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Proof ALL does not mean all men

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SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
All in scripture always means all, it just doesnt always mean all without exception ! However it always means all of something. For instance Jesus said Jn 6:37

All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
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In 1Timothy 2:1-6, all means everyone without exception. Not the Calvinistic twisting of the passage
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
Rubbish. You speak of context. Now show from the context of 1 Timothy 2:1-6 that it means other than every single person ever created
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Sorry, I don't isolate passages to prooftext. It is clear from the rest of Scripture this does not mean individuals. Broader context. Paul's other writings make this clear as well.
 
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Revmitchell

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Reformed1689 said:
Sorry, I don't isolate passages to prooftext. It is clear from the rest of Scripture this does not mean individuals. Broader context. Paul's other writings make this clear as well.
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Im sorry I couldnt let this go. "The rest of scripture"? Thats not a standard to determine the context. Do you mind posting what exactly you think is the rest of scripture that develops the context for that verse.
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
Reformed1689 said:
Actually the context doesn't agree with you either. You have to read into the passage "individuals" when you see the word "people" even though that is not what it says. People does not always mean individuals, I am sure you agree with that. So since we are not actually clued in to the usage of people directly in chapter two, we must look to the broader context of the whole of Scripture to determine. And there are many passages that the context makes extremely clear God does not choose all individuals to be saved and is talking about all people groups.
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New King James Version 1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief

Here is the previous chapter which clearly says that Jesus came to save SINNERS and not any select few
 
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Revmitchell

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Reformed1689 said:
Actually the context doesn't agree with you either. You have to read into the passage "individuals" when you see the word "people" even though that is not what it says. People does not always mean individuals, I am sure you agree with that. So since we are not actually clued in to the usage of people directly in chapter two, we must look to the broader context of the whole of Scripture to determine. And there are many passages that the context makes extremely clear God does not choose all individuals to be saved and is talking about all people groups.
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Im sorry I need more specific verses with your explanation of each.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
New King James Version 1 Timothy 1:15 This is a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief

Here is the previous chapter which clearly says that Jesus came to save SINNERS and not any select few
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It also doesn't say all sinners unconditionally.
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
Here is the previous chapter which clearly says that Jesus came to save SINNERS and not any select few
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And this is precisely my point, you read the word "all" into the verse even though it is not there. That is your position, not what Scripture actually states.
 
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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
In 1Timothy 2:1-6, all means everyone without exception. Not the Calvinistic twisting of the passage
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So you say it means all without exception. I dont believe it does, can you provide evidence ? Why doesnt it say all without exception ? Maybe you are twisting scripture.
 
SavedByGrace

SavedByGrace

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
I am. Do you see all without exception in the passage ? Or are you reading that into it
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You have to show that all in the passage does not mean every single person in the world. The problem with people who hold your view is that you cannot accept what the Bible actually says because it would prove that your theology is wrong
 
Reformed1689

Reformed1689

Well-Known Member
SavedByGrace said:
You have to show that all in the passage does not mean every single person in the world. The problem with people who hold your view is that you cannot accept what the Bible actually says because it would prove that your theology is wrong
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Now wait a minute, how come we have to show it does not mean all people in the world and you don't have to show that it does?
 
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