Penal Substitution Atonement Theory

[JonC]

I've noticed that there are a lot of similarities in the way Puritans like Bunyan, Owen and Watson describe LIVING the Christian life with Baxter and Wesley and even Menno and the Moravians. Jonathan Edwards mentions reading Thomas Kempis and Martyn Lloyd Jones spends a good portion of his book "The Puritans" praising Wesley and the Methodists in their way of life. I'm not sure what to make of that, it's just what I have noticed.

I believe Christians can become hostile towards one another when they are not completely engaged in God's work. This may be the difference with those men - although they disagreed about doctrine they shared a common goal and focus.

My church affirms Penal Substitution Theory. It is a wonderful church and I appreciate being a member. I taught at the church until I had to step down (I changed jobs and could not continue). My view is not an issue. We also have free-will people and Calvinists.

At the same time I know some who cannot discuss differences without becoming hostile. Some politely refrain and stick with their own camp while others attack other people for their views.

I think what we see with those you mention is spiritual maturity.

 

[JonC]

The Psa best explains the biblical concept of the atonement

Perhaps it does, under the Law. But it is the most unbiblical view of the work of Christ and our redemption.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

A few years ago I wrote quite a lengthy screed on the Doctrine of Penal Substitutionary Atonement on this forum and later transferred it to my blog. Here it is:
The Theological and Biblical Basis of Penal Substitution

I think one of the problems that bedevil discussions on PSA is the idea that God pours out His wrath upon the Lord Jesus Christ. On the contrary, it is God Himself, in the Person of Christ who is taking our sins upon Himself (c.f. Acts of the Apostles 20:28) and paying the penalty for them, thus satisfying His own justice. Christ is made sin (2 Corinthians 5:21) and God the Father punishes sin in Christ. The wrath is not towards Christ but towards sin.

One last point: if Christ has not paid the penalty for my sins in full, nothing is more certain than that I shall have to pay it myself. Otherwise how is God going to be 'just, and the justifier of the one who believes in Jesus' (Romans 3:26)? How is He going to be 'faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness' (1 John 1:9)?

 

[Martin Marprelate]

I also wrote another lengthy post here concerning the argument that Penal Substitution somehow 'breaks' the Trinity.
Penal Substitution and the Trinity
BTW, I apologize for the strange adverts that appear on my blog from time to time. There is nothing I can do about them without paying money.

 

[JonC]

I also wrote another lengthy post here concerning the argument that Penal Substitution somehow 'breaks' the Trinity.
Penal Substitution and the Trinity
BTW, I apologize for the strange adverts that appear on my blog from time to time. There is nothing I can do about them without paying money.

Members,

This point is good. There are too many false arguments against opposing positions.

Penal Substitution Theory does not "break" the Trinity because it views redemption as an act of God (in essence, God is taking upon Himself the punishment He demands). An argument can be made, however, that it holds inconsistencies within the doctrine of the Trinity (this is a legitimate argument scholars have made, but not one I personally would argue).

This also negates the "cosmic child abuse" argument from theologians like Denny Weaver.

That said, I invite members who are willing to lay their beliefs out for examination to re-consider the theory. Ypu may reinforce your position. You may alter your view. But we should routinely go back to Scripture and test what we affirm.

Does Penal Substitution Theory deal with a just God forgiving sinners? Yes, absolutely. BUT is it biblical? Here I say absolutely not. Just because a theory answers our questions does not make it the only answer, and definitely not a biblical answer.

This thread is coming to a close. But the questions will continue (somebody will start another thread, or I will, to continue the discussion).

Let iron sharpen iron.

 

[JonC]

This thread is closed. It was approaching the limit and to be fair to comments introduced I started another thread:

The Penal Substitution Theory of Atonement