Requirement For Fellowship

[Hark]

1 Corinthians 1:9 God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord. 10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. KJV

We all are to speak the same thing in order to hold to the same judgment.

1 Corinthians 2:1And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God. 2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified. KJV

We all are to declare the testimony of God only in regards to Jesus Christ & Him crucified.

John 8:30 As he spake these words, many believed on him. 31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; 32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. KJV

John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. KJV

How we follow Him as His disciples is why it is important to speak the same thing & hold to the same judgment as an assembly.

1 Corinthians 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. KJV

We are all to speak of having only one baptism of the Holy Ghost at our salvation when we had received the love of the truth at the calling of the gospel. That means one drink of the one Spirit which can only happen at our salvation moment because of the Good News to hold fast to and no other calling.

2 Thessalonians 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: 14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle. KJV



John 14:21 He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him. KJV

Agree? Click "agree" at the bottom right of the post if you agree.

Next post; What happens when we are not all speaking the same thing nor holding to the same judgment?

 

[Hark]

What happens when we are not all speaking the same thing nor holding to the same judgment?

1 Corinthians 11:7 Now in this that I declare unto you I praise you not, that ye come together not for the better, but for the worse. 18 For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. 19 For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you. KJV

1 John 1:6 If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth: KJV

Ephesians 5:8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: 9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth 10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. 11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. 12 For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret. KJV

Why is it important? Jesus says why.

Matthew 18:10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. 11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. 12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? 13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. 14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. 15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. 17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican. KJV

So correction is needed and if unrepentant before the entire assembly, excommunicated until he or she does repent. Otherwise the Lord will get that lost sheep sooner or later on earth, even if it means leaving them behind at the rapture event.

Note the reason why Paul applied excommunication to perform.

1 Corinthians 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. KJV

Now note what fellowship is required in not eating with those astray because that is how it will be at the Marriage Supper table in Heaven.

1 Corinthians 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. 9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators: 10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world. 11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. KJV

Since that is why the church is to do this & if the church do not do this, Christ will for the Marriage Supper to all those that have gone astray.

Proof that those that have gone astray are still brothers & thus still saved.

2 Thessalonians 3:1 Finally, brethren, pray for us, that the word of the Lord may have free course, and be glorified, even as it is with you: 2 And that we may be delivered from unreasonable and wicked men: for all men have not faith. 3 But the Lord is faithful, who shall stablish you, and keep you from evil. 4 And we have confidence in the Lord touching you, that ye both do and will do the things which we command you. 5 And the Lord direct your hearts into the love of God, and into the patient waiting for Christ. 6 Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye withdraw yourselves from every brother that walketh disorderly, and not after the tradition which he received of us. 7 For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you;........... 14 And if any man obey not our word by this epistle, note that man, and have no company with him, that he may be ashamed. 15 Yet count him not as an enemy, but admonish him as a brother.

 

[AustinC]

Hark, all you did was pluck sentences from different places.

What is your actual assertion? Since you plucked sentences, can you make your assertion in one sentence?

 

[Hark]

Hark, all you did was pluck sentences from different places.

What is your actual assertion? Since you plucked sentences, can you make your assertion in one sentence?

It all pertains to the requirement for fellowship as the church should judge by because that is how Jesus will judge His Church when He comes as the Bridegroom at the pre great tribulation rapture event.

However, if all that segueing to that conclusion is amiss still, due to all those assertations leading up to that conclusion, feel free to quote any sentence that you believe you need clarification on, and God be willing, I shall be still around to give that clarification for you. If not, ask Him. He knows where I am coming from in what I am sharing with by His grace & by His help.

 

[Baptist Believer]

1 Corinthians 2:1And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God. 2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified. KJV

We all are to declare the testimony of God only in regards to Jesus Christ & Him crucified.

This is blatantly false. You have taken something specific Paul said to the church body in Corinth and made it a universal mandate that contradicts the clear and broader teaching of Jesus to make disciples.

“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. Therefore, as you go, make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to follow all that I commanded you; and behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” - Matthew 28:18-20

 

[AustinC]

It all pertains to the requirement for fellowship as the church should judge by because that is how Jesus will judge His Church when He comes as the Bridegroom at the pre great tribulation rapture event.

However, if all that segueing to that conclusion is amiss still, due to all those assertations leading up to that conclusion, feel free to quote any sentence that you believe you need clarification on, and God be willing, I shall be still around to give that clarification for you. If not, ask Him. He knows where I am coming from in what I am sharing with by His grace & by His help.

I truly wish you weren't a legalist, bound under the law, but instead understood the amazing grace of God. You keep attempting to separate what God has united.

Galatians 3:28-29

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.

Colossians 3:11

Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but Christ is all, and in all.

Romans 8:1,37-39

There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

 

[Hark]

This is blatantly false. You have taken something specific Paul said to the church body in Corinth and made it a universal mandate that contradicts the clear and broader teaching of Jesus to make disciples.

If you note the bolden latter part of the first verse in regards to that testimony of God being about Jesus Christ & Him crucified. You even quoted my saying which is to that truth in how we are disciples of Jesus Christ in testifying of Him in seeking His glory so it is not deliberately false but deliberately true.

There are other doctrines in relation to the Good News of Jesus Christ, but the testimony of God for how God is glorified by is Jesus Christ, the Son of God for why His name is above every other name to the glory of God the Father as that IS the mind of Christ we are to have in worship.

John 13:31 Therefore, when he was gone out, Jesus said, Now is the Son of man glorified, and God is glorified in him. 32 If God be glorified in him, God shall also glorify him in himself, and shall straightway glorify him.

Philippians 2:5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: 6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: 7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: 8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. 9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

This is how God the Father is glorified & honored by ONLY glorifying & honoring the Son in worship as His name is above every other name for how God the Father is glorified by; not.. "Trinity" as if that is His name and not the Person Called the Holy Spirit, but the name of His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ..

“All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to Me. Therefore, as you go, make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to follow all that I commanded you; and behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” - Matthew 28:18-20

And yet in practice & application according to the Book of Acts, they were all water baptized in the name of Jesus Christ because they are to testify of Him as the Holy Spirit does thru us ( John 15:26-27 ) to seek to glorify Him as the Holy Spirit does ( John 16:14 ).

And since Jesus is speaking for which all power is given unto Him as He is the Head of the Church, the Good Shepherd & Bridegroom, then you may understand what a disciple of Jesus Christ is by Whom they serve & seek to glorify as the Good News to man aka the gospel of Jesus Christ.

We are not know as the disciples of the Trinity or the disciples of the Holy Spirit but disciples of Jesus Christ for by Him, we are doing the will of the Father by the grace of God as led by scripture & the indwelling Holy Spirit to do.

You do not have any scripture refuting this to be in any other way as any other way is a thief; John 10:1 & John 14:6

 

[Hark]

I truly wish you weren't a legalist, bound under the law, but instead understood the amazing grace of God. You keep attempting to separate what God has united.

Galatians 3:28-29

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.

Colossians 3:11

Here there is not Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free; but Christ is all, and in all.

Romans 8:1,37-39

There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

I understand where you are coming from but those scripture run against the truth in scripture in whatever Bible version you are using so that proves you are not rightly dividing the word of truth.

Indeed, take the whole verse of Romans 8:1 & not cut off the latter part.

Romans 8:1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. KJV

Which is to say what exactly? That those who are saved but walk after the flesh, there will be condemnation.

How does that apply to Galatians 3:28-29 & Colossians 3:11 more precisely? Note how those that break even the least of His commandments and teach others so are called least in the kingdom of Heaven.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. KJV

BUT when or what separates the least from the great? When God judges His House first at the pre great tribulation rapture event per 1 Peter 4:17-19 where we can trust the Lord to keep the souls of His saints left behind to suffer the fiery calamity coming on the earth & the following great tribulation as a result.

Indeed, Jesus warned in verse 6 of Luke 15:1-8 on how a disciples can be cut off for not abiding in Him & His words as His disciple. Jesus warned again when this cut off will be as it is the rapture event in Luke 12:40-49 He told the apostle John in Revelation 2:18-25 that He will cast that church into the bed of the great tribulation unless they repent of their spiritual fornication. Those saints resurrected as coming out of the great tribulation are the leasts in the kingdom of Heaven. This is where the vessels unto dishonor comes from that are still in His House for not departing from iniquity per 2 Timothy 2:18-21.

For you to refute this, you have to rightly divide the word of truth but I am addressing your references in relations to other scripture for how they align up together still whereas how you are applying it to mean that there is no separation when there is, but still in His kingdom of Heaven & still in His House.

 

[AustinC]

I understand where you are coming from but those scripture run against the truth in scripture in whatever Bible version you are using so that proves you are not rightly dividing the word of truth.

Indeed, take the whole verse of Romans 8:1 & not cut off the latter part.

Romans 8:1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. KJV

Which is to say what exactly? That those who are saved but walk after the flesh, there will be condemnation.

How does that apply to Galatians 3:28-29 & Colossians 3:11 more precisely? Note how those that break even the least of His commandments and teach others so are called least in the kingdom of Heaven.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. KJV

BUT when or what separates the least from the great? When God judges His House first at the pre great tribulation rapture event per 1 Peter 4:17-19 where we can trust the Lord to keep the souls of His saints left behind to suffer the fiery calamity coming on the earth & the following great tribulation as a result.

Indeed, Jesus warned in verse 6 of Luke 15:1-8 on how a disciples can be cut off for not abiding in Him & His words as His disciple. Jesus warned again when this cut off will be as it is the rapture event in Luke 12:40-49 He told the apostle John in Revelation 2:18-25 that He will cast that church into the bed of the great tribulation unless they repent of their spiritual fornication. Those saints resurrected as coming out of the great tribulation are the leasts in the kingdom of Heaven. This is where the vessels unto dishonor comes from that are still in His House for not departing from iniquity per 2 Timothy 2:18-21.

For you to refute this, you have to rightly divide the word of truth but I am addressing your references in relations to other scripture for how they align up together still whereas how you are applying it to mean that there is no separation when there is, but still in His kingdom of Heaven & still in His House.

You misunderstand the next section in Romans 8. Therefore, you heap a burden upon the adopted child of God that God does not give.
You reveal yourself as a neo-Judaizer, whom the body of Christ should consider a wolf in its midst.

 

[Baptist Believer]

You are lifting verses out of context and placing them in a certain order to justify your positions, but you do not seem familiar with the whole message of scripture, especially, the New Testament in context.

You argue and present information like a Jehovah's Witness. Have you been reading their materials or are you currently studying as a Jehovah's Witness?

Also, I noticed that you are not a member of a church, claiming that "Promise Keepers" has infiltrated your local Baptist churches, and make a surprising (and nearly unbelievable) claim that some Baptist churches in your area insist that water baptism is necessary for salvation. Whatever that is, it is not a Baptist church.

Since you are not in fellowship with a church, you are violating the instruction not to forsake assembling with other believers. You will never find a church where you agree with everything (I'm not sure why that would even be a good thing), so I strongly urge you to find a church that does not demand that you believe exactly the way you do and become a student of the scripture in fellowship with other people with different perspectives and insights. You will become a better expositor of the scriptures and will engage in the transforming work of Christ as part of a spiritual body. It is nearly impossible to do that virtually, or alone, and can only be successful if God gives you a special grace to do it because of circumstances beyond your control (in solitary confinement in prison, marooned on a deserted island, etc.). Otherwise, you are in rebellion against God.

If you note the bolden latter part of the first verse in regards to that testimony of God being about Jesus Christ & Him crucified. You even quoted my saying which is to that truth in how we are disciples of Jesus Christ in testifying of Him in seeking His glory so it is not deliberately false but deliberately true.

No, still false.

There are other doctrines in relation to the Good News of Jesus Christ, but the testimony of God for how God is glorified by is Jesus Christ, the Son of God for why His name is above every other name to the glory of God the Father as that IS the mind of Christ we are to have in worship.

You are called to be a disciple and to make disciples. Worship is only part of the equation.

This is how God the Father is glorified & honored by ONLY glorifying & honoring the Son in worship...

False, worship is only a PART of Christian discipleship, not the "ONLY" aspect of it.

...as His name is above every other name for how God the Father is glorified by; not.. "Trinity" as if that is His name and not the Person Called the Holy Spirit, but the name of His Son, the Lord Jesus Christ..

Do you believe in the Triune nature of God? A yes or no is sufficient.

And yet in practice & application according to the Book of Acts, they were all water baptized in the name of Jesus Christ because they are to testify of Him as the Holy Spirit does thru us ( John 15:26-27 ) to seek to glorify Him as the Holy Spirit does ( John 16:14 ).

Jesus plainly taught that His disciples should baptize in the name (actually, the authority of) the Father, Son and Holy Spirit (Matthew 28:19). Was Jesus wrong? Of course not. The baptism formula is not a magical incantation, but an expression of authority. The Father, Son, and Spirit all have authority, for they are the indivisible Triune Godhead. Baptizing in the name of Jesus is exactly the same thing.

And since Jesus is speaking for which all power is given unto Him as He is the Head of the Church, the Good Shepherd & Bridegroom, then you may understand what a disciple of Jesus Christ is by Whom they serve & seek to glorify as the Good News to man aka the gospel of Jesus Christ.

The gospel of Christ is the present availability of the Kingdom of God to everyone. The Kingdom is explained and taught from Genesis through Revelation. The most basic gospel message is "Repent, for the Kingdom of God is at hand."

We are not know as the disciples of the Trinity or the disciples of the Holy Spirit...

It really sounds like you do not accept the biblical doctrine of the Triune nature of God. The Father, Son (aka Jesus), and Spirit are of one nature, but each distinct Persons. This can be seen through a careful reading of the New Testament. If you need assistance with that, I can help.

...but disciples of Jesus Christ for by Him, we are doing the will of the Father by the grace of God as led by scripture & the indwelling Holy Spirit to do.

Yet even if the 'name' of Jesus is not specifically known, one can be a disciple and enter into the Kingdom of God. Abraham is the obvious example that Paul used in both Galatians and Romans to illustrate that truth.

You do not have any scripture refuting this...

Sure I do -- far too much to put into a post. You seem to have some basic doctrinal issues that need to be explored before you try to teach others.

...to be in any other way as any other way is a thief; John 10:1 & John 14:6

Nope. You are misusing scripture.

 

[Hark]

You misunderstand the next section in Romans 8. Therefore, you heap a burden upon the adopted child of God that God does not give.
You reveal yourself as a neo-Judaizer, whom the body of Christ should consider a wolf in its midst.

It is on you to prove that I misunderstood the next section in Romans 8, vague as that is by your comment.

Kind of hard for you to condemn me as such until you prove I was not rightly dividing the word of truth. I shall not judge you as such since we are called to minister & that includes correcting by the word of God in the hopes God will cause the increase.

Look at what Paul has written;

Romans 8:1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

He goes on to warn.. in regards to going after the flesh..

Romans 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

There is no point to saying that to believers unless it is possible for them to go astray. Peter warned the same thing.

2 Peter 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error. 19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. 20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. 21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. 22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Ties in with Paul's warning to the Galatians..

Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. 8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. 9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.

Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. KJV

So no loss of salvation, but loss of first inheritance like Esau did in giving up his birth right for a morsel or meal. Same goes for the prodigal son in giving up his inheritance for wild living; he can never get it back, but he is still son.

That is why we are to take heed for what we build on that foundation to not defile the Temple of God thus ourselves. Those who get left behind to incur physical death, their spirit are still saved regardless per verse 15 of 1 Corinthians 3:10-17

Now is the time to call on Jesus to help deliver us from our sins by helping us lay aside every weight & sin daily Hebrews 12:1-2 that has us walking in darkness ( 1 John 1:6 ) so we can walk in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son..1 John 1:3-9

 

[AustinC]

It is on you to prove that I misunderstood the next section in Romans 8, vague as that is by your comment.

Kind of hard for you to condemn me as such until you prove I was not rightly dividing the word of truth. I shall not judge you as such since we are called to minister & that includes correcting by the word of God in the hopes God will cause the increase.

Look at what Paul has written;

Romans 8:1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

He goes on to warn.. in regards to going after the flesh..

Romans 8:5 For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

There is no point to saying that to believers unless it is possible for them to go astray. Peter warned the same thing.

2 Peter 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error. 19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage. 20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. 21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. 22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Ties in with Paul's warning to the Galatians..

Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. 8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. 9 And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.

Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. KJV

So no loss of salvation, but loss of first inheritance like Esau did in giving up his birth right for a morsel or meal. Same goes for the prodigal son in giving up his inheritance for wild living; he can never get it back, but he is still son.

That is why we are to take heed for what we build on that foundation to not defile the Temple of God thus ourselves. Those who get left behind to incur physical death, their spirit are still saved regardless per verse 15 of 1 Corinthians 3:10-17

Now is the time to call on Jesus to help deliver us from our sins by helping us lay aside every weight & sin daily Hebrews 12:1-2 that has us walking in darkness ( 1 John 1:6 ) so we can walk in the light in fellowship with the Father & the Son..1 John 1:3-9

Sigh, it's not on me to have you abandon your law-based doctrine. Ultimately, I cannot persuade you when you are intent on abusing the Bible to prop up false doctrine. I instead commit you to the rebuke of our King.

 

[Hark]

You are lifting verses out of context and placing them in a certain order to justify your positions, but you do not seem familiar with the whole message of scripture, especially, the New Testament in context.

I see no evidence or reproof by the scripture in showing this. Just saying it so does not make it so.

You argue and present information like a Jehovah's Witness. Have you been reading their materials or are you currently studying as a Jehovah's Witness?

To wit again, where is the evidence to suggest such a thing? BTW I am not Jehovah's Witnesses.

Also, I noticed that you are not a member of a church, claiming that "Promise Keepers" has infiltrated your local Baptist churches, and make a surprising (and nearly unbelievable) claim that some Baptist churches in your area insist that water baptism is necessary for salvation. Whatever that is, it is not a Baptist church.

I was a member of the Covenant Presbyterian Church before I had resigned my membership because of how they made anyone joining the office of deacons or elders to make a promise which they should be relying on God for.

Made a letter to every church in the phone book to warn about Promise Keepers 7 no Baptist church responded nor rose up to warn others against Promise Keepers..

Even attended a Baptist church eventually, but no. The reason I am Baptist is because I align with the Baptist faith; at least the one as I understand it to be separate from the church called out of the Catholic Church as it has always been separate.

My inference to pointing out that I do not believe water baptism is necessary for salvation but it is an ordinance to follow as His disciples is not referring to any Baptist church in the area but what I have encountered online in Christian forums from those claiming to be Baptists And no, I did not encounter any Baptist saying that in this forum yet unless I had in the past & I just cannot recall right now.

Since you are not in fellowship with a church, you are violating the instruction not to forsake assembling with other believers. You will never find a church where you agree with everything (I'm not sure why that would even be a good thing), so I strongly urge you to find a church that does not demand that you believe exactly the way you do and become a student of the scripture in fellowship with other people with different perspectives and insights. You will become a better expositor of the scriptures and will engage in the transforming work of Christ as part of a spiritual body. It is nearly impossible to do that virtually, or alone, and can only be successful if God gives you a special grace to do it because of circumstances beyond your control (in solitary confinement in prison, marooned on a deserted island, etc.). Otherwise, you are in rebellion against God.

You have to be a member to be heard; and it has to be done at a proper time, and when it is at that proper time, it has to be agreed upon by the leaders as something worthy of their time to discuss. Was a member & I saw how that played out.

They were even going to address Freemasonry in church until they found out how many members were Freemasons. They swept the concern for the body of Christ under the rug. So far they have not preached anything that led Masons to repentance.

So when do you apply this or do you do this at all?

2 Corinthians 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? 15 And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? 16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you. 18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

No, still false.

What is false? What is true? Where is the evidence? Where is the correction?

 

[Hark]

You are called to be a disciple and to make disciples. Worship is only part of the equation.

By God's grace & His help. The burden is on Him.

False, worship is only a PART of Christian discipleship, not the "ONLY" aspect of it.

ONLY is applied to the worship of the Son in worship not worship itself. That is how the Father wats to be worshipped.

Do you believe in the Triune nature of God? A yes or no is sufficient.

Yes, but it is not sufficient to what we are talking about. Kind of like a lawyer not allowing to answer a question other than in a yes or no answer thus preventing the whole truth in regards to that issue.

Did the Father & the Holy Spirit also had died on the cross? No. But this argument of I cannot separate the Triune God is short-sided in that regard.

Can the Father & the Holy Spirit also be the Mediator between God & men? No. 1 Timothy 2:5

Can the father & the Holy Spirit also be the Head of the Church? No. Jesus is singled out to be that Head as He will be presenting the body of Christ to God the Father. Only Christ can do this.

1 Peter 3:18For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

Whose will is to be done? The Father's. Not the will of the Son & not the will of the Holy Ghost for they are both in agreement with the will of the Father.

What is the role of the Holy Spirit in leading us to do the same? To testify of the son ( John 15:26-27 ) to glorify the Son ( John 16:13-14 ) so how can the Holy Spirit lead us in any other way in outreach ministry which also includes worship?

Jesus plainly taught that His disciples should baptize in the name (actually, the authority of) the Father, Son and Holy Spirit (Matthew 28:19). Was Jesus wrong? Of course not. The baptism formula is not a magical incantation, but an expression of authority. The Father, Son, and Spirit all have authority, for they are the indivisible Triune Godhead. Baptizing in the name of Jesus is exactly the same thing.

Matthew 28:19 has the name of the Father, the son, and the Holy Ghost as Jesus Christ as that is the name to call upon to be save and that is the water baptism done in His name in practice as the Book of Acts declare. It is an assumption that water baptism is to be read as in the name of the Father & the son & the holy Ghost when the name of Jesus Christ is the name of God to call upon to be saved & the name by how God the father is glorified in worship by per Philippians 2:5-11.

The gospel of Christ is the present availability of the Kingdom of God to everyone. The Kingdom is explained and taught from Genesis through Revelation. The most basic gospel message is "Repent, for the Kingdom of God is at hand."

No dispute there unless you apply that as by the gospel of Christ hence the son of God.

It really sounds like you do not accept the biblical doctrine of the Triune nature of God. The Father, Son (aka Jesus), and Spirit are of one nature, but each distinct Persons. This can be seen through a careful reading of the New Testament. If you need assistance with that, I can help.

I fully understand that, but each distinct Person as you say have each distinctive roles and they do not all share the same roles and God the Father is only glorified in His Son. The glory of God rests on His son, the Lod Jesus Christ. Scripture are to testify of Him as the Holy Spirit in us does as we are to as led by the Holy Spirit so sinners come to the Son for life and keep coming to the Son in coming to God the Father by in order to avoid the spirits of the antichrist that would seduce them to chase after them to receive for a sign..

 

[Hark]

Yet even if the 'name' of Jesus is not specifically known, one can be a disciple and enter into the Kingdom of God. Abraham is the obvious example that Paul used in both Galatians and Romans to illustrate that truth.

There is an oversight there. Abraham had not received the promise yet when Jesus was on earth.

Hebrews 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. 14 For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country. 15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned. 16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

1 Samuel 28:6-20 has the spirit of Samuel brought up from beneath the earth for where Abraham's bosom aka Paradise was at.

That was why Jesus said the parable of the rich man & Lazarus as Abraham's bosom aka Paradise was not up in Heaven yet. Luke 16:19-31.

He told the thief that he would be with Him in Paradise that day. Luke 23:43 He descended after His death for that purpose of preaching to those in prison ( 1 Peter 3:18-19 ) so that He may bring them to God. Ephesians 4:7-10

They were resurrected after His resurrection; Matthew 27:52-53 where now after His ascension, Paradise is in Heaven. 2 Corinthians 12;2-4 of which I believe Paul was speaking about the apostle John & the Book of Revelation where in that Book of Revelation, Jesus has the keys of hell & death. Revelation 1:17-18

So after His ascension, Abraham & O.T. saints are with God but still awaiting the Marriage Supper of the Lamb when Jesus is done preparing the places for the firstfruits of the resurrection.

Sure I do -- far too much to put into a post. You seem to have some basic doctrinal issues that need to be explored before you try to teach others.

By the grace of God & His help is how & why I am teaching others. I give thanks to the Father in Jesus's name for this.

Nope. You are misusing scripture.

I leave that to God to show you by the scripture shared and once again, you need to apply scripture to show how scripture is being misused. Otherwise how can I see my error?

 

[Hark]

Sigh, it's not on me to have you abandon your law-based doctrine. Ultimately, I cannot persuade you when you are intent on abusing the Bible to prop up false doctrine. I instead commit you to the rebuke of our King.

Here is the rebuke from your King for not correcting me from scripture, but doling out judgment without scripture.

John 21:15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs. 16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep. 17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep. KJV

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Matthew 18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. 12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? 13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. 14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. 15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. 17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

2 Timothy 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

You can only prove false teaching by scripture.

 

[AustinC]

Here is the rebuke from your King for not correcting me from scripture, but doling out judgment without scripture.

John 21:15 So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs. 16 He saith to him again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep. 17 He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep. KJV

Matthew 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth. 19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

Matthew 18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. 12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? 13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. 14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. 15 Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother. 16 But if he will not hear thee, then take with thee one or two more, that in the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established. 17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell it unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

2 Timothy 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

You can only prove false teaching by scripture.

You chop up scripture as if it were tossed salad. Moreso, you don't even know what you are tossing in the salad. You just pluck random things, out of context, and then make a claim. Such abuse of scripture is unwise and creates false doctrines.
If you wish to fall back to the law after being saved by grace, there is nothing left for you.
This is my last post.

 

[Hark]

You chop up scripture as if it were tossed salad. Moreso, you don't even know what you are tossing in the salad. You just pluck random things, out of context, and then make a claim. Such abuse of scripture is unwise and creates false doctrines.
If you wish to fall back to the law after being saved by grace, there is nothing left for you.
This is my last post.

If any believer thinks they can use God grace to live in sin, better think again. That is why Jesus came, not just to give us eternal life but help us to follow Him as we can only live this reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ. When we look to Jesus Christ daily to help us lay aside every weight & sin, that is what discipleship & running that race is all about. Hebrews 12:1-2

Christians Living in Unrepentant Sin(s)

 

[Salty]

Hark - l have posted this before - so I will repeat myself.
The longer your posts - the less of a chance I will read it.
(BTW - I am saying this as a poster - not an admin)

 

[Hark]

Hark - l have posted this before - so I will repeat myself.
The longer your posts - the less of a chance I will read it.

How long a post do you read? Do you go by how many lines in a post?

I did try to break it up in smaller posts.

Also, since threads are featured & can be found on search engines on the internet to draw people here, I am not sure visitors will know they can click on the blue scriptural reference to see the scripture in the KJV & know to hit the back button on their Window to get back to the post to read.

But I do try to keep the post average & leave it to God for them to continue reading the other posts.

(BTW - I am saying this as a poster - not an admin)

Thank you for posting that to assure me that I am not in trouble.

Can you describe the length of an appropriate post and do you consider a series of small post in a thread as a long post or not?