB? Do you think that my post and any support gained will have an effect on the election? And if the few that agreed with my post changed their vote, what have I gained on a national perspective?

Your comments were meant to cast dispersian on the reasons for this post, and in truth, your comments are unwarranted, and only meant to discredit my sincerity. You should be careful with the accusations you so casually toss around, because they are meant to stir up the opinions from others who are like minded with you. Once this is started, this post will go down hill, as people like you will zero in for the target you placed on my back, and the innocence of this original post will go into the gutter of name calling and unfair judgment cast my way, and the way of others who have similair views like mine. What I can't understand is why the folks who don't like a topic of apost by in and toss negative thoughts into the fray.

You, young lady, are the problem and not the solution, when it comes to people who disagree with you, or step on your spiritual toe. Still, I owe you a word of thanks for making your opinion known, even though it was NOT right on.:wavey:

Shalom :type:

 

[righteousdude2]

He it is [your answer]

I guess I'm beating a dead horse, but I've never gotten an answer from you man. What would you say to two preimment evangelical Christian theologians Drs. Ergun and Emir Caner who have not changed their names since they got saved?

Obama isn't an overtly Muslim name anymore than Peter isn't an overtly Christian name. Your line of logic is deeply flawed and spurious. I, for one, do not agree at all with it. What happens when an person of Oriental birth with a supposed Hindu orgin (but proclaims Christ in the presence of many witnesses) doesn't want to change their name? Would you ask Senator Li to recant and change?

Their names don't scream out "Islam." And they are not running for the office of President. You will think my response is absurd, and that is your right, just as my original OP and this response are my right.

 

[preachinjesus]

Their names don't scream out "Islam." And they are not running for the office of President. You will think my response is absurd, and that is your right, just as my original OP and this response are my right.

I'm not being harsh but honestly asking:

You honestly think that Dr. Emir Fethi Caner and Dr. Ergun Mehmet Caner don't "scream" Islam?

So I guess it would be okay for Senator Obama to teach at a seminary with his name but not be another kind of national leader?

Also, would you ask an Oriental candidate to change their name given the possible Hindu or Buddhist linkage?
And, can you please supply a list of acceptable names for us to better know what are, in your estimation, acceptable Christian names?

 

[preachinjesus]

nuts, double post...grrrrrrrrrrr...

 

[Sopranette]

"You, young lady, are the problem and not the solution,....."

Hmmm, where have I heard THAT before...anybody? Anybody at all?

Well, welcome to America, righteousdude. Home of the brave, land of the FREE.

love,

Sopranette

 

[JamieinNH]

Enough said. When a man claims to be a follower of Jesus, but fails to break off his or her ties to the life they left for Jesus...well, that is a red flag flapping in the wind.

What ties does he have to his past life other than his name? Let's go one further. What in his past life shows a life without Jesus. Mind you, as you answer this know that ALL of us fall short, so I don't want a standard answer, I would like specific examples.

When we come to Christ, we end our association with the world [sin].

On this, we can agree. We are to turn from our old selves, but in the Bible, that never included a name change did it?

Obama can keep his name, that is no problem with me.

Then you have answered your own original post haven't you? Why do you obsess over it then?

The problem is Obama claims to be a follower of Jesus, while he maintains direct ties [in name only] to Islams....

Now which is it.. he is ok with his name or he isn't? Which side of the fence are you on again?

There is no defending his claim to Christianity based on numerous reasons. His actions speak louder than his words. You can not follow two masters: Matthew 6:24 -"No one can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money. Matthew 6:23-25 (in Context) Matthew 6 (Whole Chapter)
Luke 16:13 - "No servant can serve two masters. Either he will hate the one and love the other, or he will be devoted to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve both God and Money."

So which politican running for President stands your test? One can defend his claim of being a Christian. He said it, and that's all there should be. We can't judge someone's heart only God can. To think otherwise is foolish.

Do you ever sin? Any at all? Are you sinless now that you have found Christ? Wouldn't you want people to give you the benefit of the doubt on your life? Why is it so hard to do the same for Obama?

Simply said Obama must give up his support of abortion...

Agreed...

and change his name to no longer reflect Islam. To not do this makes him look more, and more like a Trojan Horse,...

Again, which side of the fence are you on. You just said that his name didn't matter to you and now this? Which is it please?!? Also, you have failed to answer a previsous question. I will bold it for you so you won't miss it.

What was your name before you found Christ?

Obama is like most politicians. They say what is needed to be said in order to garner support and that all important "vote."

I can agree with you on this.. Look at my past posts and you will see I think all politicans are corrupt.

Nothing I said is racist.

As you put it.. actions speak louder than words..

The Word gives me the right to bring up these concerns, again, not based upon race, but upon his testimony and the glaring holes he has in that testimony.

You speak of his tesimony.. What is his testimony? When was he saved? When did he find Christ? How has Christ shaped his world?

The Word also tells us to not judge someone. To reach out tot he lost. If you feel he is a lost soul then you should be reaching out to him and not throwing stones.. You did read that story in the Bible right?

In accordance with God's Word, Obama's boat won't Float [there are simply too many holes in it to make it water ready].

Please give a list of these holes. Some of them I am sure we can agree on. Abortion being one.. Please name some more without pulling his name into it.

Jamie

 

[righteousdude2]

You Got Me!

I'm not being harsh but honestly asking:

You honestly think that Dr. Emir Fethi Caner and Dr. Ergun Mehmet Caner don't "scream" Islam?

So I guess it would be okay for Senator Obama to teach at a seminary with his name but not be another kind of national leader?

Also, would you ask an Oriental candidate to change their name given the possible Hindu or Buddhist linkage?
And, can you please supply a list of acceptable names for us to better know what are, in your estimation, acceptable Christian names?

Actually, you pose the kind of questions that can only lead us in a non-ending verbal circle. However, in my opinion, I would have the same concerns with them that I have with Obama. I would ask of them the same question: If Islam requires its converts to select a Islamic name following their conversion, would it be so wrong to ask the same of Muslims that convert to Christianity. As to the name they take, hypothetically, that would be up to the personal preference of those who it effects.

You, of course, are being absurd when you ask me to personally provide acceptable names for these folks.

Me thinks that questions like yours are only meant to stir up animosity toward me from those who think like you. I would ask you to stop going by way of the ludicrous, and if you don't agree with my post, find another that is to your liking.

Shalom my brother, Shalom!:type:

 

[Filmproducer]

I am truly sorry that you feel that way kiddo....it is a long way from the truth of what was in my heart. If you knew me, you'd know that I am a sincere person; the things I ask never have the intention to gain support for my ideas. I ask you to tell me what I gain if your guess is factual about my hidden agenda? What would I gain from having people side with me? How powerful is this BB? Do you think that my post and any support gained will have an effect on the election? And if the few that agreed with my post changed their vote, what have I gained on a national perspective?

Your comments were meant to cast dispersian on the reasons for this post, and in truth, your comments are unwarranted, and only meant to discredit my sincerity. You should be careful with the accusations you so casually toss around, because they are meant to stir up the opinions from others who are like minded with you. Once this is started, this post will go down hill, as people like you will zero in for the target you placed on my back, and the innocence of this original post will go into the gutter of name calling and unfair judgment cast my way, and the way of others who have similair views like mine. What I can't understand is why the folks who don't like a topic of apost by in and toss negative thoughts into the fray.

You, young lady, are the problem and not the solution, when it comes to people who disagree with you, or step on your spiritual toe. Still, I owe you a word of thanks for making your opinion known, even though it was NOT right on.

Shalom

Well hows that for calling the kettle black? It seems RD2 you are the only one who walks around with a stick where it doesn't belong whenever someone disagrees with your "questions". As ludicrous, ridiculous, and idotic your OP was I don't question your sincerity. Frankly that is sad in and of itself.

Oh, and how dare you address, Sopranette int he manner you have done? Talk about rude and unneccessary, not to mention holier than thou. What little opinion I did have for you is now gone, not that you care anyway. You sir are not the type of Christian to look up to and I certainly would NEVER EVER take any of your teaching seriously. Christians like you are what give the rest of us bad names, and you can take that to the bank.

This place just gets worse and worse....:BangHead: :BangHead: :tear: :tear:

 

[JamieinNH]

Your comments were meant to cast dispersian on the reasons for this post, and in truth, your comments are unwarranted, and only meant to discredit my sincerity.

Her comments were just and in line with this thread. Would I.B. Christian be a good name? :laugh:

Once this is started, this post will go down hill, as people like you will zero in for the target you placed on my back, and the innocence of this original post will go into the gutter of name calling and unfair judgment cast my way, and the way of others who have similair views like mine.

This thread has long since past the point of going down hill. You asked a question and when given many responses that were fair, knowledgable and honest you and others choose to continue down the path of his name.

You have ignored questions that were asked of you concerning your name and want us to believe that you ask only "innocent" questions.

What I can't understand is why the folks who don't like a topic of apost by in and toss negative thoughts into the fray.

You must know that when you post a question in a debate forum there will be people that will disagree with you. I know you would like it if people like us would just not post, but when I see something I disagree with and a question was asked, I will answer.

Jamie

 

[Filmproducer]

Their names don't scream out "Islam." And they are not running for the office of President. You will think my response is absurd, and that is your right, just as my original OP and this response are my right.

Are you really that dense? They are Arabic names NOT Muslim names! Sheeesh!!!!!!

 

[Brother Bob]

Of course it won't do any good since you know it all and are clearly a great scholar on this topic...

Moderate Muslims Speak out Against Extremism

Scholars of Islam speak out against terrorism; clarify postition of Islam

Moderate Muslims in Denmark are organising and speaking out against the extremist Imams

NH Muslims speak out after terrorist attacks

Last one, as I know you don't really want to hear it anyways....

Below are links to (at minimum) several hundred Muslim political and religious leaders speaking out against and condemning terrorism


Now, with everything, there are extremist. There were Christians that killed at one time.. Christian crusaders

Does that mean Christians are bad people? How about Fred Phelps? Ya think he helps our cause any? Should all nonChristians think we're all just alike because of what he says and respresents?

I am not standing up for the Muslim faith. Those people, unless they change and hear the Word and come to know Jesus will die. I don't want that, I want them saved. But even given that, I can't habor hate and ill will towards them. It ISN'T what God wants and you know it.

You're being very closed minded with this arguement. The orginal question in this thread has been answered several times, and you have taken it to the extreme. You need to back up and think about what you have posted in this entire thread. It doesn't look good to some of us Christians, and I am sure it don't look good to some of the non Christians that visit this board.

Step back and take a breather...

Jamie

Listen at you, accusing me of taking it to the extreme when you and others brought into the discussion Muslim beliefs and the masses. I responded that the masses have not stepped forward and condemned such actions taken by muslims of cutting our soldiers heads off. You still support them and don't know no more about them than I do.
Obama is running for my President. I do not live in Iraq, Iran or Saudia Arabia, I live in the freedom of the good ole USA, and I will question anyone who wants to be President, whether you like it or not. The articles written by him and others shows that he has had ties to Muslims. His father was a Muslim, His step father was a Muslim, He went to a Muslim school, his stepfather and maybe his father, not sure were given Muslim funerals, and you think I do not have a right to question his beliefs today and he is running for the President of the US. You speak as a foolish man, I have all the right as a free citizen of this country and to me, I could care less how you feel about me questioning Obama's beliefs. I guess you think if you question everyone who questions him, they will just go away. That is completely foolish on your part.

BBob,:BangHead:

 

[JamieinNH]

Actually, you pose the kind of questions that can only lead us in a non-ending verbal circle.

ie I don't want to answer as it might make my question about Obama seem silly...

I would ask of them the same question:

Really? Why did he have to ask you this question at least twice before you would answer it? Why would their names matter since you have posted in this thread "Obama can keep his name, that is no problem with me." Again, which is it? Can they keep their name or not?

If Islam requires its converts to select a Islamic name following their conversion, would it be so wrong to ask the same of Muslims that convert to Christianity.

Where does it say in the Bible (our rule book) that one has to change their name? Chapter and Verse please.

You, of course, are being absurd when you ask me to personally provide acceptable names for these folks.

No, he is showing you that a name is just a name.

Me thinks that questions like yours are only meant to stir up animosity toward me from those who think like you. I would ask you to stop going by way of the ludicrous, and if you don't agree with my post, find another that is to your liking.

Me thinks you shouldn't ask questions if you don't want answers. He has been nothing but nice and honest with you asking questions that should help you reflect on your wanting Obama to change his name.

Questions asked to help one think through what they are asking aren't bad... Unless you don't like the answers you are telling yourself.. People are not going to go away.. Ask a question. expect an answer.

Jamie

 

[Filmproducer]

Listen at you, accusing me of taking it to the extreme when you and others brought into the discussion Muslim beliefs and the masses. I responded that the masses have not stepped forward and condemned such actions taken by muslims of cutting our soldiers heads off. You still support them and don't know no more about them than I do.
Obama is running for my President. I do not live in Iraq, Iran or Saudia Arabia, I live in the freedom of the good ole USA, and I will question anyone who wants to be President, whether you like it or not. The articles written by him and others shows that he has had ties to Muslims. His father was a Muslim, His step father was a Muslim, He went to a Muslim school, his stepfather and maybe his father, not sure were given Muslim funerals, and you think I do not have a right to question his beliefs today and he is running for the President of the US. You speak as a foolish man, I have all the right as a free citizen of this country and to me, I could care less how you feel about me questioning Obama's beliefs. I guess you think if you question everyone who questions him, they will just go away. That is completely foolish on your part.

BBob,:BangHead:

Well as you seem to lay the "sins" of the father, or even the grandfather since the father was an atheist, on Obama. I will also hold you accountable for the sins of your father and grandfather, and pretty much all your kin. In my estimation that makes you even worse than Obama as you are a pastor, not a politician. Now who is being foolish?

 

[Brother Bob]

Well as you seem to lay the "sins" of the father, or even the grandfather since the father was an atheist, on Obama. I will also hold you accountable for the sins of your father and grandfather, and pretty much all your kin. In my estimation that makes you even worse than Obama as you are a pastor, not a politician. Now who is being foolish?

That is where you are wrong. I lay the sins of no one on Obama. I simply question if he still has ties to that religion or not. It is a legitiment question of anyone who is running for President of the US. It is my right and I am using it.

Where did I post and accuse Obama of the sins of his father. The father was an atheist when he died, he had been a muslim. You are making accusations now that are untrue. So in your estimation I am worse than who and why, because I question if Obama still has ties to Muslims. I am glad to know your opinion, now I know where you are coming from. Get your facts right please.

Thank you,

BBob,

 

[JamieinNH]

Listen at you, accusing me of taking it to the extreme when you and others brought into the discussion Muslim beliefs and the masses.

You stated this: " Please give me examples where all them good ones condemned such actions. Please"

Then such examples were given but you chose to ignore anything posted.

I responded that the masses have not stepped forward and condemned such actions taken by muslims of cutting our soldiers heads off.

Of course you're right.. Not! There have been a number of muslims that have stepped up against all this violence.

You still support them and don't know no more about them than I do.

Who said anything about supporting them? You're grasping at straws now..

I live in the freedom of the good ole USA, and I will question anyone who wants to be President, whether you like it or not.

We don't like or dislike your opinion, but you shouldn't think others are wrong just because they don't follow YOUR path.

The articles written by him and others shows that he has had ties to Muslims.

Examples please....

His father was a Muslim, His step father was a Muslim, He went to a Muslim school, his stepfather and maybe his father, not sure were given Muslim funerals, and you think I do not have a right to question his beliefs today and he is running for the President of the US.

Have you always been a Christian? How about your dad? Has he always been a Christian? People change. His father was NOT a muslim when Obama was born. State he was and it's a lie.

Don't we give our nonChristian children a Christian funeral? How is this different with his Father or GrandFather?

Also, are you defined by your parents? If your father was a murderer would you be one by assoication?

You speak as a foolish man, I have all the right as a free citizen of this country and to me, I could care less how you feel about me questioning Obama's beliefs.

Now I am foolish.. hum.. please be sure to get this out of your system before bed. It's not good to go to bed angry.

You have every right to say whatever you want.. that doesn't 1, make it true and 2, make everyone have to believe in what you believe in.

I guess you think if you question everyone who questions him, they will just go away.

Nobody has asked you to go anywhere, but if you think people will just sit here and let you guys trash someone for no reason, then you're wrong. Honesty and the Truth will prevail..

That is completely foolish on your part.

BBob,:BangHead:

Again, please get this out of your system before bed. If you pray to the Lord before bed, go to him with a open and soft heart. Anger is such a bad thing.

Jamie

 

[Filmproducer]

That is where you are wrong. I lay the sins of no one on Obama. I simply question if he still has ties to that religion or not. It is a legitiment question of anyone who is running for President of the US. It is my right and I am using it.

Where did I post and accuse Obama of the sins of his father. The father was an atheist when he died, he had been a muslim. You are making accusations now that are untrue. So in your estimation I am worse than who and why, because I question if Obama still has ties to Muslims. I am glad to know your opinion, now I know where you are coming from. Get your facts right please.

Thank you,

BBob,

No, get your facts straight.... The man claims to be a Christian and has been a member of a Christian church for well over a decade. Prior to that he was NOT a Muslim. So, tell me why again you are questioning his sincerity? Do you really think he should honestly change his name to satisfy yours and others ludicrous fears? It is a name people!

 

[Brother Bob]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
Listen at you, accusing me of taking it to the extreme when you and others brought into the discussion Muslim beliefs and the masses.


You stated this: " Please give me examples where all them good ones condemned such actions. Please"

You gave some Islamic answers to the question not the US news.

Then such examples were given but you chose to ignore anything posted.

Again, you can find anything on the net, It plainly said Islamic at the top of the newletter. What you expect them to say. Shame you can't tell the 17 year girl they stoned to death how good they are.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
I responded that the masses have not stepped forward and condemned such actions taken by muslims of cutting our soldiers heads off.


Of course you're right.. Not! There have been a number of muslims that have stepped up against all this violence.

Well, give some of them, instead of an Islamic paper.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
You still support them and don't know no more about them than I do.


Who said anything about supporting them? You're grasping at straws now..

You are attempting to put me down for wanting to know more about Obama, and building them up to being "good" people. Oh by the way, they hate Christians.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
I live in the freedom of the good ole USA, and I will question anyone who wants to be President, whether you like it or not.


We don't like or dislike your opinion, but you shouldn't think others are wrong just because they don't follow YOUR path.

Show me where I said Obama was right or wrong. I only asked if he might still have ties to the Muslims.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
The articles written by him and others shows that he has had ties to Muslims.


Examples please....

His articles he wrote are more honest and up front than you all have been.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
His father was a Muslim, His step father was a Muslim, He went to a Muslim school, his stepfather and maybe his father, not sure were given Muslim funerals, and you think I do not have a right to question his beliefs today and he is running for the President of the US.


Have you always been a Christian? How about your dad? Has he always been a Christian? People change. His father was NOT a muslim when Obama was born. State he was and it's a lie.

Goes to show you don't know much about the Muslim religion, again its a shame you can't ask the 17 year old girl they stoned to death.

Don't we give our nonChristian children a Christian funeral? How is this different with his Father or GrandFather?

If they were Christians and you say the father had become an atheist, why not an atheist funeral, why a Muslim. That should tell you something.

Also, are you defined by your parents? If your father was a murderer would you be one by assoication?

Again, show you don't know much about the Muslim faith.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
You speak as a foolish man, I have all the right as a free citizen of this country and to me, I could care less how you feel about me questioning Obama's beliefs.


Now I am foolish.. hum.. please be sure to get this out of your system before bed. It's not good to go to bed angry.

Angry, I just do not care for your jumping on me for asking if Obama might still have Muslim ties, which is a legitment question.

You have every right to say whatever you want.. that doesn't 1, make it true and 2, make everyone have to believe in what you believe in.

Look how far you are from what I ask in the beginning. If Obama might still have ties to the Muslims. If he does have Muslim beliefs, I do not want him President, which is my right and none of your business or anyone else's.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
I guess you think if you question everyone who questions him, they will just go away.


Nobody has asked you to go anywhere, but if you think people will just sit here and let you guys trash someone for no reason, then you're wrong. Honesty and the Truth will prevail..

Again, you made it trash. I only asked if he might still have ties to the Muslim faith.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Bob
That is completely foolish on your part.

BBob,:BangHead:


Again, please get this out of your system before bed. If you pray to the Lord before bed, go to him with a open and soft heart. Anger is such a bad thing.

Again, if you can't give a good answer, attack the messenger.
A
Jamie

I hope this answers all your questions.

BBob

 

[Brother Bob]

No, get your facts straight.... The man claims to be a Christian and has been a member of a Christian church for well over a decade. Prior to that he was NOT a Muslim. So, tell me why again you are questioning his sincerity? Do you really think he should honestly change his name to satisfy yours and others ludicrous fears? It is a name people!

I never said anything about him changing his name, so get your facts straight. You are falsely accusing me. I never met a politician yet who does not lie. Also, the Muslims have made statements they will destroy us from within. With people like you and the others watching the hen house, the fox will kill them all.

Again, please do not falsely accuse me. I would like very much for you to show the post where I said anything about him changing his name. Please

BBob,

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Obama can keep his name, that is no problem with me.

or

Simply said Obama must give up his support of abortion and change his name to no longer reflect Islam.

So which is it? And what name would you prefer? Amos or Andy perhaps?

 

[Magnetic Poles]

"You, young lady, are the problem and not the solution,....."

Hmmm, where have I heard THAT before...anybody? Anybody at all?

Well, welcome to America, righteousdude. Home of the brave, land of the FREE.

love,

Sopranette

What a demeaning tone to be spoken to with, even in typed words. RD2 should be ashamed.