Repentance

[DHK]

First off the Greek has nothing to do with it as it reads like it is translated. You are incorrect to imply that the Greek means something other then what it says in the English. Again you simply cannot accept what the bible says. That is so sad.

You are acting like the extreme KJVO person who says the KJV corrects the Greek and Hebrew. Is that your position? If not, one must go the original language to find out what a seemingly impossible verse means. This is why your theology makes no sense, and why you are confused.

In the Matt. passage you gave the Lord does not say keeping the commandments makes one perfect. Why do you add to the scriptures? he says be perfect like your heavenly Father. It is not about what we do, but about being perfect.

I never said one thing about keeping the law. Why are you adding to my words? Jesus commanded: "Be perfect!!" Then he qualified it even further: "Even as my Father is perfect." He didn't mention the law. He said you must be at a level of perfection just as my Father (God) is. Are you there yet? Or what does that verse really mean?

Jesus was speaking to a people who thought because they had been given the law, were God's chosen, and Abrahams children, that they had a direct shot into heaven. In fact some of the rabbi's taught that no Jew would ever go to hell even if he did not believe in God because God had stationed someone at the gates of hell to snatch that Jew and toss him into heaven at the last moment.

What is the context?
And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him: (Matthew 5:1)
--This is the beginning of the Sermon of the Mount. The message is first and foremost to the disciples. There were multitudes that gathered as he spoke. It is doubtful that there were any Pharisees were there at all. He was speaking: first to the disciples, and secondly to the common folk. The Pharisees were not his target audience at all. You have it all wrong. In fact this was spoken shortly after the "beatitudes" were given, something he hardly would give the Pharisees. He was teaching his disciples. He was giving them this standard. Be perfect.

Peter refers to in the context of holiness:
Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy. (1 Peter 1:16)
--Are you as holy as God?

The Lord is trying to overcome their false beliefs. He has just given some really new information to them on the sermon on the mount, at least new in regards to what the Pharisees were teaching, as He was tearing down their self righteousness. Now the Lord puts the final nail in the coffin when He says;

Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Who says the Pharisees were there? His message was to his disciples.

You say he does not mean that, but scripture says he does so who should we believe? By the way He meant it. That is the only way in. We have to be as perfect as God!

Are you as perfect as God? Give an honest answer please.

However the Jew at this point like you thought He was speaking about the law. He was not. What should have happened at this time is for them to cry out with “how then can we be saved?” They knew they were not perfect like the heavenly Father.

And they never would be. No one could be; not even the disciples.

If they had asked He would have told them how to be perfect like their heavenly Father. They never learned how because they did not ask.

That is not true. His disciples did not ask either. How do you explain that. His disciples understood what he meant because Jesus was not speaking in Elizabethan English to them.

However even though you have not asked let me explain it. Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. Simple huh. We are made as perfect like our heavenly Father by faith. Again Jesus meant what He said! You must be perfect like your heavenly Father to get into heaven.

You still have a carnal nature. So you aren't perfect. Since he was speaking to his disciples, they were already saved. So it is not speaking of salvation. Peter wasn't perfect. He denied his Lord three times. How do you explain that?

So yes the Lord did mean what He said, but like the Jew you missed the point because you apply it improperly.

You miss it because you act like a KJVO, putting the English above the Greek.

Now about 1john 3:9 it also means what it says except this time in the Greek there is a little different meaning then how the English comes across. That is the reason for the brackets with the word (practice) every time I post on it. So like I said, you simply so not believe what the written word says. If you did you would stop contradicting the word of God and let it mean what it says.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit (practice) sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot (practice) sin, because he is born of God.

If you truly believe what you say, you would have no problem answering my post that I have asked you to answer an innumerable number of times.
Do you ever practice sin? Yes or no. Think carefully before you answer, and think of what others have told you on this thread.

 

[freeatlast]

You are acting like the extreme KJVO person who says the KJV corrects the Greek and Hebrew. Is that your position? If not, one must go the original language to find out what a seemingly impossible verse means. This is why your theology makes no sense, and why you are confused.

I never said one thing about keeping the law. Why are you adding to my words? Jesus commanded: "Be perfect!!" Then he qualified it even further: "Even as my Father is perfect." He didn't mention the law. He said you must be at a level of perfection just as my Father (God) is. Are you there yet? Or what does that verse really mean?

What is the context?
And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him: (Matthew 5:1)
--This is the beginning of the Sermon of the Mount. The message is first and foremost to the disciples. There were multitudes that gathered as he spoke. It is doubtful that there were any Pharisees were there at all. He was speaking: first to the disciples, and secondly to the common folk. The Pharisees were not his target audience at all. You have it all wrong. In fact this was spoken shortly after the "beatitudes" were given, something he hardly would give the Pharisees. He was teaching his disciples. He was giving them this standard. Be perfect.

Peter refers to in the context of holiness:
Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy. (1 Peter 1:16)
--Are you as holy as God?

Who says the Pharisees were there? His message was to his disciples.

Are you as perfect as God? Give an honest answer please.

And they never would be. No one could be; not even the disciples.

That is not true. His disciples did not ask either. How do you explain that. His disciples understood what he meant because Jesus was not speaking in Elizabethan English to them.

You still have a carnal nature. So you aren't perfect. Since he was speaking to his disciples, they were already saved. So it is not speaking of salvation. Peter wasn't perfect. He denied his Lord three times. How do you explain that?

You miss it because you act like a KJVO, putting the English above the Greek.

If you truly believe what you say, you would have no problem answering my post that I have asked you to answer an innumerable number of times.
Do you ever practice sin? Yes or no. Think carefully before you answer, and think of what others have told you on this thread.

Use the search feature for all my posts and you will see the answer, but again you are trying to twist and slander. I asked you what name is put on someone like that? You know full well what I have posted in the past on the very question you ask again. So for me scripture means what it says and for you it means what you say.

 

[freeatlast]

edited, double post

 

[DHK]

Use the search feature for all my posts and you will see the answer, but again you are trying to twist and slander. I asked you what name is put on someone like that? You know full well what I have posted in the past on the very question you ask again. So for me scripture means what it says and for you it means what you say.

I don't use search features in a debate. I expect you to answer for yourself. Your reluctance to do so shows you practice a sin of obstinacy in this matter. Others have pointed this out. I answered your question. You were supposed to answer mine. You refused. Your refusal to do so (like keeping your side of a bargain) is akin to practicing sin. Is that not playing the part of hypocrite? That is a question for you to answer not an accusation. You figure it out.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Past page limit and shifting into "version" style discussion. So unless someone wants to start a new thread TOTALLY UNIQUE (not "repentance II, the sequel), we will stop it all here.