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Our Scriptural Confidence

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
What seems to be have been missed in the previous comments is the truth that because God's word is true those that trust in Him will be kept. Even though we will go through trials we can hold to the promises of God.

So verse 7 can be read as referring to either or both God's word and those that believe.
 

Anthony Pritchard

Well-Known Member
The danger here is real. It is a matter of hermeneutics. If we can go back into a previous sentence, take an older subject, and assign it to a new sentence that already has its own subject, then the rules of interpretation collapse. Language becomes fluid, antecedents become optional, and rightly dividing the Word of truth becomes impossible.

Psalm 12:6 establishes the subject clearly: “The words of the LORD are pure words.” The subject is the words. Verse 7 continues the sentence and continues the subject unless the text itself changes it. There is no grammatical signal that the subject has shifted. The pronoun “them” must refer to the nearest stated antecedent, which is the words. Bringing people from a past sentence into a new sentence that already has its own subject is not interpretation, it is reassignment.

If subjects can be reassigned at will, then any verse can be made to say anything. That is why subject continuity matters. The text itself determines the meaning, not our preference for importing nouns from earlier sentences. The subject of the verse is the words, period.
 

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
The danger here is real. It is a matter of hermeneutics. If we can go back into a previous sentence, take an older subject, and assign it to a new sentence that already has its own subject, then the rules of interpretation collapse. Language becomes fluid, antecedents become optional, and rightly dividing the Word of truth becomes impossible.

Psalm 12:6 establishes the subject clearly: “The words of the LORD are pure words.” The subject is the words. Verse 7 continues the sentence and continues the subject unless the text itself changes it. There is no grammatical signal that the subject has shifted. The pronoun “them” must refer to the nearest stated antecedent, which is the words. Bringing people from a past sentence into a new sentence that already has its own subject is not interpretation, it is reassignment.

If subjects can be reassigned at will, then any verse can be made to say anything. That is why subject continuity matters. The text itself determines the meaning, not our preference for importing nouns from earlier sentences. The subject of the verse is the words, period.

When you look at the verses in context you will see, as I said before, that the words "will keep them" can refer to God's word [vs 6] or to those that keep His word. [vs 5]


6 Because of the plunder of the poor, because of the cry of the needy, Now I will rise, the Lord shall say; I will grant them salvation, He shall speak concerning them.

ומִשֹּׁ֥ד עֲנִיִּים֘ מֵֽאֶנְקַ֪ת אֶבְי֫וֹנִ֥ים עַתָּ֣ה אָ֖קוּם יֹאמַ֣ר יְהֹוָ֑ה אָשִׁ֥ית בְּ֜יֵ֗שַׁע יָפִ֥יחַ לֽוֹ:

7 The sayings of the Lord are pure sayings, like silver refined, exposed to the earth, clarified sevenfold.

זאִֽמֲר֣וֹת יְהֹוָה֘ אֲמָר֪וֹת טְהֹ֫ר֥וֹת כֶּ֣סֶף צָ֖רוּף בַּֽעֲלִ֣יל לָאָ֑רֶץ מְ֜זֻקָּ֗ק שִׁבְעָתָֽיִם:

8 You, O Lord, shall guard them; You shall guard him from this generation forever.

חאַתָּ֣ה יְהֹוָ֣ה תִּשְׁמְרֵ֑ם תִּצְּרֶ֓נּוּ | מִן־הַדּ֖וֹר ז֣וּ לְעוֹלָֽם:


 

Anthony Pritchard

Well-Known Member
When you look at the verses in context you will see, as I said before, that the words "will keep them" can refer to God's word [vs 6] or to those that keep His word. [vs 5]


6 Because of the plunder of the poor, because of the cry of the needy, Now I will rise, the Lord shall say; I will grant them salvation, He shall speak concerning them.

ומִשֹּׁ֥ד עֲנִיִּים֘ מֵֽאֶנְקַ֪ת אֶבְי֫וֹנִ֥ים עַתָּ֣ה אָ֖קוּם יֹאמַ֣ר יְהֹוָ֑ה אָשִׁ֥ית בְּ֜יֵ֗שַׁע יָפִ֥יחַ לֽוֹ:

7 The sayings of the Lord are pure sayings, like silver refined, exposed to the earth, clarified sevenfold.

זאִֽמֲר֣וֹת יְהֹוָה֘ אֲמָר֪וֹת טְהֹ֫ר֥וֹת כֶּ֣סֶף צָ֖רוּף בַּֽעֲלִ֣יל לָאָ֑רֶץ מְ֜זֻקָּ֗ק שִׁבְעָתָֽיִם:

8 You, O Lord, shall guard them; You shall guard him from this generation forever.

חאַתָּ֣ה יְהֹוָ֣ה תִּשְׁמְרֵ֑ם תִּצְּרֶ֓נּוּ | מִן־הַדּ֖וֹר ז֣וּ לְעוֹלָֽם:


The grammatical issue remains unchanged. The danger here is not about choosing one interpretation over another; it is about maintaining hermeneutical integrity. If we can go back into a previous sentence, take an older subject, and assign it to a new sentence that already has its own subject, then the rules of interpretation collapse. Language becomes fluid, antecedents become optional, and rightly dividing the Word of truth becomes impossible.

Psalm 12:6 establishes the subject explicitly: “The words of the LORD are pure words.” The subject is the words. Verse 7 continues the sentence and continues the subject unless the text itself changes it. There is no grammatical signal that the subject has shifted. The pronoun “them” must refer to the nearest stated antecedent, which is the words. Bringing people from a past sentence into a new sentence that already has its own subject is not interpretation, it is reassignment.

Appealing to the broader context does not override the grammar of the sentence. Context informs meaning, but it does not replace the rules of antecedents. If subjects can be reassigned at will, then any verse can be made to say anything. That is why subject continuity matters. The text itself determines the meaning, not our preference for importing nouns from earlier sentences. The subject of the verse is the words, period.
 

Anthony Pritchard

Well-Known Member
If we can alter the rules of language to suit our preferences, exegesis truly becomes eisegesis, and truth becomes the victim, no longer able to be determined.

When Scripture becomes malleable, truth itself becomes undefinable, because the text no longer governs meaning, the interpreter does.

“Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.” 2 Peter 1:20
 

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
[OK, I try again, without claiming anything about anything being wrong.]

Our Scriptural Confidence

The confidence of God’s people in the purity and accuracy of Holy Scripture does not begin with manuscript families, textual theories, or academic reconstruction. It begins with God Himself. Before any scribe ever copied a line, before any manuscript tradition ever formed, the Lord declared the nature of His words and the certainty of their preservation.

Psalm 12:6 says, “The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.” Purity is the starting point. God’s words are not developing, evolving, or improving. They are pure. They are complete. They are perfect. The next verse establishes the doctrine of preservation. Psalm 12:7 says, “Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.” Preservation is not the work of scribes. Preservation is not the work of scholars. Preservation is not the work of textual critics. Preservation is the work of God.

This is the foundation. Any text tradition that does not bear the marks of purity, stability, and preservation cannot be the text God kept. Any text tradition that exhibits instability, contradiction, omission, or editorial interference cannot be the text God preserved.

[chopped]

Our confidence in the accuracy of the Bible rests first on Psalm 12:6 and Psalm 12:7. The text families come after that. They are not the foundation. They are the evidence. The preserved text will be pure, stable, consistent, and received by the believing churches.

© A.K. Pritchard 1990, 2026 – Free to use with proper attribution.
I believe often the issue with men trying to decide a translation is good or bad (is "God's Word" verses is not "God's Word") is a lack of understanding about God's Word. They get caught up in different translation choices that do not suit what they are looking for, but they are examining Scripture as a reference book rather than a narrative.

Most translations are God's Word (actually, all legitimate translations are God's Word, but many we call "translations" are more like expository writings on the biblical text).

In other words, God preserves His Word, and His Word transcends translation. When we read our bible, whether the NIV, NASB, KJV, NKJV, NIV, HCSB, NET, we are reading God's Word.

Words are symbols. Someyimes men get caught up in the symbols and miss the ideas that those symbols represent.

Scripture even testifies to this (many times OT passages quoted in the NT are presented for what the words represent rather than quoting the exact words verbatim).
 

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
The grammatical issue remains unchanged. The danger here is not about choosing one interpretation over another; it is about maintaining hermeneutical integrity. If we can go back into a previous sentence, take an older subject, and assign it to a new sentence that already has its own subject, then the rules of interpretation collapse. Language becomes fluid, antecedents become optional, and rightly dividing the Word of truth becomes impossible.

Psalm 12:6 establishes the subject explicitly: “The words of the LORD are pure words.” The subject is the words. Verse 7 continues the sentence and continues the subject unless the text itself changes it. There is no grammatical signal that the subject has shifted. The pronoun “them” must refer to the nearest stated antecedent, which is the words. Bringing people from a past sentence into a new sentence that already has its own subject is not interpretation, it is reassignment.

Appealing to the broader context does not override the grammar of the sentence. Context informs meaning, but it does not replace the rules of antecedents. If subjects can be reassigned at will, then any verse can be made to say anything. That is why subject continuity matters. The text itself determines the meaning, not our preference for importing nouns from earlier sentences. The subject of the verse is the words, period.

That God has preserved His word can be established by many verses in scripture. And I have even agreed with what you have said, God has preserved His word, but that is not what Psalm 12 is speaking to. What we see is that those knowing that God's word is trustworthy can cry out to God in their need. Does that mean that we will never face trials, no, but we can trust in Him to keep us through them.

The third person plural pronominal suffix on the verb is masculine, referring back to the "oppressed" and "needy" in Psa_12:5 (both of those nouns are plural in form), suggesting that the verb means "protect" here. The suffix does not refer to אִמֲרוֹת (’imarot, "words") in Psa_12:6, because that term is feminine gender. NET

Psalms 12:7

Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.
Thou shalt keep them, O Lord - namely, thy people in safety from their persecutors. From this generation. The corruption was so universal (Psa_12:1) that the ungodly represent the spirit of the age "from" which the Lord would "preserve" His own chosen few. Compare Gal_1:4; 1Jn_5:19. JFB
 

Anthony Pritchard

Well-Known Member
That God has preserved His word can be established by many verses in scripture. And I have even agreed with what you have said, God has preserved His word, but that is not what Psalm 12 is speaking to. What we see is that those knowing that God's word is trustworthy can cry out to God in their need. Does that mean that we will never face trials, no, but we can trust in Him to keep us through them.

The third person plural pronominal suffix on the verb is masculine, referring back to the "oppressed" and "needy" in Psa_12:5 (both of those nouns are plural in form), suggesting that the verb means "protect" here. The suffix does not refer to אִמֲרוֹת (’imarot, "words") in Psa_12:6, because that term is feminine gender. NET

Psalms 12:7

Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever.
Thou shalt keep them, O Lord - namely, thy people in safety from their persecutors. From this generation. The corruption was so universal (Psa_12:1) that the ungodly represent the spirit of the age "from" which the Lord would "preserve" His own chosen few. Compare Gal_1:4; 1Jn_5:19. JFB
You are not engaging the grammatical argument. You are appealing to commentary instead of addressing subject continuity, antecedents, or the sentence structure of Psalm 12:6–7. The issue is not whether preservation is taught elsewhere. The issue is what this passage says.

Your grammatical claim is also incorrect. The NET note assumes that a Hebrew pronominal suffix must always match the grammatical gender of its antecedent. That is a category error. Hebrew does not operate that way. Hebrew pronominal suffixes frequently take masculine forms when the antecedent is a collective or abstract noun, even when the noun itself is grammatically feminine.

This is normal Hebrew usage. Examples include:

  • Torah (feminine) taking masculine pronominal reference when treated collectively.
  • Mitzvot (feminine plural) taking masculine pronominal reference in multiple passages.
  • Edut (feminine) taking masculine pronominal reference in Psalm 119.
Hebrew does this constantly. It is not unusual. It is standard.

The NET note is not inspired. It is not authoritative. And it is not consistent with the way Hebrew actually uses pronominal suffixes. It cannot override the subject already established in verse 6, nor can it justify importing a different subject from an earlier sentence.

The grammatical structure of Psalm 12:6–7 remains unchanged. The subject is the words.
 
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