Regeneration and Faith

[percho]

So, was it an unrighteous man that Jehovah called out of Mesopotamia years earlier, appeared to several times, and announced blessings upon?

Was it an unregenerate man that built an altar to Jehovah at Shechem years earlier?

Was it to a dead alien sinner that Melchizedek pronounced 'Blessed be Abram of God Most High' years earlier?

I think not.

And by the same token.

These all died in faith, not having received the promises,----includes Abraham

Are all these currently regenerated?

But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.

I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: -----How?

We have the Holy Spirit from God the Father through Jesus the Christ the Son putting us in Christ making us heirs of eternal life, not inheritors but heirs.
We will die in the bosom of Christ awaiting his return and the regeneration.

For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. When Christ, our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.


The only begotten Son of God the Father, the one seed of Abraham, currently is the only one that has been through regeneration. He also after having been through the regeneration received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit Acts 2:33 then and then only could it be given to us. John 16:7 for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you;

How did he Jesus receive the promise of the Spirit that the promise of the Spirit might be given to us?????

Gal 3:22 YLT but the Writing did shut up the whole under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ may be given to those believing.
Gal 3:14 YLT that to the nations the blessing of Abraham may come in Christ Jesus, that the promise of the Spirit we may receive through the faith.

I ask did the faith precede the regeneration???


Regeneration and Faith

 

[convicted1]

And exactly which scriptures teach this?

Isaiah 67:1, Jude 2:7, Revelation 23:17, Acts 29:12, and 3 Corinthians 3:17. They're in ther if you dig deep enough....:laugh:

 

[Winman]

Isaiah 67:1, Jude 2:7, Revelation 23:17, Acts 29:12, and 3 Corinthians 3:17. They're in ther if you dig deep enough....:laugh:

Yep, they NEVER provide scripture to support regeneration before faith, because they CAN'T. It's not there, there is absolutely ZERO scriptures that supports this doctrine. You don't get this doctrine from the word of God, you get it from man.

Don't be fooled folks, like that old commercial, ask them "Where's the beef?". You'll get dead silence from them. I don''t know about you, but I want a real hamburger, not some fake veggie burger.

Don't be fooled by their psuedo arrogance and confidence, they've got nothing and they know it.

 

[kyredneck]

Gal 3:22 YLT but the Writing did shut up the whole under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ may be given to those believing.
Gal 3:14 YLT that to the nations the blessing of Abraham may come in Christ Jesus, that the promise of the Spirit we may receive through the faith.....

Jn 3:8 is not concerning 'the promise of the Spirit', it's referring to the birth from above, two different things.

 

[Christos doulos]

Take the "he regenerates you, gives you faith, ability to repent, justification...." as a salvation "package" so to speak. All happen at the same time. All from God.

Did not Jesus have to raise Lazarus so he could come forth?

 

[convicted1]

Did not Jesus have to raise Lazarus so he could come forth?

The rich man in hell was as dead as a "door knob", yet he communed with Abraham. Adam and Eve spoke with God after they died as well.

Jesus said the dead that hear shall live. A spiritually dead person can hear, and those that hear will live. Hearing brings life, not life brings hearing.

 

[MB]

It does seem as if there are some here who read backwards. This is why the cart always comes before the horse.
MB

 

[convicted1]

It does seem as if there are some here who read backwards. This is why the cart always comes before the horse.
MB

Maybe God foreordained this? Or did they choose to believe it to be this way?

 

[MB]

Maybe God foreordained this? Or did they choose to believe it to be this way?

Not sure. I was looking this morning for scripture that explained why some do not read from the front to the back, or from left to right. I couldn't find any, forcing me to apply my own understanding as to why. How ever to remain with in the rules of the board I dare not post them even though they must be true. After all Logic demands it to be so. Not to mention I am the one who thought them up.
MB

 

[jbh28]

Did not Jesus have to raise Lazarus so he could come forth?

Of course! I don't deny regeneration. I don't believe a person can believe without being regenerated. I believe faith is a gift from God and it's received when one is regenerated.

 

[DHK]

Not sure. I was looking this morning for scripture that explained why some do not read from the front to the back, or from left to right. I couldn't find any,
MB

Did you try the Hebrew Masoretic Text??

 

[DHK]

Of course! I don't deny regeneration. I don't believe a person can believe without being regenerated. I believe faith is a gift from God and it's received when one is regenerated.

Unless you have faith as a child you cannot enter into the Kingdom.
--Even children have faith. It is innate, inherent with every person. It is the object of the faith that is important. The object of my faith is Christ and his atoning work, and therefore I am saved.

The object of a Muslim's faith is Allah, but make no mistake the Muslim has faith, great faith. He has enough faith to blow himself up believing that in so doing it will guarantee him a place in paradise. That is the only "type" of eternal security there is in Islam--martyrdom. And many have faith in it.

 

[jbh28]

Unless you have faith as a child you cannot enter into the Kingdom.
--Even children have faith. It is innate, inherent with every person. It is the object of the faith that is important. The object of my faith is Christ and his atoning work, and therefore I am saved.

The object of a Muslim's faith is Allah, but make no mistake the Muslim has faith, great faith. He has enough faith to blow himself up believing that in so doing it will guarantee him a place in paradise. That is the only "type" of eternal security there is in Islam--martyrdom. And many have faith in it.

Yes, faith in Christ was what I meant.

 

[Forest]

And what verses would you use to support that. Also, do you have any examples in the Bible where it said they were regenerate, but didn't have faith?

Gal 5:22. Some of God's born again children do not excercise the faith that comes as a fruit of the Spirit.

 

[Forest]

I agree that regeneration does not precede salvation, but one must have faith prior to this happening.

You are stating that salvation occurs prior to having faith....or so it seems in your post.

Eternal salvation and regeneration are two different things, All of God's elect were eternally saved by Christ's work on the cross. His elect, after they are born into this world as natural beings are quickened by God (regenerated), and sometime after that some of God's elect are converted.

 

[jbh28]

Gal 5:22. Some of God's born again children do not excercise the faith that comes as a fruit of the Spirit.

What's your verse to say one is born again and not have the gift of faith?

 

[jbh28]

Eternal salvation and regeneration are two different things, All of God's elect were eternally saved by Christ's work on the cross. His elect, after they are born into this world as natural beings are quickened by God (regenerated), and sometime after that some of God's elect are converted.

1. Whats the verse that says "after"?
2. Are you saying by "some" that there are some of God's elect that are not converted? Do they go to heaven or hell?

 

[convicted1]

Eternal salvation and regeneration are two different things, All of God's elect were eternally saved by Christ's work on the cross. His elect, after they are born into this world as natural beings are quickened by God (regenerated), and sometime after that some of God's elect are converted.

Wrong, flat out wrong. You have someone spiritually alive outside of Christ. You have someone spiritually alive and yet dead in sins and trespasses. Wrong, flat out wrong.

There is no life outside of Jesus Christ. No one is spiritually alive outside of Jesus Christ. No one is regenerated outside of Jesus Christ. Those who are spiritually alive have been placed in Christ Jesus the Lord, and not outside of Him.

 

[DaChaser1]

Of course! I don't deny regeneration. I don't believe a person can believe without being regenerated. I believe faith is a gift from God and it's received when one is regenerated.

To me, its all apart of the salvation "package" from God unto those who are the Elect...

To me regeneration/faith/repentance etc ALL from God and Of God, so the monent one is justified and becomes a saint unto Lord occurs to us as essentially at same thing, as part of the "process!"

Don't beleive that God regerates us for long period of time bfore actually placing faith in jesus and getting saved!

 

[DaChaser1]

1. Whats the verse that says "after"?
2. Are you saying by "some" that there are some of God's elect that are not converted? Do they go to heaven or hell?

isn't Forest though a primitive Baptist?

So would tend to see it "different" than most would hear on the BB?