Repairman Jack
New Member
Maybe you're right.
I never thought much about it.
Thanks for the resource. I'll check it out.
I never thought much about it.
Thanks for the resource. I'll check it out.
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Brother Tom has served on several pastoral search committees, and that figure seems to be pretty solid from history. I have never voted against a pastoral candidate before, but any more than one or two votes against means something is up.Tom Butler said:As a general rule, if the best vote a pastor-candidate can get is a bare plurality, there's a big problem there. Even two-thirds sends some bad signals.
I'm not a pastor, but if a vote was less than 90%, I'd have to think long and hard about accepting. At the very least, I'd have to ask the pastor search committee to explain and interpret the No votes.
And the search committee which brings a candidate who can't command a big Yes vote should wonder if it really sought the Holy Spirit's leadership, or failed to do its homework on the candidate.
Tom Butler said:I'm not a pastor, but if a vote was less than 90%, I'd have to think long and hard about accepting. At the very least, I'd have to ask the pastor search committee to explain and interpret the No votes.
At first this was not the case (read ACTS). Then he later on became accepted.Lagardo said:Actually, it was the case. Those listening to God accepted him.
Well, first you say God has the only vote then you say He does not vote. Which is it?
I agree fully with you that God speaks and churches should hear and obey. However, it is not as simple as that. The voting process was started as an implementation of this idea. People put forth what they heard from God. Its been corrupted by politics within our churches, but if you have a better way to practice what you put forth, by all means, let's hear it.
AAA said:Instead of voting we neewd to be lead of the HOLY GHOST and HE will never steer us wrong as in some cases of voting.
Lagardo said:AAA,
The aspotles had an interesting method of seeking God's choice. They cast losts.
I have actually heard of a church casting lots to call a pastor, but I am not sure most churches have the faith to try this.
Of course, in bringing in all sides of a debate, I have heard one interpretation (not one I agree with) that says the apostles were impatient in selecting Judas' replacement and God's choice was clearly Saul of Tarsus, not Mattias.
AAA said:Remember the spys that went inot the promise land. Two of them came back with a good report and the rest cam back with a bad report. If this had been a voting church, then the VOTE would be: GOD is a lier and we can't take the land. The majority is NOT always correct. It cost His chosen nation alot. It says that those who dies in unbelief will NOT have eternal life.
Instead of voting we neewd to be lead of the HOLY GHOST and HE will never steer us wrong as in some cases of voting.
Who would you rather trust?
The votes of men?
or the HOLY GHOST?
Paul was never voted in, nor MOSES, NOr mary, nor Joseph...These were al APPOINTED and ordianed by GOD. This is the betetr way......
lagardo said:Once again, you point out the theological concept with no indication of how you would apply it.
We are in agreement that we should be lead by the Holy Spirit. We have firmly established this. When a desicion must be made in a church, how do you think that body of believes should be lead of the Holy Spirit?
Tom Butler said:AAA, it sounds really nice say that we should let the HS lead us, not the votes of men. I remind you that the disciples cast lots to determine Judas' replacement. That's not voting as we do it, but it is a method of selection. They prayed for God's guidance and asked Him to show them which of the two nominees He wanted. Then they gave the lot and Matthias was chosen.
Also, remember that Paul was not immediately accecpted into the church at Jerusalem until Barnabas vouched for him. (Acts 9:24-26)
Can the Lord not speak through a vote of his people? When the last pastor search committee I served on prayed earnestly for Holy Spirit leading, the committee members affirmed that leadership in its votes.
Another thing: we five members had agreed that we would not act unless all five of us agreed. That meant one member could stop anything the committee wanted to do. But we felt that the Holy Spirit would reveal his will to all of us, not just some of us. When we voted, we were in one accord, unified in mind and spirit. The entire congregation affirmed our recommendations (with the exception of 3 or 4 people, as I remember. That's about as close to unanimous you can get in a Baptist church.
Lagardo said:Once again, you point out the theological concept with no indication of how you would apply it.
We are in agreement that we should be lead by the Holy Spirit. We have firmly established this. When a desicion must be made in a church, how do you think that body of believes should be lead of the Holy Spirit?
Bro. James Reed said:If the church has a pastor who changes his view of scripture, and starts preaching untruths, how do they get rid of him? Say he converts to Islam, but doesn't want to give up the pastorship of his church, and instead wants to convert them all? Is the church to do nothing or are they all supposed to leave and leave the church in the hands of this man?
rbell said:"Pure democracy" (everything is voted on; nothing is done without a vote) eventually paralyzes a church.
"Total dictatorship" (one man/entity (we're talking HUMAN here) decides everything) causes a church to become unhealthy, and ultimately might become cult-like if the leader is not a Godly one.
Both extremes IMO are problematic.
AAA said:Have you considered in todays time most of the so-called-church is just professing christians and not even saved? I have heard that B. Graham said that number was 75%. This means that 25% are truely saved if this were true. So lets say that 25% (born agian christians) hears from God and votes for the pastor that HE has ordianed, and 20% (professing christians, but not truely saved) votes for the same person. That is 45% that will be overuled by the 55% (professing Christian, but not truely born agian). How many times has this happend?
(snip)
Let God's will be done............Vote or no vote!