Featured Salvation: God's Choice, Man's Choice, Both Choose?

See there you go in Denial again.

Not only can you not admit you falsely accused me, But now you will not answer my question.

You missed my whole point

first comment, Your wrong, Romans 1 does not state they reject God BASED on his revelation.
It says they have NO EXCUSE based on revelation.

secondly,

If your in denial of God, If your making up your own God. or if you are in denial that you are condemned by what you know

the HS can come all he wants. You will never respond

Which was my point to begin with.

 

Thanks for the conversation

peace to you

 

Here is what the Bible says in Romans 1. Note that it doesn't say what you claim it says.

Romans 1:18-25

For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth. For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse. For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things. Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

 

Calvinism is once again defended by making false charges. Salvation does not depend upon the person who wills or does things to be saved, but upon God alone. Romans 9:16

 

Sorry Bro. But romans 1 says exactly what I have been saying.

Nice try though

19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse,


28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful; 32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

 

kyredneck

Believing on Christ is the Gift of Gods Grace Phil 1:29

29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

Acts 18:27

27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:

 

You wrote: "Romans 1 does not state they reject God BASED on his revelation.
It says they have NO EXCUSE based on revelation."

You conveniently ignored what comes before your quote of Romans 1. What's up with that?

"who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth."

That is "rejection based upon God's revelation." Therefore, they have no excuse.

Why are you working so hard to tell us that man is basically good and that at man's core he doesn't reject God? There is no scripture that would agree with such a stance, yet you are making the assertion and thus forcing the idea that man somehow chooses God when he observes nature...except for all those who don't.

What good do you think natural man has that can lead him to God without God being gracious?

 

But, he does want it both ways.
He wants God to quicken, but then we are walking in a state of limbo until and unless God credits our lifetime work of faith as righteousness. If we fail to tip the scales in our faith, then credit is withheld and we lose.
Van wants the beginning to be God's work, but the middle is mans exercising of faith, which brings us to the end where, if we didn't exercise faith enough, God doesn't credit our faith as righteous, but if we do exercise our faith enough then God credits our faith as righteous. It's at the end where the scales determine if we are or are not saved.

 

It is God who solely does the saving and the keeping of of whom He saves.

 

Still denying Pauline Justification Van is

 

So why do you post that God credits our faith on the basis of what he sees us deciding to do, not based upon what he decided to do then?

 

Calvinism tries to have it both ways, first whatsoever comes to pass is predestined (ordained) and God is not therefore the author of sin

OTOH, Salvation does not depend upon the person who wills or does things to be saved, but upon God alone. Romans 9:16.
That is not two ways, but the one and only way salvation occurs, by God's action alone.

 

Yet another false claim, another false charge, and another post that contains no quote. Why this troll like behavior is tolerated is mind boggling.

Does Romans 4:4-5 and Romans 4:23-24 say God credits our faith as righteousness for our benefit? Yes. Does John 3:16 say everyone believing into Him shall not perish but have everlasting life? Yes

Only those pretending to believe God saves those who reject Christ and His gospel deny God credits (or not) our faith. 2 Thessalonians 2:13 says we are chosen through faith in the truth. Calvinism says we were individually chosen then compelled by irresistible faith to believe. One view is biblical, the other is unbiblical nonsense, a relic from the dark ages.

 

yes it is. God alone has the authority to save anyone. God alone has the power and authority to devise the plan to redeem His creation. In His design, plan, and purpose He alone chose to have man respond to His free offer of salvation. Without God's plan to do that man would never be able to do that.

When man responds, his response is not somehow meritorious. It has no value in the power and work of God. It is simply man reaching out and accepting the free gift. Do we also accuse someone who receives a birthday gift by taking it and opening it up of have taken part in giving themselves the gift as well? If we do not then it is inconsistent to do any differently with salvation.

Is God not sovereign after we are saved? Does he choose to minimize His sovereignty in our lives once we are born again? Since I do not believe in the reformed soteriology has God failed in His sovereignty to lead me to right and proper doctrine?

 

Yep, And I proved it with 2 posts now. Your still going to argue?

yes. You suppressed the truth before you were drawn to God, as was I.

That is NOT rejection based on Gods revelation. They reject because THEY LOVED THEIR SIN

Gods revelation is the reason they HAVE NO EXCUSE

19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse,

You want to keep ignoring, that because of Gods revelation THEY ARE WITHOUT EXCUSE?? its there in the passage. Suppressing the truth was not CAUSED or created or forced on them by knowledge.

Their love of sin WAS THE CAUSE.

 

Did God grant to you saving faith as a gift, and if yes, why get credit for it then?