Satan’s plan for “the Quelle lie”

[stilllearning]

Scripture has established that Satan is a liar(the father of liars), and his plan has always been the same from the very first words SCRIPTURE records him saying.......
“....Yea, hath God said,.????” (Genesis 3:1)

All Satan has to do is cast doubt upon God’s Word, so that people are fooled into not completely trusting it.
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Then here comes the Quelle lie, that tells us that those used BY GOD to give us the Bible, didn’t really get what they wrote from the Holy Spirit, but from man’s recollection of what Jesus supposedly said!

And the fact that the Quelle factor, has NO WRITTEN DOCUMENTATION at all, doesn’t seem to make any difference.
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This is Satan’s same old lie that he used on Eve: And today, millions are swallowing it hook line and sinker! (And some are even willing to DEFEND IT!?!)

 

[preachinjesus]

The dictation theory of inspiration, which I guess if what you're supporting, is simply unreliable and difficult to find grounds for when one does a complete and honest study of the Bible. We can be fully evangelical, fully orthodox, and fully faithful to the biblical text and still dismiss the dictation theory of inspiration.

 

[stilllearning]

The dictation theory of inspiration, which I guess if what you're supporting, is simply unreliable and difficult to find grounds for when one does a complete and honest study of the Bible. We can be fully evangelical, fully orthodox, and fully faithful to the biblical text and still dismiss the dictation theory of inspiration.

Calling “Verbal inspiration” the “dictation theory”: Is like calling “Eternal security” .. “Once saved always saved”!

Therefore, “The dictation theory” is a fact, because it is the only way to have Verbal inspiration.
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And even though some would ask, why we can see Paul’s or John’s “style of writing” in the letters God gave them, if every word is from the Lord?
Only testifies how little we understand about the LORD.....
“O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable [are] his judgments, and his ways past finding out!” (Romans 11:33)
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God’s Word can be trusted, regardless of what ANYBODY says about it.

 

[Greektim]

Calling “Verbal inspiration” the “dictation theory”: Is like calling “Eternal security” .. “Once saved always saved”!

Therefore, “The dictation theory” is a fact, because it is the only way to have Verbal inspiration.
------------------------
And even though some would ask, why we can see Paul’s or John’s “style of writing” in the letters God gave them, if every word is from the Lord?
Only testifies how little we understand about the LORD.....
“O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable [are] his judgments, and his ways past finding out!” (Romans 11:33)
------------------------
God’s Word can be trusted, regardless of what ANYBODY says about it.

You can't debate with someone like this. You can't even have a rational dialogue. You are the quintessential example of the mental in fundamental (although I like to poke da fun at you as well).

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

You can't debate with someone like this. You can't even have a rational dialogue. You are the quintessential example of the mental in fundamental (although I like to poke da fun at you as well).

Is that your attempt at an insult?

 

[12strings]

Is that your attempt at an insult?

When you get a greek academic trying to make puns in english...It's not going to be pretty.:laugh:

 

[MB]

The dictation theory of inspiration, which I guess if what you're supporting, is simply unreliable and difficult to find grounds for when one does a complete and honest study of the Bible. We can be fully evangelical, fully orthodox, and fully faithful to the biblical text and still dismiss the dictation theory of inspiration.

Well you can make that claim but just claiming it doesn't make it so. The only reason I can think of is the doubt.
MB

 

[12strings]

Well you can make that claim but just claiming it doesn't make it so. The only reason I can think of is the doubt.
MB

Another reason: because the bible itself points to other methods:
-Dictation: 10 Commandments, John's letters to the 7 Churches in Revelation
-Investigating the facts (Luke 1)
-Paul's personal account of his desire to be cursed if it would save others (Rom. 8)
-Different personal styles of writing (Gospels, Paul's letters).
-David's psalms point to some human input, otherwise they are not really David's psalms at all.
-Solomon says he is writing based on what he has observed and experienced (Ecclesiastes...should we not believe him, and say he is not really speaking from experience but only dictating what God told him to write?)

 

[Baptist Believer]

Another reason: because the bible itself points to other methods:
-Dictation: 10 Commandments, John's letters to the 7 Churches in Revelation
-Investigating the facts (Luke 1)
-Paul's personal account of his desire to be cursed if it would save others (Rom. 8)
-Different personal styles of writing (Gospels, Paul's letters).
-David's psalms point to some human input, otherwise they are not really David's psalms at all.
-Solomon says he is writing based on what he has observed and experienced (Ecclesiastes...should we not believe him, and say he is not really speaking from experience but only dictating what God told him to write?)

No, NO, NO!

You're not supposed to read the Bible, you're just supposed to believe things about it!

 

[Jack Matthews]

Therefore, “The dictation theory” is a fact, because it is the only way to have Verbal inspiration.

Not necessarily. God clearly led the individual writers, but they wrote in distinctive and clearly differing styles. Verbal inspiration simply means that God was directly involved in the process, and that the wording used by the authors was the result of their intellect submitted to the Holy Spirit. Dictation would have produced work without distinctive writing styles.

 

[Yeshua1]

Not necessarily. God clearly led the individual writers, but they wrote in distinctive and clearly differing styles. Verbal inspiration simply means that God was directly involved in the process, and that the wording used by the authors was the result of their intellect submitted to the Holy Spirit. Dictation would have produced work without distinctive writing styles.

Correct! It refers to the fact that the Holy spriti allowed each author to write down as he would express Himself, using sources, eyewitnesses, etc, but that he made sure that what got written was fully accurate !

 

[Greektim]

Not necessarily. God clearly led the individual writers, but they wrote in distinctive and clearly differing styles. Verbal inspiration simply means that God was directly involved in the process, and that the wording used by the authors was the result of their intellect submitted to the Holy Spirit. Dictation would have produced work without distinctive writing styles.

That was put gently. I would have said "not remotely" in regards to the completely fallacious claim "'dictation theory'... is the only way to have verbal inspiration."

 

[MB]

Another reason: because the bible itself points to other methods:
-Dictation: 10 Commandments, John's letters to the 7 Churches in Revelation
-Investigating the facts (Luke 1)
-Paul's personal account of his desire to be cursed if it would save others (Rom. 8)
-Different personal styles of writing (Gospels, Paul's letters).
-David's psalms point to some human input, otherwise they are not really David's psalms at all.
-Solomon says he is writing based on what he has observed and experienced (Ecclesiastes...should we not believe him, and say he is not really speaking from experience but only dictating what God told him to write?)

Yet nothing about a document given to Matthew or Luke Admittedly Luke wasn't a disciple but actually a friend of Paul none the less a devout Christian and desiring to share with others the knowledge he had as He wrote to Theophilous. Nothing there to say Luke wasn't inspired by God just as any missionary or preacher would be. To say they weren't inspired is to say not one minister was ever inspired by God. To be inspired is to be directed.
MB

 

[Mexdeaf]

Another reason: because the bible itself points to other methods:
-Dictation: 10 Commandments, John's letters to the 7 Churches in Revelation
-Investigating the facts (Luke 1)
-Paul's personal account of his desire to be cursed if it would save others (Rom. 8)
-Different personal styles of writing (Gospels, Paul's letters).
-David's psalms point to some human input, otherwise they are not really David's psalms at all.
-Solomon says he is writing based on what he has observed and experienced (Ecclesiastes...should we not believe him, and say he is not really speaking from experience but only dictating what God told him to write?)

:applause::thumbs:

 

[Mexdeaf]

Hebrews 11:1,2

Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets, 2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.

Numbers 12:6

And he said, “Hear my words: If there is a prophet among you, I the Lord make myself known to him in a vision; I speak with him in a dream."

Numbers 12:8

With him I speak mouth to mouth, clearly, and not in riddles, and he beholds the form of the Lord. Why then were you not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?

Acts 1:16

“Brothers, the Scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit spoke beforehand by the mouth of David concerning Judas, who became a guide to those who arrested Jesus.

The fundamental theory of inspiration has almost always been that of Verbal Plenary Inspiration. Those who hold to the Dictation model are in the (very small) minority.

 

[stilllearning]

Hello Jack Matthews

You said.......

“God clearly led the individual writers, but they wrote in distinctive and clearly differing styles. Verbal inspiration simply means that God was directly involved in the process, and that the wording used by the authors was the result of their intellect submitted to the Holy Spirit. Dictation would have produced work without distinctive writing styles."

This is almost exactly the way that I have explained Verbal inspiration(the dictation theory);
i.e.

“the wording used by the authors was the result of their intellect submitted to the Holy Spirit”

Of course the way I put it is....
“The Holy Spirit chose the words and phrases to use from the vocabulary of each individual writer.”

verbal (adjective)
Abbr. vb.
1.Of, relating to, or associated with words:
2.Concerned with words only rather than with content or ideas:
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But lets not forget the point of the OP.......Satan’s plan for “the Quelle lie”.

The Quelle lie takes this entire process out of the Holy Spirit’s hands.

 

[quantumfaith]

Hello Jack Matthews

You said.......


This is almost exactly the way that I have explained Verbal inspiration(the dictation theory);
i.e.
Of course the way I put it is....
“The Holy Spirit chose the words and phrases to use from the vocabulary of each individual writer.”

verbal (adjective)
Abbr. vb.
1.Of, relating to, or associated with words:
2.Concerned with words only rather than with content or ideas:
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But lets not forget the point of the OP.......Satan’s plan for “the Quelle lie”.

The Quelle lie takes this entire process out of the Holy Spirit’s hands.

How do you know, if in fact Q exists or existed, that it was not part of God's method of scripture transmission?

 

[stilllearning]

How do you know, if in fact Q exists or existed, that it was not part of God's method of scripture transmission?

Your question answers itself.........

“........if in fact Q exists or existed,..........”

God’s Word is “CLEAR” about HOW God gave it to us.........
“For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake [as they were] moved by the Holy Ghost.” (2 Peter 1:21)

Part of having faith in God’s Word, is believing the CLEAR CUT WAY, that God tells about us how He gave it to us.

 

[Mexdeaf]

Your question answers itself.........

God’s Word is “CLEAR” about HOW God gave it to us.........
“For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake [as they were] moved by the Holy Ghost.” (2 Peter 1:21)

Part of having faith in God’s Word, is believing the CLEAR CUT WAY, that God tells about us how He gave it to us.

Seems we have mixed up inspiration and preservation in this discussion. They are two different animals.

 

[stilllearning]

Seems we have mixed up inspiration and preservation in this discussion. They are two different animals.

How do you mean?