Ravens

[Pastor_Bob]

I Kings 17:4 And it shall be, that thou shalt drink of the brook; and I have commanded the ravens to feed thee there.
5 So he went and did according unto the word of the LORD: for he went and dwelt by the brook Cherith, that is before Jordan.
6 And the ravens brought him bread and flesh in the morning, and bread and flesh in the evening; and he drank of the brook. (KJV)

I had a gentleman in the church on Wednesday night ask me about the "ravens" in this passage. It seems that he heard someone on the radio or on the internet say that the ravens here were not the actual raven bird, but rather a group of individuals that dressed in black clothing and would distribute scraps from the king's table to the poor and needy. Apparently, in their robes, they resembled a flock of ravens.

First, I, in nearly 40 years of ministry, have never heard such a theory.

Second, the Hebrew word translated "ravens" in this passage is the same Hebrew word translated "ravens" in the following passages, and leave no doubt that they refer to the actual bird.

Psalm 147:9 He giveth to the beast his food, and to the young ravens which cry.
Proverbs 30:17 The eye that mocketh at his father, and despiseth to obey his mother, the ravens of the valley shall pick it out, and the young eagles shall eat it.

I told this gentleman that my first thought was this guy he heard on the radio was simply mistaken. But, I told him that I would dig into it a bit. Every commentator that I have access to says nothing but that these are actual birds, which I firmly believe as well.

I was just curious as to whether some of you might have heard this viewpoint and where it might have come from.

 

[Iconoclast]

I Kings 17:4 And it shall be, that thou shalt drink of the brook; and I have commanded the ravens to feed thee there.
5 So he went and did according unto the word of the LORD: for he went and dwelt by the brook Cherith, that is before Jordan.
6 And the ravens brought him bread and flesh in the morning, and bread and flesh in the evening; and he drank of the brook. (KJV)

I had a gentleman in the church on Wednesday night ask me about the "ravens" in this passage. It seems that he heard someone on the radio or on the internet say that the ravens here were not the actual raven bird, but rather a group of individuals that dressed in black clothing and would distribute scraps from the king's table to the poor and needy. Apparently, in their robes, they resembled a flock of ravens.

First, I, in nearly 40 years of ministry, have never heard such a theory.

Second, the Hebrew word translated "ravens" in this passage is the same Hebrew word translated "ravens" in the following passages, and leave no doubt that they refer to the actual bird.

Psalm 147:9 He giveth to the beast his food, and to the young ravens which cry.
Proverbs 30:17 The eye that mocketh at his father, and despiseth to obey his mother, the ravens of the valley shall pick it out, and the young eagles shall eat it.

I told this gentleman that my first thought was this guy he heard on the radio was simply mistaken. But, I told him that I would dig into it a bit. Every commentator that I have access to says nothing but that these are actual birds, which I firmly believe as well.

I was just curious as to whether some of you might have heard this viewpoint and where it might have come from.

Ravens then, and ravens now,no change.If it was people why would they feed him scraps of bread?

 

[Jerome]

That they were not birds but people is discussed in Adam Clarke's Commentary:

1 Kings 17 Commentary - Adam Clarke Commentary

(scroll down to end of chapter where it discussed in depth)

 

[canadyjd]

That they were not birds but people is discussed in Adam Clarke's Commentary:

1 Kings 17 Commentary - Adam Clarke Commentary

(scroll down to end of chapter where it discussed in depth)

Jerome, seems he favors your vulgate interpretation.

Bet you never heard that before, huh?

Thanks for the info. Like most issues from scripture, even though it’s the first I’ve heard of it, Christians have been discussing it for hundreds, if not thousands of years.

peace to you

 

[Pastor_Bob]

That they were not birds but people is discussed in Adam Clarke's Commentary:

1 Kings 17 Commentary - Adam Clarke Commentary

(scroll down to end of chapter where it discussed in depth)

Thank you. I had checked Clarke on verse 4, but see that he elaborates on this in his commentary of verse 24. It seems that most of his argument employs mainly human logic. It was interesting, though, to see where this idea might have come.

 

[37818]

That they were not birds but people is discussed in Adam Clarke's Commentary:

1 Kings 17 Commentary - Adam Clarke Commentary

(scroll down to end of chapter where it discussed in depth)

Clarke's note after v.24,
'THE subject in the fourth verse of this chapter deserves a more particular consideration.

I have commanded the ravens to feed thee. - It is contended that if we consider ערבים orebim to signify ravens, we shall find any interpretation on this ground to be clogged with difficulties. I need mention but a few. The raven is an unclean bird, And these ye shall have in abomination among the fowls - every raven after his kind; Le 11:13-15; that is, every species of this genus shall be considered by you unclean and abominable. Is it therefore likely that God would employ this most unclean bird to feed his prophet? Besides, where could the ravens get any flesh that was not unclean? . . .'