Pastor's Moral Character

Thankful · Sep 10, 2003

I think that pastors and deacons should be above reproach. I do think that there are higher standards for them; however, we must remember that they are also human.

I think that all Christians should try to live by the same high standards.

I realize that pastors must use illustrations at times to make a point, but it makes me very uncomfortable when they talk about people in the church. Many times one can tell who they are talking about or sometimes they will say they have permission to talk about this person.

I want to be able to confide in my pastor without it being discussed with any one else.

I believe this should also extend to the pastor's wife. A member should be able to confide in her and seek counsel without it being discussed with someone else.

I learned the hard way that that is not true. I even asked her (years ago) not to discuss the matter with the other person and she did.

Because of past experiences, I have become a very private person and usually do not discuss my problems with anyone.

I liked Jim1999's post.

[ September 10, 2003, 10:02 AM: Message edited by: Thankful ]

Thankful · Sep 10, 2003

OK, why does it say that I edited my post at 10:02 when it is only 8:50.

Squire Robertsson · Sep 10, 2003

Because the Board runs on NYC time and y'all are on Central/Chicago time. The 12 minutes is because nobody has checked the Board time against the Naval Observatory clock lately.

TheOliveBranch · Sep 10, 2003

Sorta like, did Adam have a belly button? type naval? or "I forgot to check?"

Baptist in Richmond · Sep 10, 2003

Originally posted by greatday:
At the annual meeting of the National Baptist Convention in 1998, the Rev. Henry Lyons of St. Petersburg, former President of the National Baptist Convention and personal friend of President Bill Clinton, admitted to an ``inappropriate relationship'' - an increasingly popular euphemism for adultery - with a woman employed by the nation's largest black church group. He said he was sorry and asked for forgiveness and they forgave him. Lyons was once a personal friend of Baptist Bill Clinton.

Lyons was convicted in February 1999 of swindling more than $4 million from companies that wanted to market life insurance, credit cards and cemetery plots to his convention members. Prosecutors said Lyons padded the convention's mailing list with names randomly selected from phone books across the country. Even a grand dragon of the Ku Klux Klan was on the list. He pleaded guilty to federal charges of tax evasion, fraudulent activities and lying to officials

In his sentencing, Judge Schaeffer had ordered Lyons to pay $2.5 million in restitution to the companies who bought his phony mailing lists and to pay $97,000 for the cost of the state probe into his dealings.

Lyons is now serving a five and a half year prison sentence. His bid for a shorter prison term gets nowhere with a trial judge fed up with his crimes. A judge flatly denied the Rev. Henry Lyons' bid to reduce his state prison term rejecting pleas that the religious leader is suffering physically and mentally from incarceration.

Lyons, who has tested positive for exposure to tuberculosis, ``can be treated in prison,'' Pasco-Pinellas Circuit Judge Susan Schaeffer told about a dozen of his supporters. ``Prison is a place that brings on illnesses, a place where you are going to be among murderers, thugs and thieves,'' the judge said. ``There isn't anything about it that's supposed to be fun.'' Schaeffer did not mince words during an almost half-hour long oral ruling from the bench.
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WOW, I just recently moved from Tampa to The Commonwealth, and I remember this all happening. When did Rev. Lyons test positive for exposure to tuberculosis? I used to travel to and from Nashville (headquarters of the NBC) extensively and rode on the same plane with him frequently. My ex-girlfriend (I was unmarried back then) used to pick me up at TIA, and she said that there was always someone with a video camera waiting for him as our plane taxied into the gate.

BTW, did you ever see his house on the beach that he owned jointly with the other party involved in the "inappropriate relationship?" How did he think he would ever be able to hide that??

gb93433 · Sep 11, 2003

Originally posted by Johnv:
Certainly, a pastor is held to a higher standard. But when we congregants attempt to determine what that higher standard should be, we often end up holding to a double standard instead, not to mention we typically second guess our pastors.

For example, imagine you're in the grocery store picking up wine coolers for the nfl game, and you notice your pastor pickng up a bottle of wine. So you tell others you saw the pastor buying alcohol in the store. What you might not realize is that the pastor was picking up a bottle to use during the surprise wedding anniversary dinner he was secretly making at home for his mother and father.
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Oh how we like to judge others, If I remember right Paul wrote something to that effect in Romans 2"1-2, "Therefore you have no excuse, everyone of you who passes judgment, for in that which you judge another, you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things. And we know that the judgment of God rightly falls upon those who practice such things."

But so often others don't judge when someone buys 50 proof Nyquil.

But it does amaze me that so many Baptists in other countries would not even think of judging someone in ways that we do in America.

Pastor's Moral Character

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