Practice of Ordination of Elders/Pastors

[Dr. Bob]

March 6, 1973 was my ordination. I was ordained in the traditional manner of independent Baptists of Wisconsin where I was serving as a pastor. But there are other methods of ordination, and I'm interested in the general method/criteria practiced in your own life (if ordained) or in your group.

 

[JonC]

My preference is ordination by the congregation. The reason is I believe God speaks through His congregation and they are the people affirming the call and sending the ordained.

 

[AVL1984]

I know that when I was approached by a couple of preachers about becoming ordained, they wanted to have a counsel of pastors. The second time this happened, it was a congregation that wanted to ordain me. The last two times have been a counsel of preachers. I've turned down ordination 4x because of the churches/groups that wanted to ordain me, and the reasons they gave for their "decision". I wasn't convinced that I needed man's ordination, and especially not from the "counsels" and the congregations involved. I would accept ordination if I felt the Lord was truly in it instead of the reasoning of people who wanted to gain an ally. I would prefer a congregational ordination myself, but whatever the Lord showed me was the right time and group would be acceptable.

 

[Salty]

My preference is ordination by the congregation. The reason is I believe God speaks through His congregation and they are the people affirming the call and sending the ordained.

Though it is good to have a council of pastors of like faith and order to make a reccomendation.

I remember being told once that a church want to ordain one of their own - they did bring in the counsel of pastor - however the council recommended the candidate NOT be ordained. Well, the church went ahead and ordained him anyways - in part they had the meal all set to serve!

(No, dont seem to remember why the council did not recommend.)

 

[Dr. Bob]

they did bring in the counsel of pastor - however the council recommended the candidate NOT be ordained. Well, the church went ahead and ordained him anyways - in part they had the meal all set to serve!

This is a real problem. If a council of pastors is formed, USUALLY a service is planned so some of them (usually about half) will be close enough to stay and lay hands in a public showing in ordination. Can't ask them to come back another time.

Some years ago we had a candidate who, in questioning personal living/separation issues, showed a questionable area. The church did NOT have dinner waiting or service planned, so able to talk with the man and advise church to evaluate his life for changes in next 12 months and then proceed with ordination. There were enough pastors in the city that 6-7 of us were able to attend that later time. He has been in full-time ministry now for many years.

 

[Dr. Bob]

When my sons were ordained, the local church had observed life/ministry/doctrine and simply held a service to ordain (with pastors invited in for the service, but not to question and recommend). Seems to be a new normal. (One GARBC church and one SBC church)

 

[JesusFan]

Though it is good to have a council of pastors of like faith and order to make a reccomendation.

I remember being told once that a church want to ordain one of their own - they did bring in the counsel of pastor - however the council recommended the candidate NOT be ordained. Well, the church went ahead and ordained him anyways - in part they had the meal all set to serve!

(No, dont seem to remember why the council did not recommend.)

Don't some do ordination thru the denomination itself?

 

[Dr. Bob]

Don't some do ordination thru the denomination itself?

That was why I put a choice in the poll.

In our city, the Lutheran (think WELS synod) ordain when candidate graduates from seminary. Get M.A. and Ordination certificate in folder.

The United Methodists here have denomination prerequisites - certain schooling/training, internship, and state denom officials give ordination. And IF you do something against the denomination's policies, they can REVOKE the ordination.

The Bible Church (IFCA) has church ordination, but no council. And again, if they desire, church can revoke ordination.

When I was ordained 5 decades ago, you had to take ordination certificate/credential to county courthouse to register to perform marriages. 7 years later I moved to another church in a different county and had to have it registered (their approval seal on back of my certificate still visible). Then I moved 7 years later to Texas I asked about this and got a hearty chuckle from Denton County Clerk who said they had quit that requirement back in 1939.

 

[JesusFan]

That was why I put a choice in the poll.

In our city, the Lutheran (think WELS synod) ordain when candidate graduates from seminary. Get M.A. and Ordination certificate in folder.

The United Methodists here have denomination prerequisites - certain schooling/training, internship, and state denom officials give ordination. And IF you do something against the denomination's policies, they can REVOKE the ordination.

The Bible Church (IFCA) has church ordination, but no council. And again, if they desire, church can revoke ordination.

When I was ordained 5 decades ago, you had to take ordination certificate/credential to county courthouse to register to perform marriages. 7 years later I moved to another church in a different county and had to have it registered (their approval seal on back of my certificate still visible). Then I moved 7 years later to Texas I asked about this and got a hearty chuckle from Denton County Clerk who said they had quit that requirement back in 1939.

I am part of the Great Lakes Baptist group, and think they require one to be licensed and practicing as such for min of 2 years, and they have the regional group approve them local ordination

 

[Dr. Bob]

I am part of the Great Lakes Baptist group, and think they require one to be licensed and practicing as such for min of 2 years, and they have the regional group approve them local ordination

Not sure what larger body is parent to the Great Lakes Baptist. Do they have authority over a local church (who they may/may not ordain)?

In my ministry we have done that basic standard, too. If a man feels a burden for vocational ministry, he meets with church where he is active to see if they agree. They, then, license him to "preach". After 2 years he may again ask the church to call a council of ordained men to recommend ordination.

I was licensed to preach in 1969 while in grad school, serving as Assistant Pastor (part time). After school I was full-time Associate Pastor in a larger metro congregation, gaining even more experience. And then in 1973 as a Senior Pastor in a village parish, stood for ordination.

 

[AVL1984]

So, Grif, is it ever right for one who has been asked to consider ordination by several pastors to do so? I had gone in view of a call and was voted on at four separate churches...the first 75% in favor, but didn't feel the Lord was leading us in that direction. Something didn't feel right about the church, the deacons, the search committee, and the members. After they had told us that they wanted to call us, my wife and I prayed about the situation and felt led to decline. Ordination was to come with accepting the pastorate. That church went out of existence seven months later. The second church gave us an 89% positive, but, there again, there were things that were severely off. I had filled their pulpit several times over a period of 2 months, but there was such a great division in the church we didn't feel comfortable with accepting. Ordination would have been by a council of local pastors (the previous church mentioned was by the church alone), and they affirmed after talking to me individually that I should accept the proposal of ordination. After much prayer and fasting, I declined. Again, that church was out of existence within 18 months Both were in Illinois. The other two have been here in Tennessee, and one was a new church, starting as a split. I was working as an assistant pastor in the church. It, too, went out after 24 months. The other is still serving the Lord and growing. I believed they needed someone who was far better equipped educationally than I was. I turned down ordination from all four churches. I've been asked again to consider ordination through a different denomination. I am considering it. In your opinion can one turn down ordination that many times, and still truly consider ordination through a baptistic type church? They have both the church and their locally affiliated ministers who would have to give the go ahead Would really like your input.

 

[Salty]

Don't some do ordination thru the denomination itself?

Some denominations do - but with most Baptists - it is a local church decision

 

[Dr. Bob]

So, Grif, is it ever right for one who has been asked to consider ordination by several pastors to do so?

Ordination is a church function. If you do not feel the church is making a correct decision, then stepping back (as you've done) is best.

If you feel God's leading to full-time vocational ministry, I'd work with the church where you now serve to call a council to ordain. Whether you pastor there or not is NOT the issue; they are the ones who know you and your gifts/calling.

Then with the credentials in your pocket, you can accept a call from any church and NOT tie it to getting ordained. Understand that every time you turn down ordination makes you "suspect" in the eyes of others. Human nature questions such.

 

[AVL1984]

Thanks, Bob. I greatly appreciate your input on this.

 

[Jerome]

I am part of the Great Lakes Baptist group, and think they require one to be licensed and practicing as such for min of 2 years, and they have the regional group approve them local ordination

Not sure what larger body is parent to the Great Lakes Baptist.

Great Lakes Region (Association) of the North American Baptist Conference (NABC, originally the German Baptist Conference)

North American Baptist Conference • Regional Associations

"The North American Baptist Conference...more than four hundred churches dispersed across twelve regions. Each region is led by a Regional Minister"

North American Baptist Conference Ordination and Licensure Guide (pdf)

Ministerial License
"This credentialing designation is viewed as an act of the local church and association in recognition of the call of God upon a person’s life....the ministerial license must be both conferred by the local church and affirmed within the association/regional leadership structure."

Ordination
"This credentialing designation is viewed as an act of the local church in recognition of the call of God upon a person’s life, which is recognized by the association/region representing the entire conference. It is designed specifically for those involved in pastoral ministry....It is conferred by the local church working in fraternal cooperation with the association/region of the conference."

Process for Licensure
"The church where the person is serving shall initiate the process of licensure credentialing. This process shall include: A request from the church to the leadership of the association/region supporting this desire to license the individual; A brief description of the individual’s role in the local church ministry; The submission from the individual of a signed copy of the NAB Statement of Faith and Code of Ministerial Ethics of the North American Baptist Conference. Upon review, the association/regional leadership shall vote to affirm license credential, deny licensure credential or seek clarification of information.

Process for Ordination
"the individual seeking ordination shall submit an ordination paper [The individual’s call to ministry; Education; Previous Christian service; Doctrinal statement; Current ministry position and duties; Signed copy of Code of Ministerial Ethics of the North American Baptist Conference] to the leadership within the association/regional leadership structure....[which] shall either vote to recommend the church call an ordination council, refer the paper back to the individual for further development, decline to proceed with ordination credentialing, or recommend with qualifications...."

 

[Dr. Bob]

Very familiar with German Baptists - First Baptist a few blocks from me is from that ilk. I've had lunch with young pastor - super reformed doctrinally and loves his flock. And Piper's church was part.

Gordon Johnson, Dean at Bethel is a long-time family friend. He was disappointed I opted not for seminary there. They are conservative evangelical and looks like a little more hierarchy than independent Baptists (old conservative Baptists) like me

 

[Jerome]

Bethlehem, Bethel, etc. are not NABC, but 'Converge', denomination formerly known as the Baptist General Conference (Swedish Baptist)

 

[Dr. Bob]

Bethlehem, Bethel, etc. are not NABC, but 'Converge', denomination formerly known as the Baptist General Conference (Swedish Baptist)

Swedish, German, Scandawhoevian or Bavarian - somewhere over there. All the same to me!

(Thanks for kindly correcting me, brother. Truly had them mixed up. My pix doesn't do justice to how old/non-functional my brain is)

 

[Salty]

(Thanks for kindly correcting me, brother. Truly had them mixed up. My pix doesn't do justice to how old/non-functional my brain is)

Maybe its time to go back to the bow tie!

 

[Dr. Bob]

Maybe its time to go back to the bow tie!

Maybe time to bow out. I do not like the way the brain misfires at times