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Preacher vs. Senior Pastor vs. Pastor?

cowboymatt

New Member
trustitl said:
I am assuming in theology, correct. I probably wouldn't be in that church. No offense, but I just probably wouldn't. If I was, I would ask him if he wanted to be called doctor... If he said yes, then I probably wouldn't be anymore.
You wouldn't want to be in a church with an educated pastor?

And when I earn mine I'll expect my students in college/seminary to call me doctor, but its a different thing in the church. If someone wanted to, then that's fine. But it wouldn't be expected.
 

cowboymatt

New Member
trustitl said:
"Doctor" is a title earned and it is considered to be proper by our culture to address them as such. I expect my children to address adults with the proper title Mr. or Mrs.. Furthermore, I see value in doing this with titles within institutions of our society such as Officer Bill or General Patton.

Pastoring is a function within the body of Christ and is a gift from God. These men are merely using the gifts given them to serve the church. I think it makes for an unhealthy environment in the churches of God when we elevate some of the body parts over others. I do not think it wise to diminish the church to a cultural institution with the traditions that go along with it.

My children call my brother Uncle Mark, but do not call his children "cousin" David or "cousin" Emily. I see pastors as my peers for we "are all brothers". If we all felt this way we may see more people playing a role in the body of Christ and pastors not getting to full or themselves or overwhelmed by innapropriate expectations.
First of all, the notion of "merely" using a gift is weird to me. Why did you use that word?

I agree with you that all members of the church are equal and that all the gifts are equal.

But do you think that an educated pastor diminishes "the church to a cultural institution"?

What do you make of my distinction of expecting my college/seminary students to call me Dr. but not people in the church?

And do you have something against education and why?
 

webdog

Active Member
Site Supporter
Cara said:
In our parish, we have a pastor, who is addressed as "Father First name." (Those whose official function we used to refer to as "curates" are now generally called assistant pastors; they, too, are addressed formally as "Father First Name,") In social situations, however, when a pastor or assistant pastor is a close friend, most are quite comfortable with being addressed by their given names. On an envelope, one would write, "Rev. Fr. John Smith", as he is an ordained priest.

We have three married deacons in our parish. Although one could properly be said to perform the administrative duties of an assistant pastor, they are individually addressed as "Deacon First Name." (Again, socially, or in informal meetings, good friends or coworkers generally address them by their given names.) A more formal letter to a deacon would be addressed to "Rev. Mr. So and So," as he is an ordained deacons, not an ordained priest.

Heads of various ministries are, depending on their credentials, referred to as Youth Minister, etc. when they have a degree in pastoral ministry, for example, or as "Director of Social Ministry," "Director of Religious Education," etc. -- obviously, more of a job description than form of address -- but, in most Catholic parishes these days, directors of individual parish ministries are addressed by their first names or honorifics (such as Sister Mary, Brother John, Mr. Smith), depending not only on their personal preferences but also on who is doing the addressing.

As you mentioned, customs can vary from place to placehowever One Monday morning shortly after we moved to Georgia, I mentioned to a Baptist coworker about something "the pastor of my church said yesterday in his homily."

My young coworker looked surprised. He said to me, "I didn't know Catholics had pastors; I thought they only had priests."

I explained to him that a calling (to the ministry, priesthood, rabbinate, etc.) is a vocation. Terms such as "pastor" really designate a role within a broader calling. Thus, Catholics (and members of many other Christians denoms) don't address pastors as "Pastor So-And-So," although that is the job description of many priests and ministers. But in many Christian denoms, to address them as "Pastor X" would be akin to calling one's different physicians "Surgeon Smith," "Pediatrician Potter," and "Gynecologist Jones," instead of "Dr. So-and-So."
edited...I thought I was in the Baptist only forum (I was going through my subscribed threads):eek:
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Agnus_Dei

New Member
trustitl said:
"Doctor" is a title earned and it is considered to be proper by our culture to address them as such. I expect my children to address adults with the proper title Mr. or Mrs.. Furthermore, I see value in doing this with titles within institutions of our society such as Officer Bill or General Patton.

Pastoring is a function within the body of Christ and is a gift from God. These men are merely using the gifts given them to serve the church. I think it makes for an unhealthy environment in the churches of God when we elevate some of the body parts over others. I do not think it wise to diminish the church to a cultural institution with the traditions that go along with it.

My children call my brother Uncle Mark, but do not call his children "cousin" David or "cousin" Emily. I see pastors as my peers for we "are all brothers". If we all felt this way we may see more people playing a role in the body of Christ and pastors not getting to full or themselves or overwhelmed by innapropriate expectations.
…It quite obvious, to me anyway, that Christ in Matthew 23:9-10 is using hyperbole…that is, Christ is exaggerating to make a point…kind of like when Christ says that if your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out…if Christ were serious, we’d all be blind gimps…

Jesus in Matthew 23:9-10 is commenting on His observance in Matthew 23:6-7. Jesus is criticizing the Jewish leaders who love the place of honor at feasts and the best seats in the synagogues; and salutations in the market places, and being called ‘rabbi’ by men. Christ is pointing to how sinful these scribes and Pharisees are, how proud they were for not looking humbly to God as the source of all authority and fatherhood and teaching, and instead are setting themselves up as the ultimate authorities, father figures and teachers.

In the Orthodox faith, my priest is my spiritual father and we are his children, in other words we are committed to our priests spiritual care…hence Paul’s words: I do not write this to make you ashamed, but to admonish you as my beloved children. For though you have countless guides in Christ, you do not have many fathers. For I became your father in Christ Jesus through the gospel (1 Cor. 4:14–15).

In XC
-
 

annsni

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
To me, titles show respect and honor to a person who has earned that position.

Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you. - Hebrews 13:17

This shows that we do have those in authority over us and it is respectful to use the title that is appropriate. I don't see anything wrong with that at all and if people are uptight about it, what do you call your doctor? Hal?? I call my orthopedic surgeon by his first name but I have known him well, he's been in my home and he ASKED me to call him by his first name. Otherwise, he'd be known as Dr. Green - and he still is by my children. It's just showing respect.
 

TCGreek

New Member
cowboymatt said:
What if your pastor has earned a PhD?

Someday I might have an earned PhD, but I'll still like to called by my first name. But if they want to call me Dr., then so be it.
 

trustitl

New Member
annsni said:
To me, titles show respect and honor to a person who has earned that position.

Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you. - Hebrews 13:17

This shows that we do have those in authority over us and it is respectful to use the title that is appropriate. I don't see anything wrong with that at all and if people are uptight about it, what do you call your doctor? Hal?? I call my orthopedic surgeon by his first name but I have known him well, he's been in my home and he ASKED me to call him by his first name. Otherwise, he'd be known as Dr. Green - and he still is by my children. It's just showing respect.

I am all for showing respect. Part of my concern is that we respect some and not others. I also do not think that "pastor" is a position. I think it is a function within the body or church. We do not call any other people who are operating within the body by the fuction they are performing: exhorter Ed, teacher Tim...

Another part of my concern is that we have become dependent upon men for our spiritual growth. An earlier post said that he was commited to his Priest for his spiritual care. I think that is improper. Most Protestants see the inordinate dependence on the priests in Catholicism and Orthodoxy. I think this is happening within baptist, bible, and other churches as well. God will use people in our life; I think we are failing to let him use more of us within our local congregations due to this elevation of "pastor". I also think more people are pastors and don't realize it becasue they have not gone through the hoops of gaining the title or degree.

The solution is not to stop calling them "Pastor", but rather to change our mindset about what the church is and how it is to function.
 

FriendofSpurgeon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
cowboymatt said:
In Texas when I was younger, which I know is relative since I'm only 28!, all the Baptist churches that I knew about called their primary preacher "pastor" and the other people on staff "ministers." I also noted that some other churches called their primary preacher "preacher," "senior pastor," "preaching pastor," "father," etc, etc.

Sometime in college, I guess, I started noticing Baptist churches calling their primary preacher "senior pastor" and the other people on staff "pastors" too (youth pastor, music pastor, etc).

Two questions:

What do you call the person who is the primary preacher in your church?

Why all the differences? (If anyone knows any historical reasons that would be great!)

Back to the OP ... when I was a kid, we only had one preacher and he was called either pastor or preacher by the church members. (I called him dad.) I think "preacher" may be more of a southern thing.

At my current church, we have four pastors on staff. The title of the one who primarily preaches is the Senior Pastor. The other pastors' titles reflect their roles within the church -- Pastor of Community, Youth Pastor and Executive Pastor.

From a interpersonal standpoint, individual members may call them "Pastor" or by their first name, depending on their relationship with them. (I've heard them called other things too.)

Technically, they are either Assistant Pastors or Associate Pastors, but this is a denominational thing.
 

webdog

Active Member
Site Supporter
I call my pastor "Randy" :)

His name means amorous...and his love for God, His Word and His people is a reflection on his name, and fits him perfectly.
 

Brother Bob

New Member
webdog said:
I call my pastor "Randy" :)

His name means amorous...and his love for God, His Word and His people is a reflection on his name, and fits him perfectly.
My title is "Moderator" but they all call me Bro Bob..........How about that, I know exactly who they are addressing when they say, "Hey you".....:laugh:

BBob,
 

BobRyan

Well-Known Member
Brother Bob said:
My title is "Moderator" but they all call me Bro Bob..........How about that, I know exactly who they are addressing when they say, "Hey you".....:laugh:

BBob,

"Moderator/Pastor" on your profile. Is the "Moderator" title something related to your church or this board?

Bob
 
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