Salvation the Arminian Way

[MennoSota]

John Bunyan was a Calvinist. It's hard to imagine he would have written with an Arminian perspective. Also, read all the scripture he uses and it seems extremely unlikely that there is any Arminian view of salvation presented in Pilgrim's Progress.

 

[tyndale1946]

John Bunyan was a Calvinist. It's hard to imagine he would have written with an Arminian perspective. Also, read all the scripture he uses and it seems extremely unlikely that there is any Arminian view of salvation presented in Pilgrim's Progress.

I agree... John Bunyan the author of "Grace Abounding to The Chief of Sinners"... Wrote Pilgrim's Progress from the perspective of an Arminian view of Salvation?... Read Grace Abounding first then say that... Then rethink your thinking... What do you know I happen to have it in my portfolio... Brother Glen

http://www.chapellibrary.org/files/4813/7642/2821/bun-abounding.pdf

 

[Van]

Thanks, Tyndale1946, for the link. I only skimmed it, but what I read I thought was spot on.

 

[utilyan]

So you don't add infant baptism. You don't add praying to Mary. You don't add purgatory.


What has been made up about God sovereignly choosing?


I agree. But, you teach that the sacrifice has not yet been completed. You teach that Christ is still on the cross and his body and blood are still being poured out in the Eucharist.


Jesus symbolized what his one time sacrifice meant for his disciples and his disciples wrote down the comment for us.

You misunderstand the parable of the Good Samaritan, utilyan.
Do you or I pass by people who are broken and refuse to care? That is the question of the parable.
Your interpretation is just horrible and worthless.
Utilyan, every human is a rebel to God. That would make you and me the robbers in the story, not the ones who have been beaten and left for dead.
You just butchered the parable, utilyan.

Nonsense, then who is the NEIGHBOR? The parable was to explain to that uppity "CHOSEN ELECT" pharisee lawyer who his neighbor was, who expects neighbor to be only those conformed to himself.


"Every Human is a rebel to God" Verse or it is a LIE. I want those exact words and not some ancient admonishment to Israel.



I'm giving you scripture of GOD GIVEN PROPHECY:

Malachi 1

9“But now will you not entreat God’s favor, that He may be gracious to us? With such an offering on your part, will He receive any of you kindly?” says the LORD of hosts. 10“Oh that there were one among you who would shut the gates, that you might not uselessly kindle fire on My altar! I am not pleased with you,” says the LORD of hosts, “nor will I accept an offering from you. 11“For from the rising of the sun even to its setting, My name will be great among the nations, and in every place incense is going to be offered to My name, and a grain offering that is pure; for My name will be great among the nations,” says the LORD of hosts.

If for a minute we Catholic believed we are repeating the sacrifice we would brag about it, but that is not what is happening.



GOD says there is a pure sacrifice to take place in all nations from sun up to sun down.

There is only one pure offering Jesus Christ. So explain how your going to do this?

You say we are not doing it, ok fine. Are you going to do this? NOPE.

Come on, give me the exegesis above. The minute you say anything pure offering is made elsewhere at anytime I'm slamming you with that stupid accusation of "repeating" the sacrifice.

God has declared it is going to happen is he a Liar?

 

[MennoSota]

@ utilyan...
Romans 3:10-18
"As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulcher; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God in their eyes."

Yep. Every human is a rebel to God. The robber, the wretched bandit, the corrupt hater of God.

Indeed, there is only one sacrifice that atones for sin. Yeshua atoned for the sin of his children whom He adopted out of rebellion.

You still have not made your case for interpreting the Good Samaritan as you have done. Why do you make up such an interpretation? Does such a poor interpretation come from the church at Rome or is it your own failed attempt?

 

[Yeshua1]

Nonsense, then who is the NEIGHBOR? The parable was to explain to that uppity "CHOSEN ELECT" pharisee lawyer who his neighbor was, who expects neighbor to be only those conformed to himself.


"Every Human is a rebel to God" Verse or it is a LIE. I want those exact words and not some ancient admonishment to Israel.



I'm giving you scripture of GOD GIVEN PROPHECY:

Malachi 1

9“But now will you not entreat God’s favor, that He may be gracious to us? With such an offering on your part, will He receive any of you kindly?” says the LORD of hosts. 10“Oh that there were one among you who would shut the gates, that you might not uselessly kindle fire on My altar! I am not pleased with you,” says the LORD of hosts, “nor will I accept an offering from you. 11“For from the rising of the sun even to its setting, My name will be great among the nations, and in every place incense is going to be offered to My name, and a grain offering that is pure; for My name will be great among the nations,” says the LORD of hosts.

If for a minute we Catholic believed we are repeating the sacrifice we would brag about it, but that is not what is happening.



GOD says there is a pure sacrifice to take place in all nations from sun up to sun down.

There is only one pure offering Jesus Christ. So explain how your going to do this?

You say we are not doing it, ok fine. Are you going to do this? NOPE.

Come on, give me the exegesis above. The minute you say anything pure offering is made elsewhere at anytime I'm slamming you with that stupid accusation of "repeating" the sacrifice.

God has declared it is going to happen is he a Liar?

If the death of Jesus atoned for ALL sin, why do you need to add more sacramental Grace unto the Cross? that is an abomination to God!

 

[Katarina Von Bora]

@ utilyan...
Romans 3:10-18
"As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat is an open sepulcher; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps is under their lips: Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet are swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery are in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God in their eyes."

Yep. Every human is a rebel to God. The robber, the wretched bandit, the corrupt hater of God.

Indeed, there is only one sacrifice that atones for sin. Yeshua atoned for the sin of his children whom He adopted out of rebellion.

You still have not made your case for interpreting the Good Samaritan as you have done. Why do you make up such an interpretation? Does such a poor interpretation come from the church at Rome or is it your own failed attempt?

Scripture proves you to be correct.

Romans 5:12English Standard Version (ESV)

Death in Adam, Life in Christ

12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned—



Genesis 6:5English Standard Version (ESV)

5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.



Psalm 51:5English Standard Version (ESV)

5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity,
and in sin did my mother conceive me.



Psalm 58:3English Standard Version (ESV)

3 The wicked are estranged from the womb;
they go astray from birth, speaking lies.



Ecclesiastes 9:3English Standard Version (ESV)

3 This is an evil in all that is done under the sun, that the same event happens to all. Also, the hearts of the children of man are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead.



Jeremiah 17:9English Standard Version (ESV)

9 The heart is deceitful above all things,
and desperately sick;
who can understand it?



Romans 3:10-12English Standard Version (ESV)

10 as it is written:

“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”



Isaiah 53:6English Standard Version (ESV)

6 All we like sheep have gone astray;
we have turned—every one—to his own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.



Proverbs 14:12English Standard Version (ESV)

12 There is a way that seems right to a man,
but its end is the way to death.

John 8:43English Standard Version (ESV)

43 Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word.



John 6:44English Standard Version (ESV)

44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.



Romans 8:7English Standard Version (ESV)

7 For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.


God's election is also proved, by the Bible.

John 15:16: "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you."

John 1:12,13: "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."

Acts 13:48: "And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."

Romans 9:15-16: "For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy."

Romans 9:22-24: "What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?"

Ephesians 1:4-5: "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,"

Ephesians 1:11: "In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:"

Philippians 1:29: "For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;"

1 Thessalonians 1:4-5: "Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God. For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake."

2 Thessalonians 2:13: "But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:"

2 Timothy 1:9: "Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,"

Ephesians 2:8-10 - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God

John 6:37 - All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

John 6:44 - 4 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.

1 Peter 1:2 - Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Faith, grace and repentance are gifts bestowed upon us.

God Bless

 

[Yeshua1]

Scripture proves you to be correct.

Romans 5:12English Standard Version (ESV)

Death in Adam, Life in Christ

12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned—



Genesis 6:5English Standard Version (ESV)

5 The Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intention of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.



Psalm 51:5English Standard Version (ESV)

5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity,
and in sin did my mother conceive me.



Psalm 58:3English Standard Version (ESV)

3 The wicked are estranged from the womb;
they go astray from birth, speaking lies.



Ecclesiastes 9:3English Standard Version (ESV)

3 This is an evil in all that is done under the sun, that the same event happens to all. Also, the hearts of the children of man are full of evil, and madness is in their hearts while they live, and after that they go to the dead.



Jeremiah 17:9English Standard Version (ESV)

9 The heart is deceitful above all things,
and desperately sick;
who can understand it?



Romans 3:10-12English Standard Version (ESV)

10 as it is written:

“None is righteous, no, not one;
11 no one understands;
no one seeks for God.
12 All have turned aside; together they have become worthless;
no one does good,
not even one.”



Isaiah 53:6English Standard Version (ESV)

6 All we like sheep have gone astray;
we have turned—every one—to his own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
the iniquity of us all.



Proverbs 14:12English Standard Version (ESV)

12 There is a way that seems right to a man,
but its end is the way to death.

John 8:43English Standard Version (ESV)

43 Why do you not understand what I say? It is because you cannot bear to hear my word.



John 6:44English Standard Version (ESV)

44 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.



Romans 8:7English Standard Version (ESV)

7 For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot.


God's election is also proved, by the Bible.

John 15:16: "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you."

John 1:12,13: "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God."

Acts 13:48: "And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed."

Romans 9:15-16: "For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion. So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy."

Romans 9:22-24: "What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?"

Ephesians 1:4-5: "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,"

Ephesians 1:11: "In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:"

Philippians 1:29: "For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;"

1 Thessalonians 1:4-5: "Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God. For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake."

2 Thessalonians 2:13: "But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:"

2 Timothy 1:9: "Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,"

Ephesians 2:8-10 - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God

John 6:37 - All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

John 6:44 - 4 No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.

1 Peter 1:2 - Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Faith, grace and repentance are gifts bestowed upon us.

God Bless

By god directly, and not thru any Sacraments of grace so called.

 

[Katarina Von Bora]

By god directly, and not thru any Sacraments of grace so called.

Huh?

 

[Calv1]

Well you have misrepresented and God my faith all wrong, How you going to get the bible right you can't even get another man's faith right when he speaks it in your face.

Its sad you have to LIE and make up what I believe to make it sound as wrong as possible.

If God is on your side why rely on satan an LIE?



While I only have to present what you actually believe without embellishment still sounds twice as stupid.


We believe the bible absolutely and we disagree to adding rules that don't exist in the bible.

Namely that it has to be in the bible to be a rule, A rule you made up and not found in scripture.


The Pharisees believed themselves chosen elect.



The Mass does not repeat the sacrifice, and we don't teach salvation by works alone.


Malachi 1

9“But now will you not entreat God’s favor, that He may be gracious to us? With such an offering on your part, will He receive any of you kindly?” says the LORD of hosts. 10“Oh that there were one among you who would shut the gates, that you might not uselessly kindle fire on My altar! I am not pleased with you,” says the LORD of hosts, “nor will I accept an offering from you. 11“For from the rising of the sun even to its setting, My name will be great among the nations, and in every place incense is going to be offered to My name, and a grain offering that is pure; for My name will be great among the nations,” says the LORD of hosts.


Well you already admit you don't do this^. Here is a riddle for you. The only pure offering acceptable to God is Jesus Christ. Now find me the PURE grain offering that is offered to God in all nations with incense on an altar from rise of the sun to setting.


Read it closely, God will not accept any offering from you yet he wants a PURE GRAIN OFFERING.

He doesn't want food either: 7“You are presenting defiled food upon My altar.



That is a done deal. God gives prophecy when nations will offer a pure grain offering from SUN UP to SUN DOWN.

Its getting done right now. How are you going to give a pure grain offering? Jesus Christ is only pure.



The Eucharist of Jesus the bread and wine, Is the scripture Jesus Christ wrote himself. His choice tools of communications. PEOPLE, BREAD and WINE.

But Since you have a disdain and hatred even self hatred of people you spit on Christ's method. You say people can't be trusted, what Jesus Chooses can't be more reliable then the INK AND PAPER that I CHOOSE.

Hiding hatred of people under the umbrella of false humility.



Every soul on earth is one who fell to robbers, Jesus is a good Samaritan who would help each one. Instead you paint a evil Samaritan who skips people.

The question that will echo in heaven coming from God to you will be "WOW, you really thought I was that evil?"

You insult God acting like a abused child who got a lucky break. You insult God by sin always blaming it on the "sin nature" , in short "God's fault".


I could not insult God more then Calvinism if I tried. A lump of mud would be a better god then calvinism's idea.

I lie not. You do not know your Theology. Read Vatican 2, it even states if the "Pope believes that of a devil we shall follow him first".

Yeah you'll object, call names, but it does, just read it. The Church of Rome is no Church, it's a large Cult that has nothing in common with Holy Scripture.

Read Vatican 2 in full, then come back and we can talk with you slightly informed.

 

[Calv1]

So you don't add infant baptism. You don't add praying to Mary. You don't add purgatory.


What has been made up about God sovereignly choosing?


I agree. But, you teach that the sacrifice has not yet been completed. You teach that Christ is still on the cross and his body and blood are still being poured out in the Eucharist.


Jesus symbolized what his one time sacrifice meant for his disciples and his disciples wrote down the comment for us.

You misunderstand the parable of the Good Samaritan, utilyan.
Do you or I pass by people who are broken and refuse to care? That is the question of the parable.
Your interpretation is just horrible and worthless.
Utilyan, every human is a rebel to God. That would make you and me the robbers in the story, not the ones who have been beaten and left for dead.
You just butchered the parable, utilyan.

No Protestant can go to Mass. Not only do Church of Rome adherents rarely understand it, but most "Protestants" don't, you my friend clearly do.

Where Hebrews says "He has with ONE OFFERING perfected FOR ALL TIME those who believe", the Church of Rome still wants the control. The do not believe this, actually this is their process of salvation.

Baptism, by this sacrament they are made "Perfect", note not by Christ and His sacrifice, but by the SACRAMENT IN THE CHURCH, so if you're Baptist you lost. Now you go forward and do not SIN. If you sin, you need what they call "Merits", so if it's a venial sin they can maybe say a few Hail Mary's (By the way do you know where this heresy comes from? It's from a Variant in the Latin Vulgate, where it says in Luke "Mary full of MERIT"), so they pray to Mary and other Saints, why? The reason is that these Saints, say Ignatius, so evidently he did so many good things, say a human needs 100 merits to enter Heaven, well He gained say 1000, so surely he has extra that he can give to us, so they pray to saints in order to receive Merits. They receive merits through giving money to the Church, and many other acts.

The "Mass" is simply a repeat of the OT Sacrificial system. Once a year in the OT the High Priest would as you all know lay his hands on one, that is transferring the sins of the people so to speak onto the one, and the scapegoat would be let go, however THIS DID NOT REMOVE SIN, it was to make the people AWARE OF SIN, and elicit broken hearts. Well the Roman Church has brought Christ forth as a continually lamb to be slain, weekly.

Why do you think they believe the bread turns into a literal body, and the wine into literal blood. First Christ NEVER MEANT IT THAT WAY TO BEGIN WITH! When He said "Eat my body, drink my blood" etc. He was not talking about us being Zombies, He was using OT terms to refer to FAITH, anyone familiar with the OT would know this, we are to feed on the Lord, drink in His blood, focus, believe totally on what He did on the cross, this is the only way of salvation, "What WORK shall that Father have me do", "Here is the work of the Father, BELIEVE ON THE ONE HE SENT" with a period at the end. This WHORE called the Roman Church is nothing of Christendom, and if someone say "Mike chill out", I say "Read Vatican 2, you'll be SHOCKED at what they believe, will make you sick".

They believe each week Christ is CRUCIFIED AGAIN FOR THEM, this is why they can drink His blood, eat His body, He just died again. It is SO PAGAN, as I say no part of the Christian Church. There is a excellent movie out that traces the Roman Church from Constantine, who persecuted those like us who believed scripture's "Faith Alone", he was really the first Pope, and it grew from there, a sick lineage of men believing themselves and their teaching higher than God Himself. If the Protestant Church actually knew what Rome believed they would be shocked, and not fellowship with them.

 

[Katarina Von Bora]

No Protestant can go to Mass. Not only do Church of Rome adherents rarely understand it, but most "Protestants" don't, you my friend clearly do.

Where Hebrews says "He has with ONE OFFERING perfected FOR ALL TIME those who believe", the Church of Rome still wants the control. The do not believe this, actually this is their process of salvation.

Baptism, by this sacrament they are made "Perfect", note not by Christ and His sacrifice, but by the SACRAMENT IN THE CHURCH, so if you're Baptist you lost. Now you go forward and do not SIN. If you sin, you need what they call "Merits", so if it's a venial sin they can maybe say a few Hail Mary's (By the way do you know where this heresy comes from? It's from a Variant in the Latin Vulgate, where it says in Luke "Mary full of MERIT"), so they pray to Mary and other Saints, why? The reason is that these Saints, say Ignatius, so evidently he did so many good things, say a human needs 100 merits to enter Heaven, well He gained say 1000, so surely he has extra that he can give to us, so they pray to saints in order to receive Merits. They receive merits through giving money to the Church, and many other acts.

The "Mass" is simply a repeat of the OT Sacrificial system. Once a year in the OT the High Priest would as you all know lay his hands on one, that is transferring the sins of the people so to speak onto the one, and the scapegoat would be let go, however THIS DID NOT REMOVE SIN, it was to make the people AWARE OF SIN, and elicit broken hearts. Well the Roman Church has brought Christ forth as a continually lamb to be slain, weekly.

Why do you think they believe the bread turns into a literal body, and the wine into literal blood. First Christ NEVER MEANT IT THAT WAY TO BEGIN WITH! When He said "Eat my body, drink my blood" etc. He was not talking about us being Zombies, He was using OT terms to refer to FAITH, anyone familiar with the OT would know this, we are to feed on the Lord, drink in His blood, focus, believe totally on what He did on the cross, this is the only way of salvation, "What WORK shall that Father have me do", "Here is the work of the Father, BELIEVE ON THE ONE HE SENT" with a period at the end. This WHORE called the Roman Church is nothing of Christendom, and if someone say "Mike chill out", I say "Read Vatican 2, you'll be SHOCKED at what they believe, will make you sick".

They believe each week Christ is CRUCIFIED AGAIN FOR THEM, this is why they can drink His blood, eat His body, He just died again. It is SO PAGAN, as I say no part of the Christian Church. There is a excellent movie out that traces the Roman Church from Constantine, who persecuted those like us who believed scripture's "Faith Alone", he was really the first Pope, and it grew from there, a sick lineage of men believing themselves and their teaching higher than God Himself. If the Protestant Church actually knew what Rome believed they would be shocked, and not fellowship with them.

Amen.

Short video on the value of giving money for salvation.

So according to Catholics money buys salvation.

God Bless

 

[Yeshua1]

Huh?

I was reaffirming your post on real salvation, as Grace comes to us by God directly, thru and by the Cross, and not thru any so called sacrament of the Church of rome!

 

[Calv1]

OK, you wrote:


My question is where did you get that quote? If it wasn't from a sermon, did you get it from his Sword and Trowel, or what?

From reading him for over a decade. Tell you what, why don't you actually READ HIM SO YOU CAN SEE YOURSELF. Tired of doing work for lazy people.

 

[Calv1]

I believe that salvation the Arminian way is also outlined in the Pilgrims Progress

1. The start of the journey - The invitation to revival by an anointed evangelist (noting that the anointing is not ego)
2.The Wicket Gate - Salvation through a profession in Christ Jesus
3. The Interpreters House - The revival - With it's bible preaching and anointed music...

And if the revival is good the Christ will be received, just like the story of GC Rankin given in the OP....

Now I saw in my dream, that the highway up which Christian was to go, was fenced on either side with a wall, and that wall was called Salvation. [isa. 26:1] Up this way, therefore, did burdened Christian run, but not without great difficulty, because of the load on his back.

He ran thus till he came at a place somewhat ascending, and upon that place stood a cross, and a little below, in the bottom, a sepulchre. So I saw in my dream, that just as Christian came up with the cross, his burden loosed from off his shoulders, and fell from off his back, and began to tumble, and so continued to do, till it came to the mouth of the sepulchre, where it fell in, and I saw it no more.

Then was Christian glad and lightsome, and said, with a merry heart, "He hath given me rest by his sorrow, and life by his death." Then he stood still awhile to look and wonder; for it was very surprising to him, that the sight of the cross should thus ease him of his burden. He looked therefore, and looked again, even till the springs that were in his head sent the waters down his cheeks. [Zech. 12:10] Now, as he stood looking and weeping (noting the emotion and hurrah), behold three Shining Ones came to him and saluted him with "Peace be unto thee". So the first said to him, "Thy sins be forgiven thee" [Mark 2:5]; the second stripped him of his rags, and clothed him with change of raiment [Zech. 3:4]; the third also set a mark on his forehead, and gave him a roll with a seal upon it, which he bade him look on as he ran, and that he should give it in at the Celestial Gate. [Eph. 1:13] So they went their way. - The Pilgrims Progress

Oh please, Bunyon would have called you a heretic to your face! Bunyon was a rock ribbed Calvinist, do you not even know why he was in prison 12 years? I'll tell you, for preaching Reformed Theology, at the time it was outlawed in favor of your liberal Theology. People that believe what you believe wanted him jailed.

 

[Calv1]

For the salvation to be picked up in these methods two things must accompany the revival...

1. The Spirit - Must be sensed in the service
2. The Word - Must be preached by an anointed Man of God

Much like the ministry teams....

1. DL Moody and Ira Sankey
2. Billy Sunday and Homer Rodeheaver
3. Billy Graham and GB Shea

These are the two trumpets of the book of Numbers!

Is that scammer still around? Geez RW! Schamrock is a con man of old, right up there with Robert Tilton.

First "Revival" has nothing to do with salvation, Revival, IE "Reformed Revival", which is what's happening right now is a return to the true faith of our fathers, thought he word can be used in the sense of reviving someone, it's not used in reference to salvation, but a return to a belief.

Second, the Holy Spirit need not be sensed, scripture please? You can't for that's made up on TBN. Second the man of God does not have to be anointed, man can and is saved without any preaching whatsoever.

Here is the process of regeneration. One, the Father draws a person John 6:44, that is the Holy Spirit, through Christs life and death for that elect person, takes abode in their heart. It's also referred to in other terms, "I will take out their heart of stone,and put in a heart of flesh". Regeneration proceeds faith. "And ALL that were APPOINTED to eternal life...........(pause) believed. After we are filled with the Holy Spirit, whether we experience His presence or not, we now have the ability and desire to believe. This is what God's word teaches, anything else is man made heresy.

 

[Calv1]

Well you have misrepresented and God my faith all wrong, How you going to get the bible right you can't even get another man's faith right when he speaks it in your face.

Its sad you have to LIE and make up what I believe to make it sound as wrong as possible.

If God is on your side why rely on satan an LIE?



While I only have to present what you actually believe without embellishment still sounds twice as stupid.


We believe the bible absolutely and we disagree to adding rules that don't exist in the bible.

Namely that it has to be in the bible to be a rule, A rule you made up and not found in scripture.


The Pharisees believed themselves chosen elect.



The Mass does not repeat the sacrifice, and we don't teach salvation by works alone.


Malachi 1

9“But now will you not entreat God’s favor, that He may be gracious to us? With such an offering on your part, will He receive any of you kindly?” says the LORD of hosts. 10“Oh that there were one among you who would shut the gates, that you might not uselessly kindle fire on My altar! I am not pleased with you,” says the LORD of hosts, “nor will I accept an offering from you. 11“For from the rising of the sun even to its setting, My name will be great among the nations, and in every place incense is going to be offered to My name, and a grain offering that is pure; for My name will be great among the nations,” says the LORD of hosts.


Well you already admit you don't do this^. Here is a riddle for you. The only pure offering acceptable to God is Jesus Christ. Now find me the PURE grain offering that is offered to God in all nations with incense on an altar from rise of the sun to setting.


Read it closely, God will not accept any offering from you yet he wants a PURE GRAIN OFFERING.

He doesn't want food either: 7“You are presenting defiled food upon My altar.



That is a done deal. God gives prophecy when nations will offer a pure grain offering from SUN UP to SUN DOWN.

Its getting done right now. How are you going to give a pure grain offering? Jesus Christ is only pure.



The Eucharist of Jesus the bread and wine, Is the scripture Jesus Christ wrote himself. His choice tools of communications. PEOPLE, BREAD and WINE.

But Since you have a disdain and hatred even self hatred of people you spit on Christ's method. You say people can't be trusted, what Jesus Chooses can't be more reliable then the INK AND PAPER that I CHOOSE.

Hiding hatred of people under the umbrella of false humility.



Every soul on earth is one who fell to robbers, Jesus is a good Samaritan who would help each one. Instead you paint a evil Samaritan who skips people.

The question that will echo in heaven coming from God to you will be "WOW, you really thought I was that evil?"

You insult God acting like a abused child who got a lucky break. You insult God by sin always blaming it on the "sin nature" , in short "God's fault".


I could not insult God more then Calvinism if I tried. A lump of mud would be a better god then calvinism's idea.

That's blasphemy, no Spirit filled man can say such a thing. You are unable to understand for the Spirit is not in you. Find others to blather to, you make no sense, you're embarrassing yourself, and I refuse to speak to willing blasphemers of Almighty God, this is no game.

 

[Calv1]

Amen.

Short video on the value of giving money for salvation.

So according to Catholics money buys salvation.

God Bless

Right, and if there are brothers who think "Well that was the past", read Vatican 2, trust me the Reformation is STILL ON! The Roman Church is fighting yet we've laid down our arms, let us hoist them in the word of the living God.

 

[rockytopva]

Is that scammer still around? Geez RW! Schamrock is a con man of old, right up there with Robert Tilton.

First "Revival" has nothing to do with salvation, Revival, IE "Reformed Revival", which is what's happening right now is a return to the true faith of our fathers, thought he word can be used in the sense of reviving someone, it's not used in reference to salvation, but a return to a belief.

Second, the Holy Spirit need not be sensed, scripture please? You can't for that's made up on TBN. Second the man of God does not have to be anointed, man can and is saved without any preaching whatsoever.

Here is the process of regeneration. One, the Father draws a person John 6:44, that is the Holy Spirit, through Christs life and death for that elect person, takes abode in their heart. It's also referred to in other terms, "I will take out their heart of stone,and put in a heart of flesh". Regeneration proceeds faith. "And ALL that were APPOINTED to eternal life...........(pause) believed. After we are filled with the Holy Spirit, whether we experience His presence or not, we now have the ability and desire to believe. This is what God's word teaches, anything else is man made heresy.

And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power: That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God. - 1 Corinthians 2:4-5

Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory: - 1 Peter 1:8

"ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory"

I heard of a man who got saved and went to visit the first church he could find. He was so thrilled of what God did for him, and when he went in the preacher started to preaching, and he started shouting, "Well Glory!" Everybody in there their heads came around, who is that making all that noise? One of the ushers came down and said you have got to stop that noise, you can't make that noise in here. Preacher started preaching again and he said, "Hallelujah!" User came around and grabbed him by the shoulder, "You have got to get out of here man!" He said, "But I got religion!" The usher replies, "You didn't get it in here!"

God knows that the truth! Some of those places you can here a mouse talk! But if God does something for you, you cant hold your peace, the trees will cry out! - RW Schambach @8:40 in the video below...

 

[rockytopva]

9 And Absalom met the servants of David. And Absalom rode upon a mule, and the mule went under the thick boughs of a great oak, and his head caught hold of the oak, and he was taken up between the heaven and the earth; and the mule that was under him went away.
10 And a certain man saw it, and told Joab, and said, Behold, I saw Absalom hanged in an oak.
11 And Joab said unto the man that told him, And, behold, thou sawest him, and why didst thou not smite him there to the ground? and I would have given thee ten shekels of silver, and a girdle.
12 And the man said unto Joab, Though I should receive a thousand shekels of silver in mine hand, yet would I not put forth mine hand against the king's son: for in our hearing the king charged thee and Abishai and Ittai, saying, Beware that none touch the young man Absalom.
13 Otherwise I should have wrought falsehood against mine own life: for there is no matter hid from the king, and thou thyself wouldest have set thyself against me.
14 Then said Joab, I may not tarry thus with thee. And he took three darts in his hand, and thrust them through the heart of Absalom, while he was yet alive in the midst of the oak.
15 And ten young men that bare Joab's armour compassed about and smote Absalom, and slew him.
16 And Joab blew the trumpet, and the people returned from pursuing after Israel: for Joab held back the people. - 2 Samuel 18

And the mule walked on.... In the 1800's Virginia experienced revival with circuit riders as described in the OP. In the 1900's Virginia experienced revival in like methods, this time with evangelists. There is nothing that I would consider 'revival' here in the 2000's... Could the mule have walked on leaving our heads stuck in some enormous doctrinal tree?