First, I never said that. You will not find a post where I did say that and you guys need to stop adding words to what people post. Stop putting words in people's mouths. It denigrates these discussions.
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Poor Old "Uncle Billy"
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First, I never said that. You will not find a post where I did say that and you guys need to stop adding words to what people post. Stop putting words in people's mouths. It denigrates these discussions.
Not true.
One may “receive” a court order and not accept it, yet be responsible to that order regardless.
Well said. God's standard in perfect perfection 100% of the time, inside and outside.
rd
A court order is not a gift.
First, you DID state:
I merely showed how that your statement was inconsistent with Scripture principle of receiving and giving are intertwined when it comes to salvation.
Yesterday, I too was young.
True, but then I already showed that the gift of salvation is also the recipient giving, and your response seemed to need a more earthy example to get the point across.
Then what must one do, what effort is required, what standard must be met for one to be capable of reaching out of self generated desire to grab salvation?
How is John 1 not violated by such thinking?
I misread Mitch's post. When I formulated this answer. And no, your example does not stand.
Not when you received life.
RevM posted:
When it comes to salvation it is not a matter that one must “take possession” rather it is that salvation takes possession of the person.
Therefore, there is no effort, no authority of the humankind to “possess” (action done to receive) but one is endowed (possessed by) the salvation.
Therefore, contrary to the quote of RevM, receiving, as it pertains to salvation, is truly passive, and not requiring action to acquire, but most certainly causes reaction that cannot be suppressed.
“Receiving is never passive. If someone brings me a gift in order to make it mine I must physical take possession of it, Receiving always requires and action.”
On the surface, this would seem to be correct thinking, however in practice it is not always true.
When it comes to salvation it is not a matter that one must “take possession” rather it is that salvation takes possession of the person.
Therefore, there is no effort, no authority of the humankind to “possess” (action done to receive) but one is endowed (possessed by) the salvation.
Therefore, contrary to the quote of RevM, receiving, as it pertains to salvation, is truly passive, and not requiring action to acquire, but most certainly causes reaction that cannot be suppressed.
No you accused me of saying something I never said.
No its not.
This is assumed by you and remains unproven. Jesus said salvation is a gift. Gifts are never forced on one. Sorry but in the calvinist world salvation is forced on people.
Again, your statement is unacceptable, because both by Scripture, by principle, and by example, the statement has been shown false.
Of course you won’t make any effort in rebuttal, just say, “No it’s not.”
Perhaps you have nothing substantial and are ready to admit to error?
I responded in kind, you have not given me anything substantial. You just make a claim and expect everyone to fall down believing it. Zero support.
Actually, it is proven, throughout Scriptures not a single instance displays humankind first taking action, but were first possessed by salvation and reacting to that endowment.
No one said, “forced on people” but believers are “drawn” (not dragged) as exampled in the conversion of Saul (Paul), the Ethiopian eunuch, the Philipean jailer, ...
Those drawn will respond not out of “force” but gratitude.
One is not forced into being unsaved. It is that determined condition.
Neither does God force salvation. Rather, He changes the person from unholy to holy. None are dragged into slavery of salvation, but are purchased from the slavery, taken off the market, and adopted as heirs. That principle is shown in Scripture.
Perhaps, because of your own attitude toward Calvinistic in thinking is caustic, you dare not come near the truth.
This is not support merely a claim made by you. Try again.
I presented Scripture.
I presented practical everyday examples.
So, where is your support?
Your statement concerning receiving has been found having no support.
Your view that Calvinism presents God as forcing salvation has been found having no support.
You even failed to present the proper facts when posting John’s statement concerning the authority of the Father to draw.
What grand claims you bluster while you have no steerage to rely upon!
Would you honestly admit you are wrong when shown the truth?
Amen!
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