Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Not being snide, made an accurate observation.
In other words, you can't actually refute what I said using Scripture. Noted.
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Paul Taught False Doctrine?
- Thread starter Reformed1689
- Start date
It is not my amount of faith that keeps me but who I have faith in. Some have a lot of faith in the wrong person.
It is not the size of extension cord but the power in the plug in
Rom 8:38
For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39
Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
It is not the size of extension cord but the power in the plug in
Rom 8:38
For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39
Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
The quoted article is wrong. On the subject of eternal security, once saved always saved or perseverance of the saints, Paul does not teach Calvinism, Calvin interprets Paul and other Scriptures. Where you agree with the 5 point of Calvinism or not the Pauline teaching on Security agrees with word's of Jesus Christ:
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Everlasting life began when whosoever believes and cannot end or it will not be everlasting.
John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
Praise the Lord, Jesus Christ will never get sick of us and throw us out.
John 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.
Eternal life carries with it the promise of Jesus Christ and God the Father to hold onto His children. It also carries the promise of being kept from perishing. The idea that when we put ourselves into God's hand we can take ourselves out forgets that we constantly make decisions which we may regret but have no power to change. I have never regretted trusting the Lord to save me.
Hebrews 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee. 6 So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me.
The writer of Hebrews shares the 4th promise Jesus Christ will not leave or forsake us. The warning is clear regardless of how faithful we live, Jesus will not leave us, He will help us!
These are my personal interpretations and I acknowledge I could be wrong! I am not a Calvinist or and Arminianist, I follow Jesus Christ.
While these Scriptures have elements that some may call Calvinistic. To me they are simple the promises of my loving Lord and Savior. I trust Him to keep His Word and I don't have to know or explain how it all works out. He is Lord not me.
When my children were small we would walk across a busy parking lot and I would hold out my little finger and say, "Hold my hand as we go across the parking lot".The would grab my finger in their little hand and I would wrap my hand around theirs. The thought their safety depended on their grip, I KNEW their safety depended on MY GRIP! I didn't lose any of them.
John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Everlasting life began when whosoever believes and cannot end or it will not be everlasting.
John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
Praise the Lord, Jesus Christ will never get sick of us and throw us out.
John 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. 29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand.
Eternal life carries with it the promise of Jesus Christ and God the Father to hold onto His children. It also carries the promise of being kept from perishing. The idea that when we put ourselves into God's hand we can take ourselves out forgets that we constantly make decisions which we may regret but have no power to change. I have never regretted trusting the Lord to save me.
Hebrews 13:5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee. 6 So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me.
The writer of Hebrews shares the 4th promise Jesus Christ will not leave or forsake us. The warning is clear regardless of how faithful we live, Jesus will not leave us, He will help us!
These are my personal interpretations and I acknowledge I could be wrong! I am not a Calvinist or and Arminianist, I follow Jesus Christ.
While these Scriptures have elements that some may call Calvinistic. To me they are simple the promises of my loving Lord and Savior. I trust Him to keep His Word and I don't have to know or explain how it all works out. He is Lord not me.
When my children were small we would walk across a busy parking lot and I would hold out my little finger and say, "Hold my hand as we go across the parking lot".The would grab my finger in their little hand and I would wrap my hand around theirs. The thought their safety depended on their grip, I KNEW their safety depended on MY GRIP! I didn't lose any of them.
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Brother, if non-Calvinists allow their theology to go it is logical extreme, then yes, losing one's salvation is the outcome. After all, if man has the free will to choose God, he should also have the free will to reject God, no matter whether he is a professed believer or not. But as we know, the vast majority of Baptists on the non-Calvinist side do not go to their logical extreme.
One can loose fellowship with out fathers but cannot undo the father/son relationship
He does not force us to accept him, but .certainty can keep His promises to us, even when we don't, We do not override His promises.
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
OHHHHH So we do not have the free will to then reject His promises once we have them?
do you propose free will to reject God after you have a relationship? to say I never knew God as Savior.
You are already have son ship, It is not rejectable . Free Will is not as some say empowering us to have our will. We break fellowship with our Father when we sin as we can break fellowship with our earthly father,It doesn't change who our father is,
We are children of God, we have broke that fellowship and can be restored, We do not go from no relationship to having a relationship. We ABIDE in that relationship until we sin
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
No. But I also don't think we can choose the Father either. It's not our desire. He chooses us.
I cannot conceive of anyone who has been born-again wishing to be unborn.
Satan is the great deceiver and conveniences many non-repentant sinners they are Children of God when they are in fact his children.
God's children are sealed by the Holy Spirit:
2Co 1:22 KJV - Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.
Eph 1:13 KJV - In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Eph 4:30 KJV - And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Thank God, because I am sealed as a member of the family of God, I can rest-assured He will preserve me in Him.
Jhn 10:28 KJV - And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.
Jhn 10:29 KJV - My Father, which gave [them] me, is greater than all; and no [man] is able to pluck [them] out of my Father's hand.
Any professing child of God who takes issue with this assurance is in need of our prayers. May God reveal Himself to you.
Satan is the great deceiver and conveniences many non-repentant sinners they are Children of God when they are in fact his children.
God's children are sealed by the Holy Spirit:
2Co 1:22 KJV - Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.
Eph 1:13 KJV - In whom ye also [trusted], after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Eph 4:30 KJV - And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Thank God, because I am sealed as a member of the family of God, I can rest-assured He will preserve me in Him.
Jhn 10:28 KJV - And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any [man] pluck them out of my hand.
Jhn 10:29 KJV - My Father, which gave [them] me, is greater than all; and no [man] is able to pluck [them] out of my Father's hand.
Any professing child of God who takes issue with this assurance is in need of our prayers. May God reveal Himself to you.
Thanks for sharing your views, I think they are spot on.
I would substitute perseverance for preservation.
Absolute nonsense;
2Co 1:22 Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.
Eph_4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.
Eph_1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Joh_10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
No man can break a seal or promise of God. What I just proved is that you don't know as much as you think you do about non Calvinist who believe in OSAS. I do not have to,persevere, I am held in the hand of God.
MB
No man can break a seal or promise of God and that is the extreme of OSAS. One thing for sure perseverance is a work and it is impossible to be saved by works.
MB
He made us. We sinned and rejected Him yet He came to save us. He promised to keep us. We are not more powerful than Him. We are secure
Once God makes a promise, it is kept.
The Choice to be saved is not conditional upon our merit or behavior
He would rather all accept Him, He does as He promises to do.
Hebrews 13:5 King James Version (KJV)
5 Let your conversation be without covetousness; and be content with such things as ye have: for he hath said, I will never leave thee, nor forsake thee.
Man is already in a state of rejection, He chose to sin.
Did Satan have free will to sin?
Reformed1689
Well-Known Member
Not sure what you are tying to argue here.
He keeps his promises, one is to never leave us
