Religious Conservatism’s Potemkin Power

[KenH]

"I’ve heard a lot of despair today from my social and religious conservative friends. None of them see any point in showing up to vote this fall. A lot can change between now and then, but they feel, and I feel, that we don’t ask for much … and that’s what the Republican Party delivers.

That’s not entirely fair, I admit. But on a day like today, on an issue as big as this one, when the US Supreme Court, with two conservative justices voting the with majority, redefines the meaning of “sex” in federal civil rights law — we see with great clarity the powerlessness of social and religious conservatism in this country, the fecklessness of the Republican Party, and the vacuity of religious authority in post-Christian America."

Rod Dreher Archive | The American Conservative

 

[church mouse guy]

Some Evangelicals are working with Marxists and Muslims. They want clout but they are unable to please the Marxists and Muslims. In the long run Islam will destroy the Marxists and the Supreme Court will bow to sharia law. Do you think Evangelicals are in a permanent decline?

 

[church mouse guy]

^;'fx

 

[Steven Yeadon]

"I’ve heard a lot of despair today from my social and religious conservative friends. None of them see any point in showing up to vote this fall. A lot can change between now and then, but they feel, and I feel, that we don’t ask for much … and that’s what the Republican Party delivers.

That’s not entirely fair, I admit. But on a day like today, on an issue as big as this one, when the US Supreme Court, with two conservative justices voting the with majority, redefines the meaning of “sex” in federal civil rights law — we see with great clarity the powerlessness of social and religious conservatism in this country, the fecklessness of the Republican Party, and the vacuity of religious authority in post-Christian America."

Rod Dreher Archive | The American Conservative

Very weird ruling. I thought Justice Gorsuch would certainly be more conservative than he was. I am not surprised by Chief Justice Roberts' actions. He has proven to be a new style of moderate on social issues.

Ask yourself about this system though. So, all the hopes and dreams of social conservatives rest on the Supreme Court reversing its anti-Christian course for 50 years? To instead side with Christians? Nine people will decide the whole course for our nation?

American legal thought does not base itself on biblical principles and is, instead, decidedly secular. I was shocked in political science to learn that the Supreme Court uses secular logic alone to make decisions. Using philosophies inimical to Christian theology will always get you garbage like the Roe-v-Wade ruling. Our champions are Supreme Court Justices using bible-less thought without knowledge or wisdom, for both start with the fear of the LORD.

In response I must say that true justice is an inherently biblical concept. The definitions of right, wrong, and what is justice are found in the bible. Until Justices are chosen for their godliness and sound judgment based on biblical principles, and no Roman Catholics don't count, we will see more of the same in the long run. America is increasingly like Europe, "Post-Christian."

That said, where is Congress? Laws are made by the Legislature, but in this divided era we expect no big ideas from those who write the law as opposed to interpreting it.

Let's be honest, the Supreme Court is our social conservative football "Hail Mary" play to save a republic that doesn't want saving. Otherwise, evangelism wouldn't hit such terrible soil here in America, and we would be bringing in a harvest of souls into our churches.

 

[church mouse guy]

Does this ruling mean that a Christian organization can now be forced to hire non-Christians?

 

[Steven Yeadon]

Does this ruling mean that a Christian organization can now be forced to hire non-Christians?

Simply put, I believe it will. Any instance where we would exclude a woman or man from a job is against the law by the Federal standard. We now have to treat cross dressers and homosexuals in the same respect for hiring. The LGBTQ community won most of the enchilada today. The man who refused to make a cake for a gay marriage is almost certainly hung out to dry as well in future legislation form the bench.

This wasn't the only terrible ruling today for us though. Important guns rights cases were passed over by the Supreme Court, and a request to review the legality of sanctuary cities was passed over too.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...11d5a4-655b-11ea-acca-80c22bbee96f_story.html

 

[church mouse guy]

Simply put, I believe it will. Any instance where we would exclude a woman or man from a job is against the law by the Federal standard. We now have to treat cross dressers and homosexuals in the same respect for hiring. The LGBTQ community won most of the enchilada today. The man who refused to make a cake for a gay marriage is almost certainly hung out to dry as well in future legislation form the bench.

This wasn't the only terrible ruling today for us though. Important guns rights cases were passed over by the Supreme Court, and a request to review the legality of sanctuary cities was passed over too.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/poli...11d5a4-655b-11ea-acca-80c22bbee96f_story.html

Being forced to hire non-Christians will destroy the church very quickly.

 

[Steven Yeadon]

Being forced to hire non-Christians will destroy the church very quickly.

I looked up more. We can hire on basis of religion as churches. However, we cannot make any hiring decisions based on sex, sex identity, or sex orientation. This is a disaster.

Pre-Employment Inquiries and Religious Affiliation or Beliefs | U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission

Congress will need to pass new laws, the president might make an executive order that will be challenged and annulled if a Dem comes to office, or another Supreme Court case must go in our favor.

The Mainliners are now the government approved way of hiring church employees.

 

[church mouse guy]

The American government is an overpriced sideshow with a vastly bloated cast. The Supreme Court was proven unreliable at the time of the Dred Scott case.

 

[Scott Downey]

What about Christian private schools...imagine a teacher is hired who is hiding their LGBTQ ness, and then reveals themselves and to the students and promote a homosexual lifestyle. Just by being a teacher, they do have influence over children and if allowed to continue then children will think this is approved of or ok. Parents sent their kids to the private christian school so they would be more protected from the influence of the world and be taught according to their own belief system, not that of the homosexual community. they are buying a product, so if the product is defective they have no way of making it right? The school would have to close. Devil gets a win. Devil is a scheming creature just like Paul said.

11 lest Satan should take advantage of us; for we are not ignorant of his devices.

 

[timtofly]

Being forced to hire non-Christians will destroy the church very quickly.

Bad church that gets destroyed quickly. Paul said that all of us used to be in sin. Perhaps churches need to hire people to change them the old fashioned way. Then put the Holy Spirit on trial like Stephen did.

The Supreme Court is the barometer of the state of the body of Christ. Turn the body of Christ around and the Supreme Court will adjust, no matter who sits on the bench. It is the churches fault alone. God puts rulers in government based on what the church does. So the church gets exactly who they deserve, depending on what sin they let control them. Remove all sin and hypocrisy, then get mad at the world. If the body of Christ is only 2%, how can it complain about the other 98%?

 

[KenH]

We Christians in the United States are going to have to assume we are now living in New Testament-era type conditions. Going forward, Christians will, at best, be tolerated by society, at worst, ruined financially, thrown into prison, perhaps even killed.

 

[Scott Downey]

Bad church that gets destroyed quickly. Paul said that all of us used to be in sin. Perhaps churches need to hire people to change them the old fashioned way. Then put the Holy Spirit on trial like Stephen did.

The Supreme Court is the barometer of the state of the body of Christ. Turn the body of Christ around and the Supreme Court will adjust, no matter who sits on the bench. It is the churches fault alone. God puts rulers in government based on what the church does. So the church gets exactly who they deserve, depending on what sin they let control them. Remove all sin and hypocrisy, then get mad at the world. If the body of Christ is only 2%, how can it complain about the other 98%?

No the church is made of people who are converted, you do not invite the world into your church, you certainly dont hire people of the world to work in spiritual matters inside of a church.
At the last verse here, it says Christ added them to the church. Their conviction of the truth came before that, a work that God brought about in the heart, before they were added to the church.

Acts 2
37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Men and brethren, what shall we do?”
38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.”
A Vital Church Grows
40 And with many other words he testified and exhorted them, saying, “Be saved from this perverse generation.” 41 Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them. 42 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in prayers. 43 Then fear came upon every soul, and many wonders and signs were done through the apostles. 44 Now all who believed were together, and had all things in common, 45 and sold their possessions and goods, and divided them among all, as anyone had need.
46 So continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart, 47 praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.

 

[timtofly]

No the church is made of people who are converted, you do not invite the world into your church, you certainly dont hire people of the world to work in spiritual matters inside of a church.
At the last verse here, it says Christ added them to the church. Their conviction of the truth came before that, a work that God brought about in the heart, before they were added to the church.

Acts 2
37 Now when they heard this, they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Men and brethren, what shall we do?”
38 Then Peter said to them, “Repent, and let every one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39 For the promise is to you and to your children, and to all who are afar off, as many as the Lord our God will call.”
A Vital Church Grows
40 And with many other words he testified and exhorted them, saying, “Be saved from this perverse generation.” 41 Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them. 42 And they continued steadfastly in the apostles’ doctrine and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in prayers. 43 Then fear came upon every soul, and many wonders and signs were done through the apostles. 44 Now all who believed were together, and had all things in common, 45 and sold their possessions and goods, and divided them among all, as anyone had need.
46 So continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, they ate their food with gladness and simplicity of heart, 47 praising God and having favor with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily those who were being saved.

It was Jesus who socialized with sinners first though. We just give into our desires, even as the church. That is your problem.

It is no longer in the churches hands, because the church gave in decades ago. The only thing the church can do is repent, humble themselves, pray, and seek God's face. When the world comes back in fury after worrying about covid19, you all will pray for the second wave. But you should have been praying for revival instead. The only way to do that is through repentance and humbling one's own self first. We need to turn from our own wickedness, before the world can turn from theirs. It has been pointed out by Satan himself, that being self righteous blinds one to the truth more than anything. Just ask Job how all that works out.

 

[Scott Downey]

It was Jesus who socialized with sinners first though. We just give into our desires, even as the church. That is your problem.

It is no longer in the churches hands, because the church gave in decades ago. The only thing the church can do is repent, humble themselves, pray, and seek God's face. When the world comes back in fury after worrying about covid19, you all will pray for the second wave. But you should have been praying for revival instead. The only way to do that is through repentance and humbling one's own self first. We need to turn from our own wickedness, before the world can turn from theirs. It has been pointed out by Satan himself, that being self righteous blinds one to the truth more than anything. Just ask Job how all that works out.

Socializing with sinners does not mean accepting them as they are, Christ demands change, being repented, stop sinning, being converted, born again to be acceptable to God.

 

[timtofly]

Socializing with sinners does not mean accepting them as they are, Christ demands change, being repented, stop sinning, being converted, born again to be acceptable to God.

Really???? So Jesus demanded them to repent before He socialized with them?

How can the world repent first? The church has to set the example, not force wrath on the world. Jonah told Nineveh that it would be overthrown in 40 days. That is all he said. He had to repent first though, because he ran from God's will. Jonah did not preach a lengthy sermon on his rights over sinner's rights. Jonah seemed to declare that he knew God would save the whole lot, and it made him mad and angry.

 

[church mouse guy]

Really???? So Jesus demanded them to repent before He socialized with them?

How can the world repent first? The church has to set the example, not force wrath on the world. Jonah told Nineveh that it would be overthrown in 40 days. That is all he said. He had to repent first though, because he ran from God's will. Jonah did not preach a lengthy sermon on his rights over sinner's rights. Jonah seemed to declare that he knew God would save the whole lot, and it made him mad and angry.

I think that you are missing the point. At the present time, religious organizations have a legal right to hire only people who believe their statement of faith and are members of the same church or denomination.

Now the Supreme Court seems to be saying that anyone who says that he has some sort of sex can say that he was discriminated against because he was turned down because he did not agree with the statement of faith.

This is preventing the free exercise of religion. For example, a Christian museum does not want a non-Christian working for them. A non-Christian would be expressing contempt of the museum and their visitors. It would be clear that the worker was only there for the money.

 

[Scott Downey]

Really???? So Jesus demanded them to repent before He socialized with them?

How can the world repent first? The church has to set the example, not force wrath on the world. Jonah told Nineveh that it would be overthrown in 40 days. That is all he said. He had to repent first though, because he ran from God's will. Jonah did not preach a lengthy sermon on his rights over sinner's rights. Jonah seemed to declare that he knew God would save the whole lot, and it made him mad and angry.

Your not reading what I wrote, your putting in an idea I did not say, why are you doing that?

And the destruction at Nineveh was just delayed. 40 years or so later they were destroyed.

Jesus said they would rise at the JUDGEMENT, but see there is a resurrection of the just and then a resurrection of the unjust so what Christ said gives no indication of their salvation. Those who are saved will not be judged at the white throne judgement of God where they are judged by their deeds, saved people Jesus says do not come under judgement but have passed from death into life. So these judgments are not the same, the one is at the seat of Christ for believers, and the one with God the Father is for the world of unbelievers.

John 5:24 New King James Version (NKJV)
24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who hears My word and believes in Him who sent Me has everlasting life, and shall not come into judgment, but has passed from death into life.

 

[Oseas3]

Do you think Evangelicals are in a permanent decline?

Oh yes, they are in total decadence. And as was in Sodom and Gomorrah, now again the wrath of God will fall upon all the nations to the uttermost, and the nations will be destroyed-Revelation 11:v.18. How will be the destruction? How will it be? Have you not perceived and understood yet the consequences of the Coronavirus(COVID 19) in the planet Earth, destroying all kind of structures of the world of Devil? But remember, this is only the beginning of the sorrows. The worse is in the way and will come soon. But he that shall endure unto the END, the same shall be saved. By the way, the END cometh when JESUS delivers up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he to put down all rule, and all authority, and all power, for JESUS must reign, till he has put all enemies under His feet.

Did you already understand the meaning of Daniel 12:v.12? Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. - 45 days after the end of the Abomination of Desolation - after the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

Be ready and be careful. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?

 

[Oseas3]

That said, where is Congress? Laws are made by the Legislature, but in this divided era we expect no big ideas from those who write the law as opposed to interpreting it.

Let's be honest, the Supreme Court is our social conservative football "Hail Mary" play to save a republic that doesn't want saving. Otherwise, evangelism wouldn't hit such terrible soil here in America, and we would be bringing in a harvest of souls into our churches.

2Peter 3:v.7 and 10-13

7 The heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same Word are kept in store -the Word is God -, reserved unto FIRE - God, the Word, is a devouring FIRE - against the Day of Judgment and perdition of ungodly men.

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the WORKS that are therein shall be burned up. - as was in Sodom and Gomorrah, understand? -

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be DISSOLVED -dissolved as an implosion-, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of this Day of God -the Lord's Day-, wherein the heavens -the Old and the New Testaments - being on FIRE shall be DISSOLVED, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens -the third heaven for 1000 years, after the millennium will be established the heaven of the heavens- and a new earth - new Israel -, wherein dwelleth righteousness.